friend has a question

[sassyotto]

daughter 33 years old lives in a 25 year old apartment building. She lives on the second floor with another apartment below her.
She has lived there the past 5 years. The last 1 1/2 to 2 years she gets sick every 2 to 3 days of each week. Symptoms are fatigue, headache and cant sleep. When she is out of the apartment for any length of time (vacation, etc) she does not have any symptoms
She has two cats that have lived with her since moving in
She has seen multiple doctors to include allergy testing, blood work, sleep study, etc. that could not determine the problem. The only test she has not taken is an auto immune test
Apartment has hot water, baseboard heat (rules out contamination in ductwork)
She does use Carpet Fresh and plug ins.
In October they had a restoration company take humidity readings of walls, ceiling and carpet - all have read normal
She indicates that since moving in, she has not made any changes that may have caused this
They have narrowed it down to possibly something to do with the carpet.

Thoughts?

 

[Jack Zipper Zerkie]

Pull up carpet in a few areas to see what is there

 

[hogjowl]

The downstairs people must be witches.

 

[Mikey P]

If she has lived there for 5 years and the symptoms only started 1.5 to 2 years ago, it is highly improbable that "dormant" residue from a past tenant suddenly became toxic three years into her tenancy. Chemical residues typically off-gas and weaken over time; they don't usually get stronger or suddenly activate without a major disturbance (like a flood).

However, Carpet Pad Breakdown is a possibility.At 25 years old (if the carpet is original or even 10+ years old), the latex adhesive that holds the carpet together and the foam padding underneath begin to disintegrate. As they pulverize, they release microscopic particles of latex and old synthetic rubber. If she bought a new, more powerful vacuum 1.5–2 years ago, she might now be sucking that pulverized dust up and blowing it into the air.

The "Smoking Gun": The 1.5 – 2 Year Timeline​

The most critical clue is that she was fine for 3 years, and then got sick. Since she didn't make changes, we have to look at what might have changed around her.

1. The Downstairs Neighbor (The "Stack Effect")This is now the #1 suspect.

• The Question: Did a new tenant move into the unit below her (or next door) about 1.5 to 2 years ago?
• The Mechanism: Hot air rises. In apartments, air from the lower unit migrates up through the floorboards, light fixtures, and plumbing gaps (under sinks).
• The Toxins: If the neighbor smokes, vapes, burns heavy candles/incense, cooks with pungent spices, or (worst case) uses illegal drugs (meth cooking creates these exact symptoms), that chemical load enters her apartment. She breathes their air.
• Why she feels better away: She is escaping the neighbor's "exhaust."

2. Hidden Slow-Leak Mold

• The Issue: Restoration companies check for active moisture. They often miss "dry rot" or mold that grew from a slow leak 2 years ago behind a dishwasher, inside a wall, or under the bathroom vanity, and has since dried out but is releasing spores.
• Symptoms: Mold toxicity often presents as "brain fog," fatigue, and headaches (mycotoxins), not just sneezing/wheezing.

3. Carbon Monoxide (CO)

• Safety First: Please ask her to verify the age/batteries of her CO detector. Low-level CO leaks from a boiler or an aging stove can cause chronic headaches/fatigue that clear up when you leave the house.

Recommended "Detective Work" for Her:​

1. The Neighbor Check: Did the tenant below change approx. 2 years ago? Can she smell anything (smoke, food, weird chemical sweet smells) in her bathroom or kitchen cabinets?
2. The "Gap" Check: Check the plumbing penetrations under the kitchen and bathroom sinks. Are there big gaps around the pipes where they go into the wall/floor? This is the "highway" for bad air. She can seal these with the silicone tip from our manual or even duct tape as a test.
3. The Carpet Test: Pull back a corner of the carpet (in a closet). Is the padding underneath turning to dust/sand? If it crumbles when touched, the carpet is chemically dead and putting particulate into the air.

Conclusion:It is likely not residue from 5 years ago. It is almost certainly an environmental factor that changed 2 years ago. The neighbor or a hidden mechanical issue (CO/Mold) are the strongest leads.

 

[Cleanworks]

daughter 33 years old lives in a 25 year old apartment building. She lives on the second floor with another apartment below her.
She has lived there the past 5 years. The last 1 1/2 to 2 years she gets sick every 2 to 3 days of each week. Symptoms are fatigue, headache and cant sleep. When she is out of the apartment for any length of time (vacation, etc) she does not have any symptoms
She has two cats that have lived with her since moving in
She has seen multiple doctors to include allergy testing, blood work, sleep study, etc. that could not determine the problem. The only test she has not taken is an auto immune test
Apartment has hot water, baseboard heat (rules out contamination in ductwork)
She does use Carpet Fresh and plug ins.
In October they had a restoration company take humidity readings of walls, ceiling and carpet - all have read normal
She indicates that since moving in, she has not made any changes that may have caused this
They have narrowed it down to possibly something to do with the carpet.

Thoughts?

There is not much in carpet to cause that kind of illness. I would test for carbon monoxide poisoning. Does the building have underground parking? Do service vehicles idle near her place? She should move if it's that bad.

 

[Kenny Hayes]

My mother had something similar going on in a location she lived. In and out of the hospital with pneumonia every other month. We had to move her and it solved it.

 

[they live]

Carpet fresh and plug ins make me sick. I can smell them before I walk in sometimes.

My dr wants me to test for mast cell activation syndrome but its a bone marrow test.

I read about a lady who had to take epinephrine 99 times in one year.

Fabulous is the worse. But even perfume and laundry detergents can cause problems. She has to go fragrance free for everything.
Cat urine dog odors cat litter fragrances are all bad.

All my autoimmune tests came back negative. I was testing for maybe 100 different things including rare cancers.
Prednisone helps a lot and salt pills seem to be helping keep the symptoms from getting severe so easily.
Ive been in the hospital a lot in my life with never any help.

 

[frank fratto]

Carpet fresh and plug ins make me sick. I can smell them before I walk in sometimes.

My dr wants me to test for mast cell activation syndrome but its a bone marrow test.

I read about a lady who had to take epinephrine 99 times in one year.

Fabulous is the worse. But even perfume and laundry detergents can cause problems. She has to go fragrance free for everything.
Cat urine dog odors cat litter fragrances are all bad.

All my autoimmune tests came back negative. I was testing for maybe 100 different things including rare cancers.
Prednisone helps a lot and salt pills seem to be helping keep the symptoms from getting severe so easily.
Ive been in the hospital a lot in my life with never any help.

Steve,
My niece had a similar situation. the doctors put her on a carnivore diet. meat only.

A elimination diet. Within weeks, she felt better and within a couple of months it reset

her system. That was about 5 years ago. she's been better ever since.

 

[BIG WOOD]

Take the cats out for 2 months and see if there's any different.

The headache: Is it sinus headaches or other parts of her head aching?

Does she drink the tap water from that building or other sources?

Does she have a good air purifier running all the time in the apartment?

MAJOR RED FLAG!!!!! using carpet fresh and plug ins is the enemy of our body!

https://mikeysboard.com/threads/are-your-chemicals-safe-for-my-pets.299620/

I thought I made a thread about the topic of air fresheners but I can't find it. Hey Mike, can you AI buddy help?

If your daughter doesn't take your warning of the plug ins seriously, tell her she's earned the badge of being an idiot. The data is out there, and I myself have experienced the terrible headaches of those cancer plug ins. I feel bad for those allergy rats (cats) who have to breathe that crap air in every day

 

[BIG WOOD]

If she has lived there for 5 years and the symptoms only started 1.5 to 2 years ago, it is highly improbable that "dormant" residue from a past tenant suddenly became toxic three years into her tenancy. Chemical residues typically off-gas and weaken over time; they don't usually get stronger or suddenly activate without a major disturbance (like a flood).

However, Carpet Pad Breakdown is a possibility.At 25 years old (if the carpet is original or even 10+ years old), the latex adhesive that holds the carpet together and the foam padding underneath begin to disintegrate. As they pulverize, they release microscopic particles of latex and old synthetic rubber. If she bought a new, more powerful vacuum 1.5–2 years ago, she might now be sucking that pulverized dust up and blowing it into the air.

The "Smoking Gun": The 1.5 – 2 Year Timeline​

The most critical clue is that she was fine for 3 years, and then got sick. Since she didn't make changes, we have to look at what might have changed around her.

1. The Downstairs Neighbor (The "Stack Effect")This is now the #1 suspect.

• The Question: Did a new tenant move into the unit below her (or next door) about 1.5 to 2 years ago?
• The Mechanism: Hot air rises. In apartments, air from the lower unit migrates up through the floorboards, light fixtures, and plumbing gaps (under sinks).
• The Toxins: If the neighbor smokes, vapes, burns heavy candles/incense, cooks with pungent spices, or (worst case) uses illegal drugs (meth cooking creates these exact symptoms), that chemical load enters her apartment. She breathes their air.
• Why she feels better away: She is escaping the neighbor's "exhaust."

2. Hidden Slow-Leak Mold

• The Issue: Restoration companies check for active moisture. They often miss "dry rot" or mold that grew from a slow leak 2 years ago behind a dishwasher, inside a wall, or under the bathroom vanity, and has since dried out but is releasing spores.
• Symptoms: Mold toxicity often presents as "brain fog," fatigue, and headaches (mycotoxins), not just sneezing/wheezing.

3. Carbon Monoxide (CO)

• Safety First: Please ask her to verify the age/batteries of her CO detector. Low-level CO leaks from a boiler or an aging stove can cause chronic headaches/fatigue that clear up when you leave the house.

Recommended "Detective Work" for Her:​

1. The Neighbor Check: Did the tenant below change approx. 2 years ago? Can she smell anything (smoke, food, weird chemical sweet smells) in her bathroom or kitchen cabinets?
2. The "Gap" Check: Check the plumbing penetrations under the kitchen and bathroom sinks. Are there big gaps around the pipes where they go into the wall/floor? This is the "highway" for bad air. She can seal these with the silicone tip from our manual or even duct tape as a test.
3. The Carpet Test: Pull back a corner of the carpet (in a closet). Is the padding underneath turning to dust/sand? If it crumbles when touched, the carpet is chemically dead and putting particulate into the air.

Conclusion:It is likely not residue from 5 years ago. It is almost certainly an environmental factor that changed 2 years ago. The neighbor or a hidden mechanical issue (CO/Mold) are the strongest leads.

Your AI is hiding the truth about the plug ins being the culprit. Government owned BS technology wants everyone to breathe that polluted air in. 4 out of 5 homes over here have that crap air polluting my customer's houses and when I warn them about it, I see 4 more of those damn things plugged in a year later when I return to clean their carpet.

Tell AI he/she is gonna be guilty of covering facts when the law uncovers the curtains that cause all the sickness

 

[they live]

Steve,
My niece had a similar situation. the doctors put her on a carnivore diet. meat only.

A elimination diet. Within weeks, she felt better and within a couple of months it reset

her system. That was about 5 years ago. she's been better ever since.

There are foods that trigger my gut. When I began eating mostly beef about 6 or 7 years ago it gave me the opportunity to single out foods that trigger my gut.
But the mcas got really bad 5 years ago. I think it was always there but I was fighting so many issues it was hard to diagnose.
I am allergic to every tree and grass in north America to mold pet dander mice poop and I forget what all else.
As my stomach got better my autoimmune became out of control. It was always bad and I have always had salt deficiency.
I was dying from my autoimmune 5 years ago. My body was shutting down. A couple time I could feel something kick my body and I just started sinking down my urine turned black and I couldn't function. I was near death when I began taking prednisone. It brought me back to life. It turned off my autoimmune.
Then I started on the salt pills. That got me from needing the prednisone. But my body is severely damaged from lifetime diarhea causing malnutrition. Between that and the salt deficiencies my nerves are severely damaged and so are my muscles and bones.
I was still getting sinus infections all the time. My sinus cavity was dipped into the roots of my tooth so the mucus would get trapped. Having all my teeth pulled solved that. That infection kept my immune system triggered.
My neurologist told me to watch a movie on Netflix called "brain on fire". He asked my head felt and I said I feel like my brain is on fire.
Ive struggled with these issues all my life. I would have these crashes that woukd put me in the hospital but nobody ever had any answers. It just got worse and worse until 2020 2021.
I can still things others dont like mice poop and mold. I can smell fabric softeners in the air outside from across the river.
I had to rip out the pine tongue and groove paneling in my den because it was making me sick.
Even scented candles are allergens. If it has a fragrance added it is an allergen to me.
Since I started the salt pills I keep getting better with it not effecting as much. I haven't taken prednisone in about a year now.

When I traveled to California and Cabo I felt so much better. I think it was the salt air and low allergens in the air. I felt so much better I didn't want to go home.

 

[frank fratto]

There are foods that trigger my gut. When I began eating mostly beef about 6 or 7 years ago it gave me the opportunity to single out foods that trigger my gut.
But the mcas got really bad 5 years ago. I think it was always there but I was fighting so many issues it was hard to diagnose.
I am allergic to every tree and grass in north America to mold pet dander mice poop and I forget what all else.
As my stomach got better my autoimmune became out of control. It was always bad and I have always had salt deficiency.
I was dying from my autoimmune 5 years ago. My body was shutting down. A couple time I could feel something kick my body and I just started sinking down my urine turned black and I couldn't function. I was near death when I began taking prednisone. It brought me back to life. It turned off my autoimmune.
Then I started on the salt pills. That got me from needing the prednisone. But my body is severely damaged from lifetime diarhea causing malnutrition. Between that and the salt deficiencies my nerves are severely damaged and so are my muscles and bones.
I was still getting sinus infections all the time. My sinus cavity was dipped into the roots of my tooth so the mucus would get trapped. Having all my teeth pulled solved that. That infection kept my immune system triggered.
My neurologist told me to watch a movie on Netflix called "brain on fire". He asked my head felt and I said I feel like my brain is on fire.
Ive struggled with these issues all my life. I would have these crashes that woukd put me in the hospital but nobody ever had any answers. It just got worse and worse until 2020 2021.
I can still things others dont like mice poop and mold. I can smell fabric softeners in the air outside from across the river.
I had to rip out the pine tongue and groove paneling in my den because it was making me sick.
Even scented candles are allergens. If it has a fragrance added it is an allergen to me.
Since I started the salt pills I keep getting better with it not effecting as much. I haven't taken prednisone in about a year now.

When I traveled to California and Cabo I felt so much better. I think it was the salt air and low allergens in the air. I felt so much better I didn't want to go home.

God bless you, my friend.

 

[they live]

Your AI is hiding the truth about the plug ins being the culprit. Government owned BS technology wants everyone to breathe that polluted air in. 4 out of 5 homes over here have that crap air polluting my customer's houses and when I warn them about it, I see 4 more of those damn things plugged in a year later when I return to clean their carpet.

Tell AI he/she is gonna be guilty of covering facts when the law uncovers the curtains that cause all the sickness

Salt deficiency is a huge problem with the population. Water wont hydrate you unless you have enough salt to absorb it. Too much water causes more salt loss.
Your body or cells cant absorb nutrients without salt. Blood gets too thin. Muscles and veins get tight. Cells die prematurely or dont grow at all.
Salt prevents cancer alzheimers heart disease kidney disease. My varicose veins went away and my mom's have gotten better since I've gotten her to eat more salt.
It prevents bone loss and cavities. Prevents arthritis.
Salt brought my chronicly low vitamin D levels up and my depression is gone.

 

[they live]

God bless you, my friend.

Thank you Frank.

 

[they live]

Ivermectin and hydroxychloriqune helped a lot too in the beginning.
We deworm our cattle chickens hogs and pets but not ourselves. Parasites are a much more common issue than we realize. They can cause cataracts stomach problems organ issues and even some cancers.
When we take them we feel our sinuses open and we breath better.
They can make you feel sick though too from the parasites dying in your body. Its like a mild flu feeling until your body expels the dead parasites.
Ive been through some very weird things.

 

[they live]

This will last me about 6 months just in case anyone doesnt believe me. I also have it on my Dr's orders but dont have time to find it.

 

[Mikey P]

Your AI is hiding the truth about the plug ins being the culprit. Government owned BS technology wants everyone to breathe that polluted air in. 4 out of 5 homes over here have that crap air polluting my customer's houses and when I warn them about it, I see 4 more of those damn things plugged in a year later when I return to clean their carpet.

Tell AI he/she is gonna be guilty of covering facts when the law uncovers the curtains that cause all the sickness

Actually She fully blamed the Plug ins, but I shared with her how Sassy said "She does use Carpet Fresh and plug ins."

this was her first response

1. The Immediate Suspects: Chemical Irritants​

The most glaring issues in the description are the "Carpet Fresh" and plug-in air fresheners.

• Plug-ins: These heat up oils and release VOCs (Volatile Organic Compounds) constantly. For sensitive individuals, this causes exactly the symptoms described: headaches, fatigue, and brain fog.
• Carpet Fresh (Powder): These powders are notoriously difficult to fully vacuum out. They settle at the base of the fibers and in the backing, eventually breaking down into fine particulate dust that gets kicked up every time she walks.
• The "Cocktail": Mixing cat dander + degrading powder + synthetic fragrance VOCs creates a high-load chemical environment. Since she has been there 5 years, the accumulation of the powder in the carpet backing could be significant.

2. The "Sink" Effect (Carpet)​

If the carpet is original to the building (25 years) or even just 5+ years old with two cats:

• The Pad: The carpet pad may be degrading or holding years of absorbed odors/liquids.
• Dust Mites: Even with baseboard heat (no forced air blowing dust around), the carpet acts as a "sink" for dust mites. If she developed a sensitivity to mites over the last 2 years, the carpet is the reservoir.

3. Air Intrusion (The Downstairs Factor)​

Since she is on the second floor, the "stack effect" means air from the apartment below often rises into hers through unsealed penetrations (around pipes under sinks, electrical outlets, baseboards).

• The Neighbors: Has the tenant below changed in the last 1.5 - 2 years?
• Risks: If the neighbor smokes, uses heavy incense, cooks with heavy spices, or (worst case) is manufacturing something illicit, those fumes rise.

4. Carbon Monoxide (CO)​

Fatigue and headaches are classic low-level CO poisoning symptoms.

• Does she have a working CO detector? Even with baseboard heat (usually electric or hydronic), if there is a gas water heater or stove, or if the garage is below her, this is a safety critical check.

Suggested Action Plan​

Since medical tests are clear, this is almost certainly environmental (Sick Building Syndrome).

1. The "Zero Fragrance" Reset (2 Weeks): Immediate removal of all plug-ins and stop using Carpet Fresh. It takes time for those VOCs to off-gas from the walls/fabric.
2. Professional Extraction: Since you are in the industry, you know a standard vacuum can't pull the impacted powder out. The carpet needs a thorough HWE (Hot Water Extraction) with a pure rinse (no added fragrance) to flush out the "Carpet Fresh" buildup.
3. Seal the Apartment: If the carpet cleaning doesn't work, she may need to seal gaps around plumbing pipes and outlets to stop airflow from the unit below.

 

[bob vawter]

Actually She fully blamed the Plug ins, but I shared with her how Sassy said "She does use Carpet Fresh and plug ins."

this was her first response

1. The Immediate Suspects: Chemical Irritants​

The most glaring issues in the description are the "Carpet Fresh" and plug-in air fresheners.

• Plug-ins: These heat up oils and release VOCs (Volatile Organic Compounds) constantly. For sensitive individuals, this causes exactly the symptoms described: headaches, fatigue, and brain fog.
• Carpet Fresh (Powder): These powders are notoriously difficult to fully vacuum out. They settle at the base of the fibers and in the backing, eventually breaking down into fine particulate dust that gets kicked up every time she walks.
• The "Cocktail": Mixing cat dander + degrading powder + synthetic fragrance VOCs creates a high-load chemical environment. Since she has been there 5 years, the accumulation of the powder in the carpet backing could be significant.

2. The "Sink" Effect (Carpet)​

If the carpet is original to the building (25 years) or even just 5+ years old with two cats:

• The Pad: The carpet pad may be degrading or holding years of absorbed odors/liquids.
• Dust Mites: Even with baseboard heat (no forced air blowing dust around), the carpet acts as a "sink" for dust mites. If she developed a sensitivity to mites over the last 2 years, the carpet is the reservoir.

3. Air Intrusion (The Downstairs Factor)​

Since she is on the second floor, the "stack effect" means air from the apartment below often rises into hers through unsealed penetrations (around pipes under sinks, electrical outlets, baseboards).

• The Neighbors: Has the tenant below changed in the last 1.5 - 2 years?
• Risks: If the neighbor smokes, uses heavy incense, cooks with heavy spices, or (worst case) is manufacturing something illicit, those fumes rise.

4. Carbon Monoxide (CO)​

Fatigue and headaches are classic low-level CO poisoning symptoms.

• Does she have a working CO detector? Even with baseboard heat (usually electric or hydronic), if there is a gas water heater or stove, or if the garage is below her, this is a safety critical check.

Suggested Action Plan​

Since medical tests are clear, this is almost certainly environmental (Sick Building Syndrome).

1. The "Zero Fragrance" Reset (2 Weeks): Immediate removal of all plug-ins and stop using Carpet Fresh. It takes time for those VOCs to off-gas from the walls/fabric.
2. Professional Extraction: Since you are in the industry, you know a standard vacuum can't pull the impacted powder out. The carpet needs a thorough HWE (Hot Water Extraction) with a pure rinse (no added fragrance) to flush out the "Carpet Fresh" buildup.
3. Seal the Apartment: If the carpet cleaning doesn't work, she may need to seal gaps around plumbing pipes and outlets to stop airflow from the unit below.

Prolly mice!