7000 H and 8000 Q Owners

[ronbeatty]

I have been trying to figure out why I was having problems with the Vortex's not creating the heat they should in cold weather, while also creating a situation where I was having problems with the blower bearings from excess heat. Well I found it!!!!! The blower heat exchangers where clogged!!!!!!!!!. There is nothing in the manual about any maintenance that should be performed. I would suggest that anyone who has this type of unit go to your local HVAC store and buy coil cleaner. Take the exchanger apart give it a good cleaning and then do it on a 6 month schedule. On the 7000H, check the outlets on the blower heat exchange and open them up so it can relieve the back pressure on the blower. A rebuild on these blowers start at $2500.00 and if you have to replace it will cost you about $11,000.00. This is a serious screw up that has cost a lot of time and money to find.

 

[Mikey P]

 

[ronbeatty]

What is that about. :roll:

 

[Mikey P]

were you paid to be one Ron?

 

[Erik]

Boy, that sucks. Glad you got to the bottom of it. Seems to me, they could put a filter before the heat exchanger. Basically like a furnance filter that could easily slide out to be cleaned w/o pulling the entire heat exchanger out.

 

[Jimbo]

So let me get this right...they gave up on preheated water for that ill-designed heat exchanger?

 

[Mikey P]

Vlad just pooped himself.










Poor Bill.

 

[Jim Martin]

Gwad I love my 6008...............

 

[Lee Stockwell]

The Tuthill TI-850 isn't that expensive.

Unless you paint it YELLOW and put a hat on it.

 

[joe harper]

Gwad I love my 6008...............

MaRTy's...."V"....just went-up $5000.00......he will be VERY..

 

[Mikey P]

Shawn,

were you aware of this?

 

[Bjorn]

wow 1950s heat exchange technology

 

[hogjowl]

I have about decided to keep my V.

In a few years, it will be one of the few Vortex's still working correctly.

 

[Lee Stockwell]

With all the clogged blower HX units it's surprising such a filter hasn't been used.

Every Prochem 405 exchanger I've examined came out like a brick, full of gunk.

 

[Shawn Forsythe]

Most blower heat exchanger equipped truckmounts have a checkout interval on the blower HX units.

We recommend our customers have them checked out once per year. Since then, none of our owners have experienced a problem who have them inspected and follow the regimen. Unless you plug them up by letting them go too long, they are relatively easy to clean up.

We also tell customers to take it easy on the use of a spray blower lubricant, as it tends to attract a lot of dust and accelerate the process of a potential blocked exchanger. 5 seconds of spray is all it takes, and all you should use.

Newer Hydramasters sport a pressure fitting on the exhaust system to check blower/engine back-pressure in just a few minutes, which was a really good idea. This means the blower HX check is about as simple as it gets.

Light Bulb Idea Alert!

If Greenie is smart, he'll come up with a retrofit back-pressure "pimp" kit for every machine out there, so you can check the health state of the flow of the HX unit. I'm sure every 7000 and 8000 owner would snap them up in a minute.

 

[steve frasier]

Thanks Ron

 

[Lee Stockwell]

Exactly the same as the vacuum gauge plumbing, except on the other side of the blower.

Still there should be a slide out filter. Removing 18 screws and related hose clamps to get into the monstrosity "to inspect it" is goofy. We made a few other simple changes and eliminated the blower exchangers on all three 405's and still have better heat.

 

[Greenie]

In answer to both Shawn and Lee, how would putting a vacuum gauge tell of Blower back pressure?

On the hydraslave machines I can see a small welded nipple to check engine back pressure, but that wouldn't be enough for a 300+ cfm blower, you would need an Anometer of some type to read blower output, we need a way to measure cfm, not Lift, even a 3/4 blocked exchanger would still positively displace air.

I too would like to thank Ron for bringing this up in this timely matter, I am curious to see next month what Sapphire exchangers look like?

 

[Jim Martin]

I hate to be the turd in the punch bowl here but I really don't think a filter would work like your thinking...your not talking filtering dirt from a air flow.....you are working with air pressure out of a 5 inch opening....which is a huge huge difference.....

 

[ronbeatty]

Jim, I agree, I don't feel that a filter would survive in that location.

 

[Lee Stockwell]

Pressure gauge, not vacuum gauge Jeff. A 1/8"npt tapped connection exactly like the one typically used to connect to the vacuum gauge.

Re Filters:

I'm not talking about a cardboard hvac filter from Wal*mart. I worked in industrial maintenance for a few years. There are off the shelf stainless steel filters that would work fine.

Thanks,
Lee

 

[Shawn Forsythe]

I'm only talking about a capped tap kit. A replacement fitting assy or a retrofit fitting placed somewhere between the blower and heat exchanger, so you could check out HX health with one of these;

http://testproducts.com/manifold-pressu ... p-802.html

Of course, you also need to know the nominal pressure, and the upper limit for each system to use the tap informatively.

 

[Jim Martin]

Pressure gauge, not vacuum gauge Jeff. A 1/8"npt tapped connection exactly like the one typically used to connect to the vacuum gauge.

Re Filters:

I'm not talking about a cardboard hvac filter from Wal*mart. I worked in industrial maintenance for a few years. There are off the shelf stainless steel filters that would work fine.

Thanks,
Lee

Correct..the stainless ones would be the only ones that I would ever use in most types of settings...but even with those you are not talking about PULLING a flow of air threw an opening what ever size the box is for those coils.....you are PUSHING a high rate of air threw a 5 inch pipe..world of difference there........and it won't work...

 

[ghostrider]

Put a filter before it and you will be asking for the same problem that Ron found, stop and think about it, the coils are just specially designed filters to capture heat.

 

[Lee Stockwell]

Scaling to the bottles in the picture it looks like a 10 x 12" filter would do the trick. I could do it in an hour. It would take another hour for everyone to explain why it couldn't be done.

Thanks,
Lee

 

[Jim Martin]

I could do it in an hour. It would take another hour for everyone to explain why it couldn't be done.

Thanks,
Lee

your not filtering dirt by pulling negative air threw a filter..you are forcing what ever Ron is lubing his blower with threw the system and it is building up... because of the air pressure that it is pushing and the lack of distance to disperse the air evenly it will not work..it is only going to cause you more head aches then what it is worth.......

( took me 45 seconds.......would of been shorter but I could not remember how to spell...disperse.....)

 

[ronbeatty]

Jim, I keep my trucks in a heated building, I have never used anything on the impellers. That is just dirt.

 

[Jim Martin]

where is the dirt coming in from and don't you lube the blower at the end of the day...........

 

[ronbeatty]

Jim, I think that there is enough airflow through the blower that the fine dirt that gets past the filter box gets pulled threw the filters in the top of the tank. The dirt goes threw the blower and silencer and gets trapped on the fins on the heat exchange. You have to remember that the airstream is very humid because of the temperature and amount of water we are reclaiming.
As far as the blower goes, I ran Butlers for 25 years and never sprayed anything into the blower, and never replaced one.

 

[Jim Martin]

You have to remember that the airstream is very humid because of the temperature and amount of water we are reclaiming.
As far as the blower goes, I ran Butlers for 25 years and never sprayed anything into the blower, and never replaced one.

because of that reason I give mine a shot of WD40 at the end of each day....

it might slow down the build up on the HX fins if you place 2 layers of knee high hose over the blower filters........

how tight is the box sealed that goes around the HX..........??