Manufacturers, who does your R and D?

[Mikey P]

Local cleaners?, internet super stars? nasa laboratories? the forklift guy out back? the owner of the company in his spare time?

or nobody and you just hope it works..

I don't know how many times I told Mytee that their filters were collapsing. I was told it was only me (I hear that a lot) and no one else was having issues.


That is not my filter. I chucked my third Mytee in the trash out of frustration and now use the best filter in the world.



Serious question though..

WHO IS DOING THE RnD for our industry?

 

[Weebco]

I like the devastator , I need to get one!
Looks like you drove over that mighty filter, did you?

 

[Mikey P]

Not my filter.

They cave in due to suction and the warm water.Wrong type of plastic and stubbornness on behalf of the owner to listen to sound advice.

 

[Ken Snow]

I take it you went to bridge burning school and aced the class Mike.

 

[Mikey P]

If it's a rotomolded bridge I want no part in it.

 

[J Scott W]

I am more involved in chemicals than with tools and accessories but I do participate in R & D for many of the products developed at Bridgewater. I don't want to give away trade secrets, but this is the general outline.

The chemist and formulator will try many variations of an idea in the lab.
Then we get into additional lab testing. Weight of the product, % of solids and active ingredients, do powders clump or mix freely, does it separate when stored, how does it react to heat or freezing and so forth. This may be compared to competing products.
The next round of testing is cleaning uniformly stained greige goods. Clean half a stain with version a and the other half with version B or maybe against a competing product. We have 10 or 12 people who don't know which product cleaned which half judge the results.

When we are happy with the lab testing, we look for some place in house to test such as on carpet or upholstered furniture in our own offices or maybe the homes of some employees.

Now we give the product out to some local cleaners. We can come along on those jobs, do real world side by side testing and photos. Maybe the product gets tweaked some more.

In the last round of tests we will use several cleaners around the country in different areas to see how a product works on the types of soils and the conditions the encounter. Give them a few weeks to use it and report back. We keep a record of who has tested products before. Someone who has given detailed comments and photos is more likely to be used in the future. We don't want simple response such as "It works." or "It doesn't work."

Depending on the particular use of the product, it gets tested by folks using different equipment (truckmounts / portables for example) on different conditions (high end homes, older homes, restaurants, etc.) and in different parts of the country because each area has different soils.

Several Mikey's board posters have been used in the final round of testing, most are not Internet superstars.

 

[Mikey P]

excellent Scott thank you very much for your answer

 

[Zee]

Local cleaners?, internet super stars? nasa laboratories? the forklift guy out back? the owner of the company in his spare time?

or nobody and you just hope it works..

I don't know how many times I told Mytee that their filters were collapsing. I was told it was only me (I hear that a lot) and no one else was having issues.


That is not my filter. I chucked my third Mytee in the trash out of frustration and now use the best filter in the world.



Serious question though..

WHO IS DOING THE RnD for our industry?

My mytee filter collapses on every job...I was told to come by their factory and they will replace it.
I run high heat high flow..once you're done, its almost impossible to unscrew the top to clean out..that's how deformed it gets..more than what is pictured here.

 

[Mikey P]

I would have hired YOU to be my beta tester.

 

[Zee]

I would have hired YOU to be my beta tester.

I wouldn't mind helping out...if asked. I would have been able to show this filter doesn't stand up to warm water coming BACK from already been traveled thru the pressure line and carpet and vac hose. Btw the blower that is being used with that filer is a roots 45.

 

[Mikey P]

I think it would cave in if used with their ETM honestly..

Just the wrong sort of plastic for this use.

 

[John Olson]

Well you hate hearing it but I'm telling you again I have had ZERO people call me and tell me their lint hog collapsed. Maybe they are afraid to tell me? Seriously doubt that. Now I'm not saying it didn't happen to you or to this person but it is not happening on a regular basis. Is that a Vortex machine? How far away from the blower is it? Looks like it is hanging right at the truck. I have everyone put them at least 6 feet away from the machine not sure if that makes any sort of difference just what I have them do so it sits flat on the sidewalk/driveway.

 

[Sapphire Savant]

Sapphire Scientific's R&D is first carried out at their extensive engineering, design and manufacturing facility located in Prescott Arizona. It is overseen by Mike Roden, who is the Vice President of Engineering. Not only are prototype truckmounts tested at the factory for many weeks, under more strenuous conditions than normal operation, but even before that, extensive research and testing is done on the many components and parts, both manufactured and purchased, that comprise the finished truckmount. In many cases this entails operating components and various assemblies 24/7 for weeks-on-end in order to accumulate the equivalent of several years of wear and tear. These items are then taken apart to observe wear and measure tolerances. Those that don't meet Sapphire's stringent quality and performance standards are rejected or, if they are purchased items, the R&D group may decide to work with the supplier to correct the issue or beef up the product, which then undergoes extensive testing again.

When the factory R&D efforts meet initial expectations and performance criteria, then prototypes are built and placed in actual field operations with cleaning organizations that maintain records of the TMs performance, and any noted issue or concerns. Mike and his team stay in close contact with those companies and use their input to affect needed adjustments and changes.

Once the design has been tweaked with prototype field test input, several pre-production units are built on the assembly line, as they would be under the normal manufacturing process. These units are again sent into the real world for an extended period of performance and durability testing. Results are evaluated and any design or assembly matters that need attention, are handled. Only then, is the new model launched and made available to the industry.

R&D doesn't stop there. Current production machines are constantly being evaluated for improvements, and R&D is already going on today for new, more advanced truckmounts and other tools and equipment that the industry won't even see yet, for a year or two. It is Sapphire Scientific's goal to always stay ahead of the competition. Thus, just as the competition catches up, Sapphire takes another technological leap forward with its truckmounts and related tools and accessories. We are committed to giving customers the best value for their equipment purchase investment.

 

[packfancjh]

I haven't sold a ton of the lint hogs but I also haven't seen any come back because of it caving in.

 

[Mikey P]

Fifty feet away from the Judson John.

A filter should be able to withstand being five inches away from any tm imo.

 

[hogjowl]

I doubt Mikey is making this up, so assuming it really happened the way he and that mystery cleaner says it did, then that's two too many times. Regardless of how many times a distributor hears of the problem.

I get a bum rap OFTEN for reporting problems with chemicals and equipment, and Mikey gets it twice more often than I do. While Mikey has to be under some pressure not to insult an advertiser here, he seems to be somewhat resistant to that pressure ... to a large degree. So, I would like to go on record as saying I APPRECIATE Mikey's honesty in this.

We need to hear of these problems every time they happen, and no matter WHO the mfg. or dist. is.

 

[T Monahan]

Local cleaners?, internet super stars? nasa laboratories? the forklift guy out back? the owner of the company in his spare time?

or nobody and you just hope it works..

I don't know how many times I told Mytee that their filters were collapsing. I was told it was only me (I hear that a lot) and no one else was having issues.


That is not my filter. I chucked my third Mytee in the trash out of frustration and now use the best filter in the world.



Serious question though..

WHO IS DOING THE RnD for our industry?

Greg Turcotte & Tom Monahan for everything we build at Centrum Force. We are rug washers making rug washing equipment. We listen to feedback from those that use our equipment and make changes accordingly if required.

Good post!

 

[Mikey P]

The mystery cleaner will be along as soon as the range closes.

 

[Zee]

John Olson" data-source="post: 4216194" class="bbCodeBlock bbCodeBlock--expandable bbCodeBlock--quote js-expandWatch">

Well you hate hearing it but I'm telling you again I have had ZERO people call me and tell me their lint hog collapsed. Maybe they are afraid to tell me? Seriously doubt that. Now I'm not saying it didn't happen to you or to this person but it is not happening on a regular basis. Is that a Vortex machine? How far away from the blower is it? Looks like it is hanging right at the truck. I have everyone put them at least 6 feet away from the machine not sure if that makes any sort of difference just what I have them do so it sits flat on the sidewalk/driveway.

John, my filter came from you but when this issue came up before either Nathan or mytee John told me right away to just come over to their place. And yes I told them I got it from you.

As far as it being too close to the machine...mine is about 8 feet away from the top of the waste tank. In my opinion, if it was closer to the wand, it would collapse even quicker since the water would be even warmer there.

 

[packfancjh]

obviously by looking at the picture he's not making it up I'm just saying we haven't seen it yet

 

[Larry Cobb]

Now we give the product out to some local cleaners. We can come along on those jobs, do real world side by side testing and photos. Maybe the product gets tweaked some more.

In the last round of tests we will use several cleaners around the country in different areas to see how a product works on the types of soils and the conditions the encounter. Give them a few weeks to use it and report back. We keep a record of who has tested products before. Someone who has given detailed comments and photos is more likely to be used in the future. We don't want simple response such as "It works." or "It doesn't work."

Depending on the particular use of the product, it gets tested by folks using different equipment (truckmounts / portables for example) on different conditions (high end homes, older homes, restaurants, etc.) and in different parts of the country because each area has different soils.

Several Mikey's board posters have been used in the final round of testing, most are not Internet superstars.

Just to be fair about pre-testing here . . .

there have also been heat related issues in the both the Interlink & Mytee screen filters that go inside the outer housings.

Both companies have replaced the screen inner filters without questioning.

There is trial and error with the majority of small volume manufacturers.

Larry

 

[Mikey P]

Screen filters are on their way out.
The Devastator mesh and paint filter is far superior

 

[Dolly Llama]

John Olson" data-source="post: 4216194" class="bbCodeBlock bbCodeBlock--expandable bbCodeBlock--quote js-expandWatch">

Is that a Vortex machine?

No, not a Vortex
Steamway Powermatic with relief valve set at 14hg

How far away from the blower is it?

haven't a clue what that would matter , do you?
but i'd estimate it's 5 to 6 ft

truth is, it's the first time i noticed it really (but I'm not on the truck a whole lot anymore)
Shane or Cody have never mentioned it.

TM and crew has been running harder than "normal" the last week or so is the only that's different.
Pretty much continuous flow with wand or upl tools on the floor or fabric for hours upon hours (6 to 8 continuous TM hours daily)
Which isn't "normal" for us, cause we rarely do any jobs where the TM runs more than a few hours continuous

i walked out today after a couple hours run time to turn on the pump-out and saw the filter
looked at the vac gauge and it was pulling around 12hg

an'ats the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth


so where's the devastator filter guy??
I need a new filter , cause I figure this filter will be toast now
(like when a vac hose kinks the first time..it'll kink all-de-time in that spot til you cut it off)


..L.T.A.

 

[John Olson]

John, my filter came from you but when this issue came up before either Nathan or mytee John told me right away to just come over to their place. And yes I told them I got it from you.

As far as it being too close to the machine...mine is about 8 feet away from the top of the waste tank. In my opinion, if it was closer to the wand, it would collapse even quicker since the water would be even warmer there.

How come you didn't call me? I have no way of knowing if you don't call me.

 

[John Olson]

I am not by any stretch saying it aint true. Just I have sold a ton of these things and until Zee mentioning here no one I sold them to (including zee) has called me and told me this was happening. If it is a random thing that's one thing but if it was a serious issue I would expect to here about it like I did with the screen filters Larry is talking about.

 

[Mikey P]

Random?

All three of mine did it.

 

[Larry Cobb]

Mikey;

On the original R & D question . . .

1. We test equipment & cleaning chemicals on our own 10,000 sq. ft. of carpet in our offices, kitchen and showroom as often as required.

2. Then we loan a new piece of equipment to a cleaner who is

A. Hard on equipment and has many unsupervised techs

B. Uses the equipment for long duty cycles.

One customer was using a portable extractor for 3 eight hour shifts,
for several days at a time)

3. We do perform some "destructive testing" like running our hoses & HX up to 300° for hours
or pressure up to 3000 PSI (without any failures)

Even this testing will not catch every scenario that cleaners put the equipment thru:

One TM customer ran so much Encap with fluorochemical thru the #47 blower,

that it smoked the triple Gates VX belt system routinely.

We took the TM back, and the next cleaner had no belt problems for over 2 years.

Larry

 

[Royal Man]

When getting prototypes out for testing are you worried about intellectual property being stolen or duplicated? Sealing other's ideas is rampant in this industry.

 

[Jim Martin]

so where's the devastator filter guy??
I need a new filter , cause I figure this filter will be toast now
(like when a vac hose kinks the first time..it'll kink all-de-time in that spot til you cut it off)


..L.T.A.

got mine in today.....custom made........2 inch at the wand end and 2.5 at the machine end.....

but it will not be on the ground for me to try it out until Monday.....

 

[Zee]

The filter caving in was talked about before. I just noticed I got the filter on that week or the week before that thread was up and even said there is no way it would cave or collapse...I guess about two three months of use when it started giving up and caving in...Which reading now how I thought "there is no way it would cave in"- sounds pretty funny..

But one thing for sure- this has been a topic before and came up multiple times as it is here.. http://mikeysboard.com/forum/showth...ne-vacuum-debri-filter&highlight=mytee+filter this thread was over two years ago.