1.5 million sq ft commercial, 3 people and 1 vortex

[steve frasier]

do you think you could do it in one year with some furniture moving which is mostly school desks

what would you bid it at to get it

I know $.05 per sq ft will get

hook up to the building water supply and apo on site

no hose run over 300' and has to be HWE, no portables

a lot of volume

would you do it, what you you pay the workers

what do you think your profit would be, which includes the cost of the vortex

6 hour of cleaning time per day 5 days per week

average 1,000 sq ft per hour

average 6,000 sq ft per day

average 30,000 per week

52 weeks per year makes a little over 1.5 million sq ft average

25,200 gallons of diesel, cost $78,000

could your profit actually be half of the costs

 

[Mikey P]

Would bore me silly.


Mindless chimp work for sure.

 

[Guest]

How nice of a job do you have to do?? Run some first step and 3 TI wands and call it done with 4 chimps and yourself?





Chad

 

[Guest]

Your numbers are pretty low too...


One can crank out better numbers after you have someone doing set ups...

If each guy cant turn 1,000 feet per hose doing a spray and suck times 3 hoses, somethings wrong.

18,000-30,000 sq a night.


You could have some no brainers moving desks for the wanders too. Then you overseeing the whole thing.


7 people on the job. 3 in the truck, You and 3 in the Suburban.

The key is being a good boss with lots of garden hose. A cooler full of pop with some sandwiches every night from Subway wouldn't hurt either.


Chad

 

[steve frasier]

one guy assists the 2 guys that are cleaning, move fans, desk, etc

500 sq ft per hour per wand doing above average job

knowing the logistics ahead of time, I don't think you could schedule that much sq ft every night, some nights yes, most nights no

due to noise factor, most cleaning would have to stop at 9 pm

above listed figures are a worst case scenario

I am one of the best bosses you will ever find

 

[Jeremy]

Sounds like you need another truck. Do you have any buddies that wouldn't mind helping out a few days a week? VLM is not an option I take it? With the 7 man crew mentioned above you could hae it done in a lot less time.

 

[Rex Tyus]

Steve,

Make sure you crunch your numbers with much scrutiny. Cleaning carpet in schools is a hard way to make money. They are often the most neglected carpets you will find. .05 a square foot is not enough. Their are too many variables. I can give you some personal experience on this if you are interested. Call me after 2:00 cst today @ 850-482-6272.

 

[Scott Rogers]

"6 hour of cleaning time per day 5 days per week

average 1,000 sq ft per hour

average 6,000 sq ft per day"

300 bucks for 6-8 hours of work??? You will lose money at that rate. You either need to increase production or the rate.

Do you know your true cost of doing business including factoring in equipment replacement?

 

[Jim Martin]

something to think about that just happened this last year here in Tucson

One of our school districts called up a hand full of carpet cleaning companies to give bids on all there schools and faculty's in there district.

As normal like most when the bids all came back they went with low ball Larry..............

The thing about schools is that they have alot of maps hanging on walls, book, all types of things like this

The company hooks up and before they could finish 1/3 of all the buildings they are in a major law suit with the school district.........

seems all the "steam" ruined alot of there things...................

From what I understand about this little story is that the school district was smarter than low ball Larry and had already warned him that this is something that may happen ????

just something to consider...........

 

[Jimmy L]

16 inch Castex wands all around!

Most areas will require a solution on back stroke only.

I hope its all on one floor!


Jeremy! VLM is not an option he said!

They want it clean!.............not covered up!

Shoot for 8 cents a sqft.

 

[DavidVB]

The business model taught at SFS by Chuck Violand said labor costs should be at 23 - 25% of gross. I've seen others recommend a similar figure and I find it to be solid.

1000 sq.ft per hour at .05 is 50.00 per hour. At 25% for labor you would have 12.50 per hour to divide among your 3 people.

If you keep the wand moving, 1000 sq.ft. an hour should be realistic unless the schools are bouncing you around. Take your labor percentage up to 30% and you would have 30.00 for all three. Get up to .07 / sq.ft. and you would have 42.00 for all three.

 

[Greenie]

The answer to me is clear...faster production, or go home.

I hope it's not too dirty, cause no time for a second wet pass let alone a third one, might not even be time for a dry pass, you are just going through the motions, making it "cleaner" than when you started.

I hear Clean-it emulsifier, 650 psi, glided 16" wand and some fairly decent wand jockeys and hose monkeys to keep ever thing flowing.

If it's fairly soiled, I hope you have a 20" rotary and prespray budgeted in to help the teams to keep moving at 1000 sq/hr.

 

[Audra]

You said 1.5 mi sf & only .05c sf ???

Total:
1.5 Mil sf x .05c sf = $75,000

Vortex or AT cost = $80k - $90k depending on options

Where would you make money??? I must be missing something.

--------------------------
Would not do or bid on this type of work...stick to our high end clients!!! :wink:

 

[Jack May]

A few questions,

Have you really done any sums before posting? Because you're job charge of 1.5m @ 0.05c is $3000 LESS than your estimate fuel charge!!!!!







Anyway, here's a few questions if you want to look at this seriously...

Do you already have a V/AT?

Do you already have enough work for one to make repayments and make money during the day?

Can you double shift the VAT?

If you answered yes to the last two, then I say add up your expenses and put it in with minimal margin on the expense. The contract will pay for the VAT, the fuel, the chems and the labour and maybe if you're lucky 5-10% in your pocket at the end of the year.

PROVIDED you have enough work to work it during the day and make the cream, otherwise there are easier ways to go broke with less effort and less stress.

I've done this a few times when I've wanted a bit of machinery but couldn't justify it on 'normal' running of the business. Wait until a suitable large job came up, price for expenses and part or all of the equipment cost (and remain competitive) and run the job at a smaller margin than normal but I get that machine and mostly or all paid off on the first job and then from there on, its making good money for me.

Even by your own calculations, it doesn't show a good option. As said above, lift the charges or the production rates.

Also as Richard said, factor in dinner a few times a week, it'll do wonder for your staff morale. I think of myself as a good boss and if we have a team working late, we'll through pizza/subway/whatever for tea.

John

 

[steve frasier]

LMAO

I wonder how may would actually break out the calculator

I know some one who is actually thinking they can do it, told him he was crazy/stupid

I worked as a carpet cleaner for this school district many years ago before they tossed out the union employees so I kind of know what the conditions are but it is basically a straight Ti wand pulled with emulisfer

 

[JaminT]

You can't clean ANY carpet with ANY truckmounted unit for .05/sq.ft. and not lose your shirt. Maybe if you hire illegal immigrants for .50 an hour and use a machine that is extremely fuel efficient. This is the type of question some of my customers ask me that just makes me shake my head. We actually had one guy bragging to us that he "stole" this job out from under his competition, by charging .05/sq.ft. This was an almost identical situation to what you are describing, except he was using 2 smaller TMs, rather than a V/AT. He is pretty much out of business now...

 

[Greenie]

Nothing like extracting at shampoo rates.

 

[harryhides]

Yes it can be done but only under certain conditions. Usually if the wall to wall size is 10,000 the actual cleanable surface is a lot less. And the soiled area even less than that.
How many set up and break downs is critical.
How much time will be needed to move furniture?
How much gum and stain removal is involved ?
How many months before the first check arrives, can you finance this ?
If it's night work do you want your V/AT out at night unsupervised ?

Three men on two wands, one to handle hoses allows all three to switch off from the wand for a while, can do 3,000 per hour, no problem. Thats 15,000
per night = $750, enough to pay for gas, chems and labour.

But I would bid a bit higher, regardless and a lot higher if I didn't like the answers to the above questions. Speaking from experience here.

 

[Rex Tyus]

I realize this thread is mute at this point since Steve let us in on his prank.

However just in case a newcomer is considering extracting a large volume of cgd with a 16" wand hoping for greater production,



DON"T. you can actually cover more ground with a properly engineered and glided 14" wand because of its greater maneuverability.

The 16" is fine for hacking out rentals, if you don't care about cresting, or simply don't know when it happens.

Rex Tyus

Owner of too damn many wands

 

[Greenie]

Damn... so much for my tribute to Jimmy's 16" wand.

I've actually had more than a few say they use a 12" on some problematic glue downs because at least they weren't overlapping the puddles, and in the end it was faster and left a more uniform extraction.

But I agree the 14" is the king.

 

[Rex Tyus]

I actually have a couple of 12" headed cast aluminum 1.75" shafted hole glided wands for those washboard type glue downs, but after using the Greenhorn it has to be HORRID for me to pull them out. The 14" is the sweet spot 99.8% of the time.

Rex

 

[Guest]

Bane baby...No fuel bill.


Vince and Terry win. Ask Bill Bane to cut you a deal on some cold water soup!


Chad

 

[Greenie]

He said no portables.

 

[steve frasier]

Not a prank.
Many years ago I worked for this school district and we cleaned about 1.6 to 1.7 million sq ft each year with 2 pro chem 405 performers and 3 people

Me and Drew were discussing this late last night because of a guy we know named Matt. He really wants this gig. Told him he was crazy. He recently went back to work for them and they offered his this thing kind of back door. So I think some where Matt's numbers are wrong but he thinks he has it all worked out

I wrote LMAO because late last night I was to tired to figure out in my head if it was worth $75,000 or $750,000. So when I got home I posted it and went to bed. Woke up thinking why didn't I get out the calculator. I was laughing at the situation and me not thinking of grabbing the calculator when I got home

Matt told us it was worth $750,000 I just couldn't figure out where

I didn't go back to work for them, I am just waiting for my fat lawsuit check from them. At least I hope it is fat after the lawyer takes his cut,LOL