Adjuster Issues Please help

[Sticky]

I have been duking it out with an insurance adjuster. I was wondering if you guys charge for Supervisor Remediation? I had this on my bill and he said that Serv Pro doesn't charge him for that and its an exactimate BS charge....Is this a legitimate charge or not?

This guy is a stickler and is breaking my balls about everything.

 

[Mike Hogan]

Rob..........stand your ground. If I get an adjuster like this,I tell him" live by Xactimate,die by Xactimate.
It is a guide created and priced by the insurance business.Tell he he can't cherry pick line items.......period.

As far as Servpro,I need to laugh.They overscope their jobs to make money.I was with an organization that
had reps from Servpro involved in it. They said they couldn't survive without adding extra eqpt. on a job.

Also tell him you don't do Servpro type work.......hence your requirement of a supervisor.
Bottom line........it is your ass on the grill,not the adjusters. I always attempt to get the adjuster
involved asap. I get to feel him out. If he gives me crap,I send over a hold harmless letter,absolving
me of any liabilities that may occur by the insurance co. not allowing me to follow industry standards.
I still have not received a signed agreement from any adjuster when it's his ass on the line.

I also let him know I have the insureds credit card on file as well as a signed contract,fight it out
with them. After a few irate calls from the insured most will back down.

 

[Sticky]

Is there someone willing to look at my bill and look at what he sent me back? I knew he was a stickler and updated him daily and got his approval for everything....

thanks again mike...where in NY are you? we need to get together and do lunch sometime...

 

[Mike Hogan]

Rob.........I'm in Dutchess County. If you want to e-mail me your bill,I'll gladly look it over.
mhjhny1@aol.com

 

[Desk Jockey]

We generally don't charge a supervisor unless there are at least 4-tech's on the job site. Is the job big enough that it required a supervisor?

Sometimes a supervisor maybe on the job site, but just because we need an additional person on the job, not that we needed someone at his billing category.

If you needed the supervisor there then explain why and stand your ground.

 

[Steve Toburen]

Hey Rob,

I'd never argue with Mike and Richard. They are two of the best out there in restoration. Mike has pulled himself up by his bootstraps and Richard ... well, ummmm, Richard has his brother, Big Dan, who in turn allows Richard to hang out on the internet all day and give excellent advice!

However, a slightly contrarian view. As usual, with all financial questions in our capitalistic system it comes down to "supply and demand" as in Supply: how many potential adjusters do you have? and Demand: how bad do you want to keep working for this guy and/or need his referrals? If you don't want this adjuster's work, then do what Mike and Richard say.

On the other hand, if you are shackled to this fellow, then offer to rewrite the estimate and just put the profit you need elsewhere. It truly is all in how you write it AND how the adjuster is able to justify it. I think it was Stephen Covey who said, "Seek first to understand." So interview this adjuster and find out what his "hot buttons" are and if you can discover WHY he is obsessing on this stuff. Many times he is under pressure from some new memo or a new supervisor. (I have NO idea why anyone would become an adjuster.)

I always STARTED out trying to develop a "partnership" type of relationship with adjusters. I would "adjust" the bill and rewrite it as long as I could make a profit. A good adjuster knows this. As one of my long-term adjusters would always tell me, "Steve, I want you to make money off me. But I don't want you to make ALL of your money off this one job!"

My two cents,

Island Boy
http://www.StrategiesForSuccess.com

PS Part of "seeking first to understand" is to look though an adjuster's eyes. These folks get cynical pretty quickly in their profession and you can understand why by just reading through the posts above! It takes time to earn an adjuster's trust.

 

[Desk Jockey]

Ouch that Toburen guy is rough! :wink:

First a backhanded compliment, then he gives me an uppercut with Covey.

He's is right if you fight and argue with this guy it will make for a tough relationship should you meet him on another loss.

I don't what you're seeing in the different parts of the country but we are seeing fewer and fewer adjuster friends.

It's not that we are chasing them off, more that the Insurance companies have figured a way to take the emotional part out of it. They have closed several of the adjusting offices and cut down their staff.

Sort of following the model that USAA has had for many years.
You deal with a phone adjuster, the representative in the field no longer makes any calls.

They are more of appraiser than an adjuster. They may even sympathize with you but their feelings about you or the situation don't play a part of it like it use to.

I personally don't feel like we need to make friends, just conduct our business in a professional manor, make sure we are documented and our paper work is sent in. It's really impersonal compared to just a few years ago.

I wouldn't be a jerk but if the charges are valid and justified then he is just trying to show his value by lowering your bill.

If adjusters still recommend restorers in your area, maybe I'd play it closer to what Steve is suggesting.

It's never a good idea to burn bridges, you never know when this guy could switch companies to one you do a lot of work for! :shock:

 

[Sticky]

This adjuster is an independent adjuster...I did have 6 employees on the job. I had to meet the environmental hygenist and I really feel that my supervisor hours were justified. He also only wanted to pay me 1/3 of what exactimate a lots for disinfecting sanitizing my equipment. (cat 3 loss)

Thank you for all of the advice I really appreciate everyones help.

Mike I will email my bill and what they adjuster sent me. I know of several companies(I used to work at ILS and know most the guys in the area) and everyone that has delt with him said he was a sticker. So I made sure to update him daily with readings and pics and I made sure to get his approval for everything. He dragged this job on since March 18th. I put an air scrubber in the effected area and contained the area per proto-call. The environmental hygenists put in proto-call to leave air scrubber there until 2-3 days after the job was sealed. The air scrubber was on the job for 44 days. He only put 22 days on the invoice he created.

I used the Environmental Hygenists that he works with on a regular basis.
He wanted her to write up a proto call so I did.(after I opened walls and found mold) She said that I did an excellent job and that she wanted me to soda blast/or dry ice blast the block. After she talked to him, she said well you could just wipe down with a mild detergent, hepa vac it and then seal it with an anti microbial sealant. I gave into that and didn't push the issue with the home owner. I had a public adjuster look at the job and he said that he could add 15-25 grand more to the bill atleast.(dry ice blasting and some extra rebuild items) He said that my bill was fine and that I shouldn't have any problems with it. (He just briefley looked at it. I feel like I gave into him and now he wants me to reduce my bill by 20%. when I really tried to work with him.
I really wanted to use my public adjuster but the home owner really just wants to get there house rebuilt.
My bill for the first back up is around 20 grand.
Second time it backed up about an 8 ft radius of sewage and all around the outside of the floating slab. Adjuster was told me home owner would have to file a second claim. (I just did it for free so the home owner didn't have to pay a second deductible)
Third back up was big again (cat 3) 4 grand.(adjuster made us file another claim and the home owner had to pay a second deductible)
I faxed a bill directly to the insurance company and have not heard anything in 2 weeks. The adjuster can't help me cause he is an independent adjuster and does not work directly for the insurance co.

Rebuild was 23 grand plus ten perc. for overhead and ten percent for profit(I don't actually do the work I just sub it to a friend and all I keep is the ten and ten) Adjuster knocked it down to 19 plus ten and ten.

I've done a lot of work and the reason why I have been on the job so long is because it was a problem with the main and the town took 4 weeks to fix the problem. Then I had to wait another week to get final approval are start the sealing. Don't you think I should get paid for all of the 44 days the air scrubber was on the job. It was in the proto-call that he insisted on. I really like Mike's idea of having something to fax to them to release any liability on my end and putting all the liability on the adjuster and the insurance co.

Thanks guys so much for all your help really appreciate sorry for long post but I tried to include as much as I could with out it being insanely long....

Thanks again


Mike...Im in western Ny...Rochester...where about is Dutchess County?

 

[Mike Hogan]

Rob.......we are ninety minutes south of Albany

 

[Desk Jockey]

A large Air scrubber goes for $120.00 in our area, at 44-days that's $5280.00, not counting primary, secondary and HEPA filter replacement.

It adds up quickly especially when you can purchase a new unit for $800.00-$1000.00.

We would probably give them some kind of extended use discount.

 

[Sticky]

Thanks Richard and it makes sense giving a discount for extended use and I prolly typically would but this adjuster has been hacking away at my bill even before I sent the invoice. Why should I give a discount to a "cherry picker"?

Thanks Richard I really appreciate all your help and insight.
We get $127 a day for large air scrubber. I saw the line item for hepa filter in exactimate, do you know the three codes for exactimate?(for the primary seconday and hepa filter)
thanks a million guys!

 

[Desk Jockey]

I'll look them up when I go in the office tomorrow.

 

[steve g]

normally when I have more than one person on the job I figure one as a supervisor and one as a regular laborer, my explanation is that someone needs to be on the job with more skills than an entry level person in many cases, to take moisture readings monitor equipment etc, this needs to be a person with certification and more knowledge than an unskilled person. if wall or base needs to be pulled I tell the adjuster we need a supervisor to make sure that even a simple item like pulling some base board is done correctly, I say what if the base is just yanked off it could mean drywall repairs and painting the whole wall. I have only been questioned on it a couple times

 

[Desk Jockey]

You're right Steve, we usually charge that person as a crew leader, he has the skills to run the job, but we charge a supervisor when the project requires multiple crews and needs management of them. Could be a big commercial loss or a large multi-level home.

We have billing catagories for:

Project manager
Supervisor
Crew Leader
Assistant Technician
General Labor (We very rarely use it, maybe if we used a bunch of temps....maybe)

 

[Sticky]

so I finally got came to an agreement with the adjuster. I stood my ground like you guys said and stuck to the standard. I made sure to keep him updated daily(like you guys said). I really appreaciate all the help.

Mitigation Bill total $22,479.92
Rebuild total $27,724.09
I didnt do the rebuild but I made the ten and ten for o & p.

I know asked a ton of questions. Alot of you guys really helped me out. (Especially Richard Chavez thanks a ton)

Now I am just waiting for the mail man!