Need some help with this rug.

[daniel@procarpet]

This is the worst smelling rug I have ever encountered. I don't know how I made it home. I literally almost stopped on the side of the road to ditch this thing. It is bad. CAT URINE!!!!!

I need to soak it in something for a day or two. What is the best solution?

 

[LisaWagnerCRS]

This is the worst smelling rug I have ever encountered. I don't know how I made it home. I literally almost stopped on the side of the road to ditch this thing. It is bad. CAT URINE!!!!!

I need to soak it in something for a day or two. What is the best solution?

What is the FIBER?
Are the dyes COLORFAST or FUGITIVE? (FYI - in the areas with urine it will bleed anyway)
Is the rug WOVEN or TUFTED?

You will have to WASH this, also FYI.

I'll wait to hear from you.

Lisa

 

[sweendogg]

What... no fricken picture!!???
:mrgreen:

get the pciture pu please!

 

[daniel@procarpet]

8x11 wool machine woven rug.

I have cleaned it three times in the past. It had dog urine in it before and washed up good, but this thing is disgusting.

Color bleeding is not going to be a problem.

Do I need to soak it in a good urine preconditioner like Matrix Urine Prespray which is 2 ph or go a different direction?

I am looking for the best solution to soak overnight before washing.

 

[daniel@procarpet]

What... no fricken picture!!???
:mrgreen:

get the pciture pu please!

I'm affraid to go near it.

 

[sweendogg]

Dan... very very very simple way of decontaminating a rug.. and Guarenteed!

As long as its woven and color fast..


http://www.masterblend.net/index.php?op ... info&id=32

I know you love masterblend products..

And despite the banner saying to use the anti allergy deoderizer and the shampoo.. ignore it.. its not needed.

Skunk Out is all that is needed.. setup your pit. submerge the rug in a few inches of water, apply a quart of skunk out.. diluted to a five gallon bucket of cold water and apply evenly over entire rug.. Brush it in. fill the pit up with more water to insure the rug is completely covered and flooded. If you can use the roller like mentioned in the article.. otherwise a good stiff push broom or glided wand works as well. Let the rug sit and hour then roll/ brush it squeegee it for about 10 minutes.. Let it sit another hour.. and repeat.. if the water gets very grunge.. then replace water and add only 1/4 as much skunk out this time. Again dwell an hour and agitate. Repeat until you stop pushing urine out. Then.. Rinse out the entire rug.. best approach.. lay rug on a slanted slope and put a cold water hose under one end and start pushing soil/water/ gunk out till it pushes clean.

Skunk out has plenty of solvency to clean the rug effectively with out the need for any other products.

 

[LisaWagnerCRS]

Daniel,

Soak it in acid before you start your cleaning. You can use acetic acid (vinegar) - mix it 50/50 and soak the rug completely if you are truly not worried about dye bleed.

The acid will get the urine out from inside the middle of the rug - flush it out with a linoleum roller or squeegee, if it's in a pit, use a sump pump to get the contaminated water out and more acid in.

If you have specific areas that you see are the urine stains - you can pour stronger acid right on the specific areas. The Sapphire Scientific Dye Stabilizer is an acid that does not smell like vinegar, and is about 4 times as strong/reactive - so you can mix that one part to 2 parts water if you really want a strong treatment - and use a water claw to suck all that urine out BEFORE you clean it.

Then wash the rug as normal. And only if there is still an odor around, you can use the other odor products. I personally do not like the MB Skunk Odor Remover because the perfume in that product makes me ill. And the only thing worse than pet urine smell is perfumey pet urine smell (it's like a taxi driver who has BO and puts cologne over it - gag...) - so that's why I prefer the MB Anti-Allergen Deodorizer over their skunk one. But I am SUPER sensitive to fragrances.

You can also use Bridgepoint Hydrocide or any Unsmoke/Prorestore deodorizers and other odor products. Everyone has their favorites.

But it's been my experience with urine on rugs that getting it out with the acid removes the source and the problem. And whenever there is any slight bit left - we use the Odorox machine overnight and it's done.

Now... if it is not cat urine but cat spray - you will have to work twice as hard. That's nasty.

Hope that helps,
Lisa

 

[MarkStanley]

Soak it in a detergent for days. Then once the smell and the stains was gone then clean your carpet using even laundry soap. When you still smell the stink in the carpet, You can now then use other chemicals to get rid of the smell and dirt.

 

[sweendogg]

Now I'm certain.. he's a flipping spammer!

 

[MarkStanley]

people are thinking of bad things to others. That's normal. There are so many help hotline for you to check on your problems i.e. for your rugs and carpets at home.

 

[KevinL]

Yes there are a lot of diy websites that are written by idiots like you. You don't use laundry detergent on rugs.

 

[MarkStanley]

That's for home remedies. This is for being practical. If this won't work then you have to purchase chemicals.

 

[LisaWagnerCRS]

That's for home remedies. This is for being practical. If this won't work then you have to purchase chemicals.

This is advice for being PRACTICAL? Are you out of your mind? A wool rug - soak it in detergent? Have you ever cleaned a rug before Mark? Is that what ChemDry teaches?

I once had a rug dealer come in to "show us" how Tide would make his rug better. He worked on one area... we quietly let him do his thing. And then after the rug was washed - that one area was bleached out, and dyes discolored - only in the area he "worked on."

It's the first time I've heard a rug dealer admit out loud that he was an idiot.

Mark - if you are advising people to do this - you are telling them how to ruin their rugs. Just FYI. You might want to go take a cleaning class.

Lisa

P.S. Detergents are "chemicals" too. Heck, even water is a "chemical."

 

[rhyde]

Most Laundry detergents like tide are formulated for the most common fibers in homes cotton and synthetics NOT wool.

I've never found soaking urine rug in acid effective and some times disaterious

 

[sweendogg]

before Lisa and Hyde rip this guy a new asshole...

I might mention this guy is spamming... he's not a real poster... the spam bots have evolved ladies and gentelmen.

 

[dgargan]

It always makes me confused when rug gurus like Lisa and Randy have completely different views on rugs. Lisa claims acid is the answer to urine problems and Randy never had success with it? Either it works or it doesn't .why does it change depending on who you talk to.

 

[Newman]

It always makes me confused when rug gurus like Lisa and Randy have completely different views on rugs. Lisa claims acid is the answer to urine problems and Randy never had success with it? Either it works or it doesn't .why does it change depending on who you talk to.

The road of life has many paths you can choose to take, in the end result is always the same.

Lisa, Work harder on cat spray? Have you actually been able to eliminate cat spray from a wool rug? Or any rug? Is that an attainable goal?

 

[Zee]

Ok in this thread there are several questions that could be separate thread materials.

First is- why is dan such a crybaby over one stinky rug?

Second- mark stanley is either a machine or really has absolutely no clue on how to deal with a wool rug(or any other carpet as it was apparent in previous posts)

Third-why DO the top ruggies have such difference in their advise?

Fourth-why don't "professionals" realize that detergents, soaps, etc etc are all chemicals??? Just like Lisa said it: even water is a chemical...

Fifth- yes there are different roads in life to get to the same destination. Who has the right answer that fits all?

 

[Ron K]

To soak out a rug that has not been washed is not the way to go. You don't deodorize a room before you clean it or do you. Removal of the source is carpet cleaning 101. We wash our rugs first.

 

[LisaWagnerCRS]

All of the "pre-treat" solutions are acid.

Whether you soak the rug in it, or douse specific areas and water claw the urine out, it makes the cleaning process easier in our experience to get as much of "the source" out first.

3-5% acetic acid is less acidic than vinegar, which is not going to harm the rugs, or even your hands. It's mild and very effective.

Every rug cleaner has their own tool box of tricks in their plant...this is just what's worked for us, and it inexpensive also.

Lisa

 

[sweendogg]

.... on certain rugs if I suspect dye bleed we'll pre treat with acetic acid first and then in to the pit. In the Pit we do remove the source of the urine. Skunk Out is acidic in nature and has good solvency that breaks up the urine deposits, as well as odor neutralizers. Its so effective, we don't need another shampoo or soap in most cases, ergo the less products I put into a rug, the less time we have getting all of the product out.

And P.S. Yes Lisa.. Skunk Out during the wash process can open your sinues up if you are sensative to that kinda of thing.. ( my uncle is.. he hates pit washing days) But once the product is all rinsed out. There is no hint of it left in the rug.

I do say thought I do like having the antiallergen deoderizer in my back pocket for certain occasions.

 

[LisaWagnerCRS]

.... on certain rugs if I suspect dye bleed we'll pre treat with acetic acid first and then in to the pit. In the Pit we do remove the source of the urine. Skunk Out is acidic in nature and has good solvency that breaks up the urine deposits, as well as odor neutralizers. Its so effective, we don't need another shampoo or soap in most cases, ergo the less products I put into a rug, the less time we have getting all of the product out.

And P.S. Yes Lisa.. Skunk Out during the wash process can open your sinues up if you are sensative to that kinda of thing.. ( my uncle is.. he hates pit washing days) But once the product is all rinsed out. There is no hint of it left in the rug.

I do say thought I do like having the antiallergen deoderizer in my back pocket for certain occasions.

Good stuff.

If you get a chance to try Sapphire's new Area Rug Deodorizer - let me know what you think of that. It also means you do not have to follow with a shampoo - and we use it for all of our flood-exposed rugs decontamination, but it's working wonders on odor removal as well. And when I told them the fragrance was too strong - the chemists knocked it down, so I don't get the same effect as the Skunk product did for me.

Anyway - something to test if you have the urge. And thanks again - you always have solid posts I enjoy reading.

Lisa

 

[sweendogg]

I'll have to give those products a try. thanks.

 

[rhyde]

All of the "pre-treat" solutions are acid.

Whether you soak the rug in it, or douse specific areas and water claw the urine out, it makes the cleaning process easier in our experience to get as much of "the source" out first.

3-5% acetic acid is less acidic than vinegar, which is not going to harm the rugs, or even your hands. It's mild and very effective.

Every rug cleaner has their own tool box of tricks in their plant...this is just what's worked for us, and it inexpensive also.

Lisa

You can use 99% glacial acetic acid on a wool rug and it wont harm the fiber infact it makes a great latex paint remover!

The point is just because you use an acid doesn't me you'll set the dye. Case in point ...do you remember a kid named Pablo Gomez...he went to one of your seminars i believe in Chicago..?

Pablo had a urine rug, tested the Colors which where stable soaked it in 3% solution of acidic acid here's what he came back to after a 4-6 hr soak in acetic acid. I'm not blaming you for this other than leaving a rug to soak in anything unattended is a bad idea, urine is usually acidic as is soil and therefor I've found soaking in a proper cleaning detergent a better and I believe quicker solution

 

[sweendogg]

... if you are leaving rugs soaking unattended for 4-6 hours... good lord almighty... 15 minutes with out checking at best is a better idea... and of course knowing your rugs as well.

but the simple realization that a urine infested rug is going to have some form of dye bleeding because of how high a pH urine can shift to when the bacteria starts attacking and digesting it.

 

[LisaWagnerCRS]

All of the "pre-treat" solutions are acid.

Whether you soak the rug in it, or douse specific areas and water claw the urine out, it makes the cleaning process easier in our experience to get as much of "the source" out first.

3-5% acetic acid is less acidic than vinegar, which is not going to harm the rugs, or even your hands. It's mild and very effective.

Every rug cleaner has their own tool box of tricks in their plant...this is just what's worked for us, and it inexpensive also.

Lisa

You can use 99% glacial acetic acid on a wool rug and it wont harm the fiber infact it makes a great latex paint remover!

The point is just because you use an acid doesn't me you'll set the dye. Case in point ...do you remember a kid named Pablo Gomez...he went to one of your seminars i believe in Chicago..?

Pablo had a urine rug, tested the Colors which where stable soaked it in 3% solution of acidic acid here's what he came back to after a 4-6 hr soak in acetic acid. I'm not blaming you for this other than leaving a rug to soak in anything unattended is a bad idea, urine is usually acidic as is soil and therefor I've found soaking in a proper cleaning detergent a better and I believe quicker solution

Randy - I have NEVER EVER said anywhere that acetic acid SETS dyes. No product sets dyes. It may stabilize it short term, but that's it. And any area exposed to pet urine, especially OLD pet urine, will dissolve the dye/fiber bond and make it lose color.

I also never trained Pablo. So your information is incorrect. I would never soak a red/white rug like that, good Lord.

Even with talking in this thread, you saw I asked about dye stability - which was why I suggested if there are specific contaminated areas, to spot treat if dye bleed is an issue.

It's tough to ever give technical advice, or answer any Q/A, because there are ALWAYS qualifications to any recommendations given.

And... putting glacial acetic on wool would be not only bad for the rug, but for the person pouring it - that stuff is toxic. Just FYI.

Lisa

 

[rhyde]

I say acetic acid sets dye when properly used, the question is when is proper & what’s stable. I’ve never found acetic acid particularly effective for urine or more effective than my normal wash solution if it works for you great I’m simply stating my opinion. Acetic acid is used in textile conservation in glacial form for spotting but it’s a weak acid the weakest of the carboxylic acids and only partially dissociates in water it has some desirable properties for cleaning and undesirable specifically vapor hazard but it’s not harmful to wool in glacial form.

I never said you “trained” Pablo I believe he went to a class you put on perhaps i'm mistaken…? Anyway, the rug in the picture was tested and indicated no color bleed issues yet it bleed, the cleaner truly didn’t think this rug would bleed either but there it is!

Lisa, you didn’t say toss the rug in and walk away for 4-6 hours .. … but there’s a preconceived idea read Daniels post He’s talking about soaking this rug overnight you suggest acetic acid there’s a disconnect you’re not telling him to soak it overnight you ‘re also not warning him not to soak it but that’s probably what he’s thinking..right?

I am looking for the best solution to soak overnight before washing.

Daniel, Soak it in acid before you start your cleaning. You can use acetic acid (vinegar) - mix it 50/50 and soak the rug completely if you are truly not worried about dye bleed.

You know as well as I do that the devil is in the details

Have a great weekend

 

[LisaWagnerCRS]

I say acetic acid sets dye when properly used, the question is when is proper & what’s stable. I’ve never found acetic acid particularly effective for urine or more effective than my normal wash solution if it works for you great I’m simply stating my opinion. Acetic acid is used in textile conservation in glacial form for spotting but it’s a weak acid the weakest of the carboxylic acids and only partially dissociates in water it has some desirable properties for cleaning and undesirable specifically vapor hazard but it’s not harmful to wool in glacial form.

I never said you “trained” Pablo I believe he went to a class you put on perhaps i'm mistaken…? Anyway, the rug in the picture was tested and indicated no color bleed issues yet it bleed, the cleaner truly didn’t think this rug would bleed either but there it is!

Lisa, you didn’t say toss the rug in and walk away for 4-6 hours .. … but there’s a preconceived idea read Daniels post He’s talking about soaking this rug overnight you suggest acetic acid there’s a disconnect you’re not telling him to soak it overnight you ‘re also not warning him not to soak it but that’s probably what he’s thinking..right?

I am looking for the best solution to soak overnight before washing.

Daniel, Soak it in acid before you start your cleaning. You can use acetic acid (vinegar) - mix it 50/50 and soak the rug completely if you are truly not worried about dye bleed.

You know as well as I do that the devil is in the details

Have a great weekend

I've never soaked a rug overnight, that would be unnecessary. You need to flush out the urine, so there needs to be an exchange of contaminated water with the fresh - so you are right Randy, with the question as Daniel posted it, you can misread what I intended.

Thanks for clearing that up. And no - that's not what I train. Ever.

Lisa

 

[daniel@procarpet]

I have used two acid pet treatments before. Hydramaster UPS which is great. It has a disinfectant in it I believe, knocks odors out fast, and is an acid. I like it a lot.

Matrix UPS - smells like vinegar, not as good as the hydramaster product, but works ok.

I too have never soaked a rug overnight. I have always treated heavy with the acid prespray and then cleaned with a wash. I get good results.

I was a little confused on this. Someone mentioned that cat urine should be treated with a high ph solution. That didn't make any sense to me. I am going to submerge the rug in a solution of Matrix UPS for a few hours then clean and rinse really good. After I get it clean, I will use something to freshen it up (likely odoban - a good disinfectant solution). This is the worst rug I have had to work with.

I will have to try some of the masterblend products. How good is the finge solution?

I have a few more that are not too bad, but are more expensive better quality rugs with pet urine. Bleeding could be a problem if not handled properly, but that is not likely. My only concern is the fringe. It is stained with pet urine. They should clean up good.

 

[Zee]

The last two pictures- I wouldn't recommend using masterblend's "fringebleach"

To me they look like "teawash" colored and I don't think the fringebleach is s friendly with those type of fringes.