How much lift? (question)

[Mike Draper]

Here is the deallyo. Two exact same truck mounts........the first truck has 150' run of 2" hose. the second truck has 150' run of 2.5" hose. I know the 2.5" hose will have much more CFM at the end of the hose run than the truck with the 2" hose, but will one truck have more lift at the end of the hose than the other? Thanks.

 

[Mike Draper]

Copper please don't respond, cuz I know you don't know the answer.

 

[Scott Rogers]

Not sure about the end of the hose, but at the Mount the gauge on the unit with 2" hose will read higher

 

[Dolly Llama]

Here is the deallyo. Two exact same truck mounts........the first truck has 150' run of 2" hose. the second truck has 150' run of 2.5" hose. I know the 2.5" hose will have much more CFM at the end of the hose run than the truck with the 2" hose, but will one truck have more lift at the end of the hose than the other? Thanks.

you mean if you capped off the end of the hoses?
if so, nope.
They're both reach the hg you have your relief valve set at

you mean with the both hoses open?
if so, yes, cause the 2" creates more restriction.

I'm guessing you'll read about 5 to 7hg with 150ft of open 2" hose
and maybe 2-4hg with 150ft of open 2.5" hose

those are just guesses though cause I've really never paid much attention to what the hg reads w/150ft of open 2" hose
and don't own 150ft of 2.5"

..L.T.A.

 

[Larry Cobb]

Mike;

The increased cleaning ability when the wand is on the carpet is due to: ......

Increased Lift.

That generates more CFM in the hose.

2.5" hose will lose less lift than 2" hose.

"Higher Lift" is the concept that we try to optimize in our TM blower design.

Larry

 

[Greenie]

2.5" hose will lose less lift than 2" hose.

Exactly.

and any TM builder that was interested in preserving lift in a system would have used full sized blower plumbing through the system from day one, just look at a TNT from 30 years ago.

 

[Larry Cobb]

Silencers & HX's are where you should be looking at reducing losses, Greenie.

Several times more restriction than the difference between 2.5" and 3" plumbing for 2 feet.

Larry

 

[Greenie]

A high flow silencer just makes sense and is a gimme, restricting blower plumbing and having excessive bends and tight angles is just assinine, it's the easiest part, if a blower has a 4" port, just use a 4" pipe, what is the big deal?

 

[Rex Tyus]

Here is the deallyo. Two exact same truck mounts........the first truck has 150' run of 2" hose. the second truck has 150' run of 2.5" hose. I know the 2.5" hose will have much more CFM at the end of the hose run than the truck with the 2" hose, but will one truck have more lift at the end of the hose than the other? Thanks.

YES

 

[Rex Tyus]

Silencers are where you be looking at reducing losses, Greenie.

Far more restriction than the difference between 2.5" and 3" plumbing for 2 feet.

Larry

I wasn't going to respond because I have given up debateing real world numbers with Larry. But for the spectators. A silencer's "restriction" is on the exhaust side. It is measured in PSI. It is not the same as an intake restriction that is measured in hg's. Both have tolerences that limit performance. The psi limits the cfm,not so much the lift unless you have a torque limitation issue. But I have a real bad headache today and will leave it at that.

I will say that I thought Larry had posted he had opened up his plumbing. A 3" intake from blower port to waste tank is good if you are using a #4 blower. I sure hope Larry isn't condoning the elemination of 25% of the intake potential of a #5 :shock: It makes absolutely no sense to restrict the plumbing on a blower on the intake side. "Assinine" is too soft of a term. It is just plain stupid. It reduces performance and reduces fuel economy. The ONLY advantage is it will create a little more heat if one is too lazy to make a good heat exchanger.

Qualification statement. I am just a broke dick carpet cleaner. But I did pass 9th grade math class.

 

[Greenie]

another unanswered post....there are many.

Keep the tough questions coming Rex, HUNDREDS of daily readers here deserve to know the truth.

 

[Chris A]

Soon even Mikey will be hooking up his trusty Ti to a TNT!

 

[Lyman]

But, does it make any difference when you hook up to a 2 inch wand.

 

[Out of Character - 0]

No, all of us who lug around fat heavy hose are just dumb sheep.















YES

 

[Rex Tyus]

But, does it make any difference when you hook up to a 2 inch wand.

Do you get more pressure from a 3/4" water hose attached to a nozzle than you do a 1/4" hose attached to the same nozzle at the end of 150' when you are washing down your sidewalk?

Same principle just in reverse.

 

[Larry Cobb]

A high flow silencer just makes sense and is a gimme, restricting blower plumbing and having excessive bends and tight angles is just assinine, it's the easiest part, if a blower has a 4" port, just use a 4" pipe, what is the big deal?

Greenie;

Why aren't you using 4" Vac Hose ?

You have a "Hundred Feet" of vac hose extended from the truck.

Larry

 

[Greenie]

Because on a 4" blower I am using 2 - 2.5" vac hoses.

 

[Rex Tyus]

A high flow silencer just makes sense and is a gimme, restricting blower plumbing and having excessive bends and tight angles is just assinine, it's the easiest part, if a blower has a 4" port, just use a 4" pipe, what is the big deal?

Greenie;

Why aren't you using 4" Vac Hose ?

You have a "Hundred Feet" of vac hose extended from the truck.

Larry

The fact that so many 56 blowers are choked down on the intake are the reason people think you can't dual wand effectively with a 56. It is a damn shame.

 

[TimP]

A high flow silencer just makes sense and is a gimme, restricting blower plumbing and having excessive bends and tight angles is just assinine, it's the easiest part, if a blower has a 4" port, just use a 4" pipe, what is the big deal?

Greenie;

Why aren't you using 4" Vac Hose ?

You have a "Hundred Feet" of vac hose extended from the truck.

Larry

Forgive me but you sound like you're just looking for ways to cheapen out the design of your system.

You want the better plumbing to the waste tank which the way I see it can hold potential energy or vacuum in this case. Also on a 56-59 blower many people like to dual wand with them and therefore it should be plumbed properly to the tank. Dual 2.5 hose ports need the larger internal plumbing.


BTW what kind of savings does it give you when you plumb a blower smaller than the intake??? Is it really worth it??? The whole vacuum system should have the least restrictions as possible. Of course within financial reason. A couple of hundred bucks is well within reason.

 

[Shawn Forsythe]

The fact that so many 56 blowers are choked down on the intake are the reason people think you can't dual wand effectively with a 56. It is a damn shame.

That's partly it (maybe mostly it), but there's more. Engine speed, blower speed through reduction, vac relief valves that bypass loads of cfm with the slightest of load, etc.

 

[Greenie]

I'm usually playin' 2nd fiddle to Shawn's wisdom, so I'm just gonna nod in agreeance.

That said if guys really saw what a properly plumbed 500cfm blower could do with some 2.5" hose out to each wand, they wouldn't be looking for much more, it's actually the Heat that keeps most "dual wand" units in check....and one reason fuel burners will never fall by roadside for those at are serious about having over 200 deg. at each high flow wand.

 

[ACE]

A high flow silencer just makes sense and is a gimme, restricting blower plumbing and having excessive bends and tight angles is just assinine, it's the easiest part, if a blower has a 4" port, just use a 4" pipe, what is the big deal?

Half of the TM's out there have a 90 degree elbow right off the recovery tank, dumbest thing ever.

 

[Eric Valentine]

Half of the TM's out there have a 90 degree elbow right off the recovery tank, dumbest thing ever.

I agree. Mine is one of them. 2.5" from the recovery tank to the blower, and it is choked down out of the recovery tank with a 2" elbow. Taking off the elbow, going with 2.5" hose from the tank, and getting rid of the restrictive plastic joiner barbs will do the most good for me.