KISS (Keep It Simple Stupid)

[ACE]

When I fist logged on this forum I basically had a 2 step cleaning process (Pre-spray and Extract). Now the cleaning process includes through vacuuming, machine agitation, advanced stain / odor removal and often post padding commercial. I want to thank you for giving me some pointers on how to get great results. My customers now do most of my marketing for me.

On the down side:
My production rate has tanked and even with price increases, I struggle to make $100/ hr without a helper.
The 6-7+ step process is also makes it much harder to train employees.
My current pricing for this level of service does not lend itself to Price-point advertising.

I really want to find a way to streamline operations while still offering a good perception of value to clients. In this economy, I honestly don’t think there is much opportunity for growth of a “high end” cleaning company.
As an Owner Op, I am set for life. As a business model for a multi truck operation, I’m back to square one. How do I find a unique place in the market that I can grow into a multi-truck operation?

 

[Contemporary Carpet Clean]

Ace,

Give people options on different levels of "clean".

We have been in business 37 years and hardly ever pre vacuumed, post padded and or agitated pre spray. We have over 5000 to 6000 customers....mostly word of mouth and repeat. Most jobs do not require you to talk all of those extra steps to get visually clean carpet.

Do you think the Coits, Stanley Steemers, and Sears of the world do all these extra steps?......NOT A FREAKIN chance! I am not comparing our business to theirs....I am just saying....in order for those companies to stay in business they must be doing something right/pleasing their custys somehow. That is why the big box stores price their cleanings the way they do.

I understand your desire to do the "best carpet cleaning ever", but sometimes a decent amount of customers do not want to pay for that.

In my opinion if you want to grow your business, give choices on what will be done in your cleaning process (especially if you feel that there is not alot of room to grow on the high end). Most people will choose the mid grade cleaning. At least you will have different choices for your custys and be able to do them at different price points.

 

[Brian R]

Clean has nothing to do with it.....Ok, it needs to be clean...but that's NOT why they call you back.


Your customer service, image and attitude is everything.


Vacuum if needed...almost never.....Prespray and clean the carpet. Don't groom because the wand should leave pretty patterns in the carpet if done right.

Do the double overlap pattern that I've explained in the past for a nice look and a good dry time.


You don't need all those steps on 95% of your jobs.

If you have to do more...Charge more.

Never sacrifice the level of cleaning....Clean the carpet no matter what. Just charge for what will take more time and effort.



Getting back to the customer service thing.
Look pretty, smile, be friendly and genuinely give a damn and you will be golden.



Since I've started OPEing myself instead of subbing out to HWE guys my repeats and referrals have went through the roof.

It's not the "clean" I provide. It's my award winning personallity. !gotcha!

 

[SRI Cleaning]

I agree. Do what works best for you. Some people want to pay for all of the bells and whistles but in reality MOST do not.

 

[floorguy]

I agree. Do what works best for you. Some people want to pay for all of the bells and whistles but in reality MOST do not.

ding ding...

we have a winner......to bad there will be others that will come and blah blah blah things....

when in reality THIS is the only statement

 

[Mike Draper]

yeah, I agree, when I walk onto the car lot I want the most base model car I can find. I dont want leather, v-6, crusie control, AC, heated seats, alloy wheels or any other options. Just basic everything and this is what almost everyone wants. I CALL BULLSHIT. hey Marty, blow me Because even in this economy when I give my clients the choice between the basic cleaning and our premium cleaning 7 out of 10 choose the premium. People always want the nicer option and we do the same thing when we go shopping. DOUG, why do you always have the nicest cell phones and not one of those basic Kricket phones? Why do our wives shop for clothes at designer stores when walmart has all the clothes you could ever need? Why do we choose to go to a nice restaurant and pay $20+ for a steak when we can get a .99 hamburger at Mc. Donald's? Do we really need an Ipod, Ipad, Do I really need the Fancy Truck mount I have? the answer is No, we dont need all this fancy shit, but people want it anyhow, so if your to dumb to offer it someone else will come along and do it and they will make the money. ACE, raise your prices to reflect your services, if there is value in your service people will want it. 8)

 

[ACE]

I know that despite a down economy, people will spend money on ipads, BMWs and shiny new machines. The difference is, carpet cleaning is not sexy. The logic I see in use is; lets save same money on cleaning so we can buy more shiny sexy crap we don’t need.

Don’t believe me? Go to that statehouse or BMW dealership and try to explain why you want to charge 2 or 3 times as much to clean as the next guy.

 

[Mike Draper]

I know that despite a down economy, people will spend money on ipads, BMWs and shiny new machines. The difference is, carpet cleaning is not sexy. The logic I see in use is; lets save same money on cleaning so we can buy more shiny sexy crap we don’t need.

Don’t believe me? Go to that statehouse or BMW dealership and try to explain why you want to charge 2 or 3 times as much to clean as the next guy.

It seems you have 3 decisions to make, lower your standard of cleaning and up your production rate per hour, or keep your high standard of cleaning and raise your prices to reflect your value of service. Or, keep making next to nothing after expenses and work harder for that $. If all carpet cleaning is the same as you stated in your bmw analogy, then go purchase a protable and a shitty wand and put more $ in your pocket.

 

[hogjowl]

Mike:

I have intentionally not read the responses of those who have posted before me but I know from my experience here, and on other boards, over the years just what kind of responses you are getting. Please let me tell you what I have found to be the case here in pigsville. Bulletin board pricing and production suggestions will kill you.

Stop listening to what you read on the boards and go back to what you intuitively know to be correct.

 

[floorguy]

Creature comforts my friend...creature comforts...examples..

Carpet cleaning uhhh no just want it cleaned with out getting hosed....

Truck...yes I want as nice a truck as i can AFFORD...and what I WANT....i dont want to spend 50k on a NEW truck, a slightly used one for half is nice...shopping around nor could i afford it

Phone...i use this mofo (ha and it is made by Motorola and its a photon..mofo ) every day all day, it provides me multiple things i need through the day....shoot even porn if needed 8) 8) 8)

My wife shops the bargins...clothes, food, doesnt matter

Just bought a NEW mattress set....last years Model...so it was like 50% off...still new yet i am not paying top $$$ and it was a top model


Not saying if you CAN COMMAND it to not do it....but I dont target that demographic

so thats why it needs to be KISS, and do what you gotta do.....

 

[Brian R]

yeah, I agree, when I walk onto the car lot I want the most base model car I can find. I dont want leather, v-6, crusie control, AC, heated seats, alloy wheels or any other options. Just basic everything and this is what almost everyone wants. I CALL BULLSHIT. hey Marty, blow me Because even in this economy when I give my clients the choice between the basic cleaning and our premium cleaning 7 out of 10 choose the premium. People always want the nicer option and we do the same thing when we go shopping. DOUG, why do you always have the nicest cell phones and not one of those basic Kricket phones? Why do our wives shop for clothes at designer stores when walmart has all the clothes you could ever need? Why do we choose to go to a nice restaurant and pay $20+ for a steak when we can get a .99 hamburger at Mc. Donald's? Do we really need an Ipod, Ipad, Do I really need the Fancy Truck mount I have? the answer is No, we dont need all this fancy shit, but people want it anyhow, so if your to dumb to offer it someone else will come along and do it and they will make the money. ACE, raise your prices to reflect your services, if there is value in your service people will want it. 8)

Irony


Bells and whistles are great but don't let them keep you from making money.

By the way, most won't buy the super loaded car unless they have disposable income...They go with the middle deal.

Just like carpet cleaning

 

[Mike Draper]

People will always go with what they see value in. As a business owner its my job to proivde the custy as much peceived value as possible so as to be the most proffitable. Or if I don't beieve in my work I can just give them what evryone else offers and tell them "its all the same, so why pay more".

 

[Brian R]

People will always go with what they see value in. As a business owner its my job to proivde the custy as much peceived value as possible so as to be the most proffitable. Or if I don't beieve in my work I can just give them what evryone else offers and tell them "its all the same, so why pay more".

I concur

 

[Desk Jockey]

Offer both an Economy and a Preminum cleaning letting them chose the level of service.

If you really think they will mainly chose the lesser, then up both but up the Economy more, narrowing the difference between the two.

If it's just habit for them to chose the Economy then you're still ahead when they do. If they think about it and want all the extras choosing the Preminum level then you even further ahead.

 

[lance]

Maybe you don't gross $100.00 an hour but you are not running the TM the whole time you are on the job. Doing those extra steps takes the most time and they don't need a TM to get done. So maybe you are as profitable or even more profitable as other CC'ers.

With 10 years in the biz why don't you have a full time helper/tech? You can't have multiple trucks without employees to drive the other vans. And you have to have enough jobs for those extra vans to work.

You should be doing everything possible to have lots of work for you and a helper. You are doing a good job now and getting lots of referrels and repeats. You have higher prices also but your "production times" are lower than you like. You can cheat a little and just scrub the traffic lanes, clean with the wand a little faster than you do now, and maybe that will give you enough time during the week to fit in more jobs. But having a helper with you will do the same or more as your production should go way up and you are making more money per hour.....plus you aren't as tired as you would be by yourself.

In order to have another van on the road you will have to have your helper learn to be as good as you are, then send him out in a van and do jobs. You will be in another van doing jobs. When you feel comfortable with that you will need to hire a helper for your van, train him well, and then let him be the helper to your Tech in the other van. Now you have a van with a well trained tech and a well trained helper. You also have a van for yourself. Then you will need to find a helper to help you.

You are now a multi-van, multi-employee business. Just repeat the process until you are happy with the results. Some owners want one man per van, some wnat two men per van. You will have to decide what is best for you. Personally, I would take Snow's business plan and have a tech and a helper on each van. If it works for him it probably will work for you.

Are you answering the phones? If so, switch to Full Circle as that will help you have better production times and later on will allow you to focus on running your business with employees.

In order to expand you will have to let go of the reins a bit and trust that you have trained the techs well enough to represent you at each job. They will do well if you treat them well and pay them a good wage or commission or both. Most people would rather have a job that is enjoyable and treats them with respect than a job where they make lots of money but they hate every hour of working there. A full-time helper is your ticket to a business that someday will get you off the truck, but everyone that cleans will be a "clone" of you.

Later on, if you want, you could always have one van for economy cleaning services and another for the premium cleaning jobs. No body says you have to have all your vans and employees doing the same exact level of work for the same exact money and customers. Full Circle will give you the flexibility to have both ways of doing things. They can schedule each customer with the type of cleaning that they want to receive and pay for.

These are some of the things I have learned from others on this board. You have options just decide how well they fit you and then go for it. Also talk to Ken Snow and that Harper guy so that they can help you with short and long term planning. You have great resources here so use them as much as possible and also use your years of experience to show you what you need to do. You have a great business now so just raise it up to the next level and keep doing what works well for you.

You're very fortunate to have repeats and referrels.....treat them well. Market to them as much as possible and they will help your business to grow with the highest profit margins possible. What you keep is more important than what you make.

 

[Ron Werner]

Clean has nothing to do with it.....Ok, it needs to be clean...but that's NOT why they call you back.


Your customer service, image and attitude is everything.


Vacuum if needed...almost never.....Prespray and clean the carpet. Don't groom because the wand should leave pretty patterns in the carpet if done right.

Do the double overlap pattern that I've explained in the past for a nice look and a good dry time.


You don't need all those steps on 95% of your jobs.

If you have to do more...Charge more.

Never sacrifice the level of cleaning....Clean the carpet no matter what. Just charge for what will take more time and effort.



Getting back to the customer service thing.
Look pretty, smile, be friendly and genuinely give a damn and you will be golden.



Since I've started OPEing myself instead of subbing out to HWE guys my repeats and referrals have went through the roof.

It's not the "clean" I provide. It's my award winning personallity. !gotcha!

Yep, I agree, it HAS to be your personality!!

Mike, You can find a unique place at whatever level you want to clean.
I just spent the day at a home show telling people about how carpets SHOULD be cleaned vs what they've experienced. When I explain about the vacuuming etc, they say That makes sense. There's a client.
with that said, I understand about the economy the way it is. So my basic clean will be my normal prevac, prespray, groom, rinse, with moving furn etc at 55 cents.
If they don't want that I can offer My 2nd Best , ie without vacuuming
If they dont want that I offer "Just like the other guy but better" service, where I just prespray rinse.
I am going to make sure they understand that with each drop in level of service I need to decrease what I will consider warranteed. After all, if I'm going to clean like a hack, don't expect perfect results.

I should still be able to make the $100/hr criteria since with each drop in service level is a drop in time commitment. You can vary other services as well based on furn moving/traffic area cleaning, etc

 

[Brian R]

As long as my customers are "Happy" right?
!gotcha!

 

[Ron Werner]

is it?

 

[Brian R]

Yes

 

[Ron Werner]

until customers learn what the difference is, until then ignorance is bliss

 

[Dolly Llama]

Now the cleaning process includes through vacuuming, machine agitation, advanced stain / odor removal and often post padding commercial

you're probably doing more than you need to do on most of your jobs .
if most of your res jobs need mechanical agitation, you need a new pre-spray .

post padding com (or anything) is a waste of time (if you know how to clean in the first place)
the only time post padding is needed is when the subfloor is so uneven the wand won't lay flat to get good extraction .

vaccing;
vac when needed or vac every job.
But if your find yourself mesmerized by the whine of a 12 amp motor and feel the need to "wernerize' every carpet, you have an illness ...tell the doc you need some pills

advanced spotting;
we charge enough that we don't charge extra for one or two red stains that need steamed out.
But several rooms full gets an additional charge


as Marty mentioned, if you go along with half the chit you hear on the boards , you'll be the greatest CC'er that never made much money .

The goal is NOT to be the greatest carpet cleaner to ever sling a wand .
The goal isn't to be the highest priced cleaner with the most steps and/or board de jour tools

the goal is to be profitable and make custys love you...period


..L.T.A.

 

[Ron Werner]

I think too many cleaners have used that as their goal and not measured up to the latter part of it
hence the popularity of replacing carpet for hard surface. Many people think carpet is just SO disgusting they never want it in their house again. They never had it cleaned often enough and when they did they probably chose a cleaner based on price and he did just enough to make the carpet "look" clean.

I'm talking to a lot of people at a home show and the light bulb comes on once I explain cleaning for hygenics rather than just esthetics

Don't need to spend hours cleaning every job, but if you discover it needs it, let them know, or be able to recognize when "basic" cleaning isn't going to cut it in advance.

 

[Brian R]

until customers learn what the difference is, until then ignorance is bliss

Ignorance is doing more only to do more.

 

[Dolly Llama]

until customers learn what the difference is, until then ignorance is bliss

think so, Ron??
I think you have OCCD (obsessive compulsive cleaning disorder) .
I'd venture a guess that you "overkill" 70% of your jobs

The well maintained and minimal/moderate soil jobs you spend several hours on, could be done by Ken's best crew in a 1/3 of the time at 1/4 the cost

Mrs Phiff won't notice the difference between your or their job the next day... or the next year when they call Ken's boys back

Your market is for anal OCCD peeps like yourself .
That's a limited niche market


..L.T.A.

 

[Bucey]

how does Brian live with so much hating going on. Ivebeensold

 

[Dolly Llama]

I'm talking to a lot of people at a home show and the light bulb comes on once I explain cleaning for hygenics rather than just esthetics

sorry, Ron, but the cleaning for "health" angle has got to be one of the dumbest, most short sighted marketing strategies to come donw the pike in a long time .



think for a minute,

Mrs Phiff, you carpet is a "sink" that fills with all manner of gross contaminates and filth.
If you don't empty that "sink", you'll live in an unhealthy environment.
You need us to come "empty your sink" regularly and often or you and your kids will die a slow miserable death :shock: "


now guess what?
you were so convincing that their carpet is a cesspool that needs to be "thoroughly" decontaminated for proper hygiene, they now see the virtue of your OCCD methods .
here's the rub, the average folk may not be able to afford $100 dollar a room cleaning .
BUT..you've convinced them it NEEDS it.
then they get out the ole calculator and start figgerin'.

"you know Ethel " , Says Elmer to his spouse

"Ron's got me thinking we should yank out the carpet and put in hard surface flooring.
That way we can easily clean it ourselves and not worry about the all the germs fermenting in our carpet.
We'll save lots of money over the life of the floor, and we'll be healthier too !"




You're choking the goose that lays the golden eggs by pushing the "hygiene/health" angle


..l.T.A.

 

[FLYERMAN]

Two thoughts come to my mind.

If you're getting your jobs by word of mouth you're saving on advertising and don't need to hit a hundred an hour all the time.

Second thought, the best thing I ever learned about employees was to make them helpers first. Remember if they were as good as you they'd have your job. Don't try to teach them to be cleaners from day one. If they don't catch on then you didn't lose any time training them.

For example I would clean going across the room one direction and give them the wand to do the dry stroke on the way back across the room. That way they learned the stroke without having to learn when/how to key the wand correctly. The first thing/area they cleaned on their own was the stairs. That way they couldn't break too many things and didn't have so much to think about while cleaning. Well around here any way they'd be gone by then and that is why I quit hiring and do it all myself.

 

[Ron Werner]

think for a minute,

Mrs Phiff, you carpet is a "sink" that fills with all manner of gross contaminates and filth.
If you don't empty that "sink", you'll live in an unhealthy environment.
You need us to come "empty your sink" regularly and often or you and your kids will die a slow miserable death :shock: "

NO, you think.
Why do you think there was a market for the SOA, because cleaners were doing such a wonderful job they decided to measure that miniscule amount of soil left in a carpet?
No, because the vast majority of cleaners were doing such a lousy job that the soil load remaining in carpet was prematurely wearing it out and the "professionals" weren't removing it.

The cleaning for health angle was only short sighted by the improper way many cleaners marketed it.
It was only dumb to some cleaners because it was forcing them to step up their game rather than walk in, spray it down, suck it up and boastfully say, "Look Mrs Piff at how clean your carpet is."

I tell them their carpet is an airfilter and that when its clean they can breathe easier. The allergens are on their floor anyway, whether carpeted or hard sfc, so ripping up the carpet is not the answer, a proper cleaning is. If you explain it right, they understand rather than be scared and want to rip it up. When I explain about removing dry particulates first, almost EVERY time, the reply is "That makes sense." And if you market well to your existing client base, you'll be "maintaining" those carpets and they will only need a restorative cleaning once. After that you can get away with a fluff job.


When you finish a job do you tell your customers that the carpet is "clean" or that it "looks clean"?
I can tell them that's as clean as I can get it. Its not rocket science, we ALL know how to clean, its not about being some stupid name calling of OCCD. Too many cleaners suffer from MCS, they just want the money with the least effort.

When I cleaned that room in that first video I made, I could have cleaned it like EVERYONE else, charged about $130, vacuumed it with a commercial bag vacuum in 10-15min, presprayed and rinsed it and done 50 min later at most. Owner wouldn't have known any different, I wouldn't have known any different, carpet would have looked clean, I get paid, everyone is happy. Is that what you would do Larry?

My challenge is I started using a vacuum that was showing me what I was missing.
My mistake was thinking I could share this with other cleaners and as PROFESSIONALS they would want to improve their cleaning also. Boy have I taken a shit kickin over the past 15yrs for just wanting to help guys do a better job.

I'm just marketing how cleaning SHOULD be done. I didn't think it up; wasn't my original idea. Cleaners thought of this method years before thats why its in the Standard, its why they teach it. I'm not that special, just dumb enough to do what I was taught to do and just asking a fair price compared with what others are already charging. Hec, the cheap cleaners will charge $100/rm by the time they add up all those extras and then do a shitty job. I just charge $100/room and do what I told them I would do.
I don't want to clean 1000 jobs a year.

If they don't want to spend $100/rm, I tell them I can clean like the other guys and charge less, just don't ask me to warrantee it the same as my best. Knowing myself, I'll work extra on a browning area anyway but I'll know I could have vacuumed this and it wouldn't have been an issue.

 

[Dolly Llama]

Why do you think there was a market for the SOA,

there is???

because cleaners were doing such a wonderful job they decided to measure that miniscule amount of soil left in a carpet?

maybe they just need as SOA "approved" Rug Doctor .
Thy can rent one at the local Piggly-Wiggly grocery store

The cleaning for health angle was only short sighted by the improper way many cleaners marketed it.
It was only dumb to some cleaners because it was forcing them to step up their game

no, Ron.
It's dumb because it's choking the goose that lays the golden egg.
It has nothing to do with providing a quality job

If you explain it right, they understand rather than be scared and want to rip it up. When I explain about removing dry particulates first, almost EVERY time, the reply is "That makes sense." And if you market well to your existing client base, you'll be "maintaining" those carpets and they will only need a restorative cleaning once. After that you can get away with a fluff job.

ONLY if they vac right, with a vac that's clean/running properly .
You and I both know the overwhelming majority of folks don't.

So every year you show Mrs Pfiff how much "allergens" you pulled out of her "filter" by proudly displaying your dust cup full of crUd pulled out of a carpet she just vac'd yesterday .
You're rightly proud of the fact you vac'd that last bit of particulate from her "filter" and want to show her what a great job you did.

You actually do two things by doing that;

1.) you just pointed out what a crappy housekeeper she is :shock:
2.) you illustrated that if she doesn't pay $400 a year on one 200sf room, (for you to clean it properly 4 times a year) she's living with those allergens 6-8 months a year.
(She can dust mop a hard floor every week for the price of a mircofiber Swifter)

When I cleaned that room in that first video I made, I could have cleaned it like EVERYONE else, charged about $130, vacuumed it with a commercial bag vacuum in 10-15min, presprayed and rinsed it and done 50 min later at most. Owner wouldn't have known any different, I wouldn't have known any different, carpet would have looked clean, I get paid, everyone is happy. Is that what you would do Larry?

the short answer is a resounding YES.
cause that's all MOST people want or need

its not about being some stupid name calling of OCCD

Ron, my OCCD comment wasn't intended to be stupid or derogatory, I promise.
I think it's valid cause it's out of the norm for even the better cleaners

there is quite a difference between crappy work, quality work and overkill.
If you're as busy as you want to be, i say more power to you!
I couldn't think of anyone else on this board I'd rather have clean Joni's carpets.
But the fact that you're even considering offering an "inferior" (to you) level of clean suggests your market niche may not be large enough to support your level of "clean"


nothing more, nothing le$$



..L.T.A.

 

[Hoody]

Why do you think there was a market for the SOA,

there is???


[quote:1aykr1j9]because cleaners were doing such a wonderful job they decided to measure that miniscule amount of soil left in a carpet?

maybe they just need as SOA "approved" Rug Doctor .
Thy can rent one at the local Piggly-Wiggly grocery store

The cleaning for health angle was only short sighted by the improper way many cleaners marketed it.
It was only dumb to some cleaners because it was forcing them to step up their game

no, Ron.
It's dumb because it's choking the goose that lays the golden egg.
It has nothing to do with providing a quality job

If you explain it right, they understand rather than be scared and want to rip it up. When I explain about removing dry particulates first, almost EVERY time, the reply is "That makes sense." And if you market well to your existing client base, you'll be "maintaining" those carpets and they will only need a restorative cleaning once. After that you can get away with a fluff job.

ONLY if they vac right, with a vac that's clean/running properly .
You and I both know the overwhelming majority of folks don't.

So every year you show Mrs Pfiff how much "allergens" you pulled out of her "filter" by proudly displaying your dust cup full of crUd pulled out of a carpet she just vac'd yesterday .
You're rightly proud of the fact you vac'd that last bit of particulate from her "filter" and want to show her what a great job you did.

You actually do two things by doing that;

1.) you just pointed out what a crappy housekeeper she is :shock:
2.) you illustrated that if she doesn't pay $400 a year on one 200sf room, (for you to clean it properly 4 times a year) she's living with those allergens 6-8 months a year.
(She can dust mop a hard floor every week for the price of a mircofiber Swifter)

When I cleaned that room in that first video I made, I could have cleaned it like EVERYONE else, charged about $130, vacuumed it with a commercial bag vacuum in 10-15min, presprayed and rinsed it and done 50 min later at most. Owner wouldn't have known any different, I wouldn't have known any different, carpet would have looked clean, I get paid, everyone is happy. Is that what you would do Larry?

the short answer is a resounding YES.
cause that's all MOST people want or need

its not about being some stupid name calling of OCCD

Ron, my OCCD comment wasn't intended to be stupid or derogatory, I promise.
I think it's valid cause it's out of the norm for even the better cleaners

there is quite a difference between crappy work, quality work and overkill.
If you're as busy as you want to be, i say more power to you!
I couldn't think of anyone else on this board I'd rather have clean Joni's carpets.
But the fact that you're even considering offering an "inferior" (to you) level of clean suggests your market niche may not be large enough to support your level of "clean"


nothing more, nothing le$$



..L.T.A.[/quote:1aykr1j9]

For a gun shooting, fish hookin' ohio wanna be redneck, that Larry is a perty smart fellar. !gotcha!