How much equipment would you use?

Sticky

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There was 3 inches of water in a 600 sq ft unfinished basement w/ concrete slab and blocks. There was shelves made of 2 by 4's and a closet made of drywall and 2 by 4's. This happend on Wendesday night and I responded the same day. The customer tells me that they have an open house Sunday at 1pm.
How many Dehu's and air movers would you use? What is the standard for an unfinished basement?
 
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Dude,
No offense, but you have the resources at hand to get that advice. Honestly, if that is a question you need to ask you should hand it off to your cousin and work with him for the eduacation and experience.

Or pay me and I will come :D
 

TimP

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You need to know what class of loss and how much cubic ft of air. I think 1 large dehu would do that if it was 8 ft high cielings. And enough blowers to make the air move around like mad 4-8 if I had to guess.

Anyways you figure your need for dehumidification by the cubic ft and if it's a class 1-2-3-4 loss, like I said above.
 

Sticky

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I used 2 - 200ht Dehu's and 8- Airmovers and the adjuster said that I used too much equipment. He said they will only pay for 1 dehu and 4 air movers.

The reason I asked the question was to see what other people thought. I really don't think that I was using too much equipment.

Did I use too much equipment?

RH was 58% and the temp was 68 degrees. The ceilings were 9ft high.

Should the customer be responsible for what the insurance company doesn't pay for? The customer said they didn't care about any of the items that were damaged all they wanted was the house to be dry in time for open house. I think that I did a great job and got it dried in time for the customer. Doesn't the standard say every 8ft for airmovers?
 

Sticky

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The job has been completed. The customer was very happy with the job we did. We had everything dried cleaned and put back together before the open house Sunday morning. I stayed at the customers house until Midnight Saturday to get everything taken care of in time.
I also saved 4 Oriental Rugs that were brought back from India. The customer has 5000 dollars worth of coverage. My bill was $4860 the adjuster only wants to pay me $3800 what do you guys do in these situations? Is the customer responsible for the difference?
 
G

Guest

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Depends on whether or not you care if you work for this insurance co.again.Technically you did the work for the home owner and you go off your prices not his/hers,and small claims is really simple,so just say the word.Course if you want more work from them in the future,you could adjust your bill.
 

Farenheit251

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Considering it was only concrete slab and blocks I think the adjuster is being generous.

I wonder how much equipment they used to dry the slab when they poured it. It was really wet then.

I'm not saying what you did was unnecessary but you are not going to speed dry concrete. I would have been more inclined to use how much equipment you did the first day and then left one 200 dh for about 6 more days depend on readings.
 

Sticky

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My work authorization is from the franchise so I am confident that the customer is responsible for the balance. I would have normally used one dehu for 4 days but the customer said that they wanted me to gaurentee that it would be dry and clean by Sunday. I also saved 4 rugs that were from India. Shawn B. from steamway was in town and said each of the 4 rugs that I saved were over 2 grand a piece. I took them off site and dried/cleaned them. I also cleaned calcium deposits off the walls and cleaned the carpets in the whole house for the customer. I went out of my way to make sure that the house was ready for Sunday and stayed there until 12pm on a Saturday to make sure the house was ready for open house.
I told the customer that my bill was going to be 4-6 grand before I started the job. I really went out of my way to make this customer happy. I forgot to mention that Mrs Pifferton is a Chemo-therapy Doctor and Mr. Pifferton is a cardio vascular surgeon.
They had some BS insurance company that I had never heard of so I'm not too worried about the adjuster giving me more work. I did a great job and worked my ars off to get the job done right and in time. Why should I discount a thousand dollars and not get paid for my equipment when the customer knew the price before the job. I told her that each dehumidifier was $115 dollars per day. My invoice was done in Xactimate.
The customer has agreed to pay the difference but I feel bad charging them. I really feel like there insurance company should pay it.


Thanks for all your help guys. I just was wondering how you guys would deal with this situation. Do we always have to give into these adjusters?
I definitly learned that I need to know the S500 standard inside and out...stick to it and be ready to prove that I stuck to the standard in the future thats for sure.
Thanks again guys...
 

ronbeatty

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You did what the customer ask you to do. Don't adjust your invoice for the adjuster, you were not working for him. This was a case where you did what was in the best interest of the customer for the open house. Collect your money with a smile and they will probably recommend you to their friends. If you adjust your bill they will think you over charged them. These people wanted great service you gave it to them. :mrgreen:
 

kmdineen

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1122 gallons of water on concrete with block walls for a short period of time.
I don't know what your procedure was but $4860 sounds steep, so does the $3800, but I was not there so I really don't know. Was the calcium deposits from this loss? Did you bill the insurance company for cleaning all the carpets in the house?
The insurance company should pay to return the building and it's contents to a pre loss condition. I don't think the insurance company should have to pay extra so the structure is dried on the customers time table.
An E-TES blowing under 6 mill plastic would have dried the concrete quickly.
 

dealtimeman

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i agree with ron and you should turn the bill in and get paid what you charged. there is not going to be any easy way to explain the difference in charges other than you overcharged them. i dont think you overcharged them and dont get bullied by the insurance co either they always are going to want you to go lower but you have set prices and if you lower your then we have to lower ours. i am always hounded by adjusters to go lower and do not fold and all but one adjuster has recommended me so dont be afraid of the adjuster.
 

Desk Jockey

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I think it's too hard to say without seeing it.

Is it a basic box shape?

How affected is the the block?

What was the goal?

How dry does it need to be?

Are you going to do a calcium chloride test?

We don't get too aggressive at drying concrete unless there is a need. Normally on a same day water break we may only leave equipment a day, maybe two.

In the case of standing water as you described maybe a few days longer, 68-degrees is too cold for good drying in my opinion.

I would have heated the airspace up to get faster drying, RH is slightly elevated for OUR area. We have a damp basements.

Without seeing what you were drying I would say you probably left 1-dehumidifier and maybe a couple of airmovers more than we would have. *But that's without seeing it, it could be we would have left more equipment than you, depending on the circumstance. (E-Tes, Firebird)

I think if each of us were to do the job we would all leave different amounts of equipment. ?
 

LeeCory

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The amount of equipment you used is here nor there, I'd like to know how it totaled $4800.

I agree that it sounds like the adjuster is being very generous.

If you don't mind, I'd like to see a bit of the breakdown.
 

Sticky

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Emergency service call - after business 1.00 EA 0.00 250.00 250.00
hours
Equip. setup, take down & monitoring - 10.00 HR 0.00 44.47 444.70
after hrs
Plastic bag - used for disposal of 18.00 EA 0.00 1.50 27.00
contaminated items
Content Manipulation charge - per hour 6.00 HR 0.00 27.31 163.86
Content Manipulation charge - per hour - 12.00 HR 0.00 38.74 464.88
after hours
Haul debris - per pickup truck load - 1.00 EA 150.00 0.00 150.00
including dump fees
Area Items Total: Main Level 1,500.44

Room: Basement Ceiling Height: 8'
728.00 SF Walls
1,242.50 SF Walls & Ceiling
57.17 SY Flooring
91.00 LF Ceil. Perimeter
514.50 SF Ceiling
514.50 SF Floor
91.00 LF Floor Perimeter
DESCRIPTION QNTY REMOVE REPLACE TOTAL
Apply anti-microbial agent 784.00 SF 0.00 0.18 141.12
Air mover (per 24 hour period) - No 3.00 DA 0.00 30.00 90.00
monitoring
Air mover (per 24 hour period) - No 3.00 DA 0.00 30.00 90.00
monitoring
Air mover (per 24 hour period) - No 3.00 DA 0.00 30.00 90.00
monitoring
Air mover (per 24 hour period) - No 3.00 DA 0.00 30.00 90.00
monitoring
Air mover (per 24 hour period) - No 3.00 DA 0.00 30.00 90.00

DESCRIPTION QNTY REMOVE REPLACE TOTAL
Air mover (per 24 hour period) - No 3.00 DA 0.00 30.00 90.00
monitoring
Air mover (per 24 hour period) - No 3.00 DA 0.00 30.00 90.00
monitoring
Air mover (per 24 hour period) - No 3.00 DA 0.00 30.00 90.00
monitoring
Dehumidifier (per 24 hour period) - XLarge 3.00 EA 0.00 115.00 345.00
- No monitoring
Dehumidifier (per 24 hour period) - XLarge 3.00 EA 0.00 115.00 345.00
- No monitoring
Water extract from floor - Gray water - 418.00 SF 0.00 0.71 296.78
after business hrs
Hang dry custom oriental rug in plant 82.00 SF 0.00 0.40 32.80
Transport carpet for drying 418.00 SF 0.00 0.18 75.24
Clean and deodorize carpet - heavy staining 82.00 SF 0.00 3.00 246.00
Oriental rugs
Lay existing carpet - labor only 514.50 SF 0.00 0.49 252.11
Clean and deodorize carpet 165.00 SF 0.00 0.45 74.25
Clean the surface area with pressure steam 784.00 SF 0.00 0.59 462.56
Room Totals: Basement 2,990.86
Area Items Total: Main Level 4,491.30
Line Item Totals: 2009-03-13-2123 4,491.30


Line Item Total 4,491.30
Total Tax(Rep-Maint) @ 8.000% x 4,491.30 359.30
Replacement Cost Value 4,850.60
Net Claim 4,850.60


I copied and pasted the bill hope you guys can read it.
Let me know what you think?
Thanks for all the help guys! I'm just starting out on my own this is my 5th week in business and only my 4th flood job on my own.
 

Sticky

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Remember I am in NY and we are zone 2 idk if that makes that big of a difference?
 

dealtimeman

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looks fine to me and yes your zone does matter! you put that extra dehu in there because your customer, the owner requested fastest posible dry timesand actually wanted it dry on a certian day. that was a premium service and must be paid as one. if you did the work and your customer is happy with the overall quality and result of the job you should not question your price and move forword with your bill and expect full payment. i dont undfestand what the problem is everyone here agrees that the extra dehu was not neccessary to dry it, but it was neccesary to dry it faster. i am a bit confused as to how it was only 68 degrees in there with all that equipment, i would have imagined it to be a bit warmer with thos dehus in close proximty of each other. was the a/c on?
 

Sticky

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Sorry guys for not clarifying The 68 degree was the temp when I got to the job.(I should have clarified)
There was a marine grade carpet 14 by 24 that I took out of the basement and back to my facility to hang dry, clean, disinifect and deodorize. (I might have just replaced this rug but the customer had open house)

Thanks for all the help. I will try to post some pics later...
 

Sticky

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The BS insurance company was called Sterling. I've been doing water damage jobs around here for 8 years and never did a job for them.
 
G

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Bill custy's; let them deal with the adjuster; Custy's called ya and needed super service you provided. You earned every penny.
 
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The problem with adding additional equipment is that the end does not always justify the means.

There are a lot of factors that need to be considered as to how to gain the most efficiency from a drying project.
 

LeeCory

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Craig Lindquist said:
The problem with adding additional equipment is that the end does not always justify the means.

There are a lot of factors that need to be considered as to how to gain the most efficiency from a drying project.

Craig, What would you have done differently to achieve better efficiency? Please expand....
 

dealtimeman

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efficiency was not the end consumers main concern in this particular case. they didnt ask to make sure every machine was operating at 100% potential, they asked him to dry it as fast as he could and to be done on a certain time. true this is not possible to forcast or even to reproduce but if i understand it correctly he made it happen and he dried it in time for their open house. that for me would be a home run and a cheerleader for life oppertunity. now if the insurance does not want to pay the extra dehu or whatever they think was too much equipment, then the homeowner ( his customer) should either fight for payment as the insurance's customer, or pay the difference out of pocket.

also was drying plan drawn out and monitored daily? if so why do you not just provide the data and let the data speak for itself.

if you did not take multiple readings and show the process of drying then you have little room for discusion and would take this as a learning lesson and always do a drying plan and always monitor your system for both flaws and or progress.
 

Sticky

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Just wanted to update this...The adjuster wouldnt call me back but he sent a check to the home owner and paid in full! thanks guy.
I definetly learned a lot on this job....I love restoration....
 

Ed

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We do several Sterling jobs per year. They are a local insurance company based somewhere between you and me. I've never had problems with them.
 

Sticky

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Ed said:
We do several Sterling jobs per year. They are a local insurance company based somewhere between you and me. I've never had problems with them.
I didn't have a problem with Sterling I had a problem with the independent adjuster that sterling had hired. All is good, I got paid for the job and my customer is more then happy. We are working on rebuild I will post pics of before and after when I am done. Thanks for the advice.
 

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