Dry Strokes, are they necessary?

[Onfire_02_01]

I have been reading and seeing a lot of people doing dry strokes lately. @Mark Saiger especially.
Do dry strokes really cut down on the dry time?
I question this because a couple of years ago I wanted to test so I cleaned an apartment with my Mytee portable and put in about 10 gallons to clean with, and another 2 gallons of prespray. When I finished I dumped about 7.5-8 gallons of dirty water. Then I went back and dry stroked the entire apartment and only got out another pint or so of water. From time to time I do the oh so scientific hand on the carpet to see how wet the carpet is, and I don't feel much of a difference between a clean stroke and a clean with a dry stroke. Am I missing something?
I havn't done the test with my truckmount though. I thought it might be too hard to water volume sample.
Thoughts?

 

[Mikey P]

How much of the left over water water was still dirty?

 

[Onfire_02_01]

I don't remember.

 

[hogjowl]

Before glided wands, I never did extra dry strokes. That was because, before glided wands, I never did extra wet strokes. It was too hard to push the wand. Now, with the use of glided wands, I will sometimes do several wet passes over the same spot. So, I do several dry passes of the same spot.

You never know how much a dry pass helps until you get a tool with a sight tube on it. Once you actually see how much it helps, you curse the day you bought it, because you can no longer speed through a job with a clear conscience.

 

[rick imby]

Dry strokes are more effective the closer to the time the wet stroke was laid down.

Sight tubes will tell you the story if you go right back over it after your wet stroke...

 

[Mark Saiger]

There is more than just moisture a person is removing with dry strokes.

There are also other suspended soils that are being removed....

And yes...those clear site tubes can really mess with a person.... If you are OCD it can be difficult to clean looking at the dang site tube

 

[steve_64]

The velocity of the air moving over the fibers on a dry stroke helps the drying process whether you see water or not. IMO
Dry stroke a small spot over and over and it will dry faster than the rest.

 

[adamh]

Yes
Yes
Yes
You get more imbeded dirt and grime. The Cobbs TI wand has a window in the head and you can see how much more water you are getting with the dry stroke. We speed dry most carpets and there is a huge difference in dry time with dry strokes.

I don't really dry stroke much commercial because the Zipper really works great. Commercial Carpet and the Zipper is a deadly combo

 

[Zee]

I have been reading and seeing a lot of people doing dry strokes lately. @Mark Saiger especially.
Do dry strokes really cut down on the dry time?

Lately????

I don't think we ever cleaned carpet without dry strokes..I really don't see how this is even a question- especially for a portable! It is a must...heck, double the dry strokes you think is enough.

Does a hair dryer speed up your head rag drying if you do a once over for about 30 seconds or does it dry faster if you do more "dry strokes" for another minute?

 

[Mikey P]

Like zee says.



Not an option.

 

[Nampa Carpet Cleaning]

A portable won't pull all the water out of the carpet. That is why they have problems with wick backs and extended dry time. Not enough air flow.

Just because you don't see any water in the clear tube only means that your system is at it's limit. Someone with a bigger machine would come in and get more water out.

 

[TConway]

I have never been able to NOT do them, it just feels hackish to not put the effort and do them, maybe some of the low ballers around my town practice this kinda of cleaning to be able to justify there cheap low ball price.
I don't do low quality cleaning even on my PM type work, it is hard to tell how much extra water you are removing with the extra dry passes without a window on a wand or tube in hose run, and yes you can go over board but once you see how much it is hard not to.
Like Mark said above, the dry stoke is NOT just for extra water removal, it is also needed to remove MORE debris that is trapped in the fibers and with out a doubt you will get more debris with extra dry strokes.
We don't get a extra chance to impress our customers, so to me just doing a few dry passes is part of setting me apart from the crowd it is well worth the little exrta effort.

 

[TConway]

It is very interesting that so many spend time and money on 4 2 door or 2.5 hose, wands, filters, truckmounts, then turn right around and take these mods or improvements and cut corners to get the job done faster.
When in reality they should be using these to improve on the quality they were doing BEFORE the mods or upgrades, to just try and help take there cleaning to a higher level than before.

 

[ruff]

It is very interesting that so many spend time and money on 4 2 door or 2.5 hose, wands, filters, truckmounts, then turn right around and take these mods or improvements and cut corners to get the job done faster.
When in reality they should be using these to improve on the quality they were doing BEFORE the mods or upgrades, to just try and help take there cleaning to a higher level than before.

I agree that dry strokes are necessary and will improve results.

I do not agree with the notion above. If one has already done a great job and one implements improvements, it will allow for improvements in efficiency (translation- less time on the job). That's why we do it.

Otherwise we will all be Wernerizing carpets and be still vacuuming our first job.

What is often referred to here as the "next level", is many times the equivalent of carpet cleaning masturbation. Enjoyable? Yes.
Productive? Well, I guess it depends

 

[Mikey P]

Ofer and Sonny..

Are either of you using Rotary Extractors on filthy carpet?

 

[Spurlington]

A portable won't pull all the water out of the carpet. That is why they have problems with wick backs and extended dry time. Not enough air flow.

Just because you don't see any water in the clear tube only means that your system is at it's limit. Someone with a bigger machine would come in and get more water out.

I have this commercial job I do monthly. I used to use my TM wand paired to the EDIC Galaxy 2700. Machine has great suction. Id recover 50 to 70% of water without dry passes. Then I found this wand in my garage from 15 years ago. First wand bought with first portable. (BTW I still have the portable - which I use to clean out my tank once a month with.) I paired the original wand with my newest Galaxy and Im removing more water than the recovery tank can hold. The ball cuts the vac before I run out of fresh water (with no foam). The Galaxy 2700 is a 17 gallon with 15 recovery. My point is - I think the machine has to have the right wand paired to make the best recovery. Maybe with the TM is an exception(or not). The carpet I do will dry, (aside from the horizontal over lap strips), in 3 hrs without a post vac. I move the wand up and straight back with the trigger keyed at all times.

 

[rick imby]

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There is more than just moisture a person is removing with dry strokes.

There are also other suspended soils that are being removed....

And yes...those clear site tubes can really mess with a person.... If you are OCD it can be difficult to clean looking at the dang site tube

Wait a minute, I thought you only left the clean water in the carpet. All the dirty water came out on the first stroke? haha

 

[Jim Pemberton]

How much of the left over water water was still dirty?

Wait a minute, I thought you only left the clean water in the carpet. All the dirty water came out on the first stroke? haha

Mike's post was an exercise of his somewhat subtle wit.

Rick said it more clearly

If there is water left in the carpet, there is dirt and detergent in that water. No wand has been designed to vacuum all the dirt out of the water in the first stroke. The more water you remove, the more dirt and detergent you remove, period.

Is there a "diminishing return on effort" at some point? Yes, of course. That's why a clear site tube, filter, etc can be so important.

Of course, there is a price to pay, as Marty so clearly pointed out:

You never know how much a dry pass helps until you get a tool with a sight tube on it. Once you actually see how much it helps, you curse the day you bought it, because you can no longer speed through a job with a clear conscience.

 

[Mikey P]

I think the machine has to have the right wand paired to make the best recovery

Dev Tom and I just discussed this on the phone for an hour...


and "right hose" should be added to that statement..

 

[dgardner]

Funny. I've been saying that for years... you have to consider the system, not individual components.

 

[Larry Cobb]

A properly designed wand will work with any #4 or larger TM.

Some TM's will deliver more lift to generate more CFM.

Zippers with 30" of vac slot will lose some vac lift compared to a wand.

 

[Nate The Great]

Lately????

I don't think we ever cleaned carpet without dry strokes..I really don't see how this is even a question- especially for a portable! It is a must...heck, double the dry strokes you think is enough.

Does a hair dryer speed up your head rag drying if you do a once over for about 30 seconds or does it dry faster if you do more "dry strokes" for another minute?

How would you know, your bald.......

Dry strokes do help like most of the posters above pointed out... But you can't do a large area then think you'll get most of the water out by dry stroking it... You'd need to break down the room into sections and do dry strokes shortly after for best results... Focus more dry strokes on the traffic areas... That's what I do when I use my portable and I grew up using portables...

FWIW @Larry Cobb The Zipper does leave the carpet drier with my portable than my rv360i but I lose agitation... But I'll take the rv360i in a condo setting for the ease of maneuverability...

 

[Onfire_02_01]

The portable aside would you all make the same assumptions about a truck mount?
I only used the portable for the experiment because it is easier to know how much water is going into the carpet and how much water is coming out of the carpet because I have to manually fill and dump with a 5 gallon bucket.
If suck is suck and lift is lift why does it matter if the carpet has been wet for x short amount time while I wand from 1 side of the room to the other side of the room, then do a dry stroke back, or if I clean the entire carpet and then come back 20 min later and dry stroke the entire apartment?

 

[Nate The Great]

Gravity.......... Once you get the backing of the carpet wet, good luck getting the moisture out...

 

[steve_64]

And heat. Warm water lifts easier than cold.

 

[TConway]

Ofer,
My point is, it is harder to take the time to set up with 2.5 or 4 2 door. But then you have guys that take the improved airflow and work even faster, so it kinda kills the whole idea.
I know this maybe a touchy topic, but if you take the time and hassle with the extra steps to do a better job, then work faster, the wand slot hasn't changed or the embedded soils, buy doing these mods and working at the same pace as before the mods, I believe it will help the cleaner do a better job in the end.

 

[Kellie Hiler]

How would you know, your bald.......

Dry strokes do help like most of the posters above pointed out... But you can't do a large area then think you'll get most of the water out by dry stroking it... You'd need to break down the room into sections and do dry strokes shortly after for best results... Focus more dry strokes on the traffic areas... That's what I do when I use my portable and I grew up using portables...

FWIW @Larry Cobb The Zipper does leave the carpet drier with my portable than my rv360i but I lose agitation... But I'll take the rv360i in a condo setting for the ease of maneuverability...

Thank you.....I was going to say that the Zipper gives me amazing dry times, better than any wand I've ever used.
Yesterday I spent time at the shop with Rich working on my blower, greasing it, oiling it, and cleaning the blower filter that unfortunately had no been cleaned in quite some time due to me not knowing about it and George being out of it. Between the blower back in tip top shape and the devastator filter the 2 jobs I Zippered last night were almost completely dry by the time I left, and that's with a really good flushing (I do have OCD and watch that damn site tube like a freak!) and dry strokes.

 

[Kellie Hiler]

So, the way I do it is not section by section. I do my wet passes and immediately go over that stroke with my dry passes. I've always done it that way no matter what I am using, is this the proper way?!

 

[Mikey P]

I go give or six feet wide wet then back track dry..

 

[Kellie Hiler]

I did try that, especially with the Rotovac but it just feels easier to do it stroke by stroke for me. Does it make a difference in the extraction capabilities?