one man's greatjuice is another man's jUnkjuice ..why?

[Dolly Llama]

one thing I've noticed during my 20 years sucking rugz..

One man considers a particular brand of juice or powder as the BEST.
another man finds that same juice sorely lacking compared to his best flavored koolaid.

why is that?

i understand regional water supplies vary greatly across the country .
I understand the ones in soft water regions will need less chems to do the same job compared to us in Hardrock Waterville regions ..but it must be more than that

many MANY times over the years I've heard on the boards ,
"this is the greatest juice ever!"
and a handful of guys will join in and chant the same mantra

But when I do side by side evaluations comparing them to "my" best, they don't preform as well

i don't get it.....

makes me wonder if they haven't tried enough juices in different situations to "know" the difference between a "great" juice and an a "good" one (cause pret'near ALL on the market are "good")

or..

it's something else??


any thoughts ?


..L.T.A.

 

[Brian R]

My guess is they used it in a situation where it cleaned up great....But any juice would have worked as well.


Plus, they WANT it to work and subconsciously put in a little more effort etc.


Too many factors to claim a super juice unless you've been using it a couple of months.

Even after a few years you may still see new challenges that you hadn't seen in those previous years.


There are standbys out there...For a reason.

They work.

 

[Shorty]

POSSIBLY:

Pre-rinsing, or not, of spot to remove any residue.............

Different methods of application...................

Dwell time.....................

Temp; & humidity conditions................

Method of agitation/tamping etc;...........

Patience..................



I'd like a buck for every jug that I've consigned to the rubbish bin over the years because they didn't meet the manufacturers word. :x

Shorty.

 

[Desk Jockey]

Look in their trucks and you'll see a dozens of different product brands with another half a dozen different boosters used to play mad scientist. Often mixing two or three different brands with products that were never intended to be mixed to make their "special potions".

They purchase products on a whim or because they heard a product was good or saw an ad or flyer for the new best thing. They are not crazy but are just in search for the magic bullet, the one thing to make their cleaning superior to their competition.

Sad really, driven crazy constantly searching, buying every new product, every reformulated old product just to get that edge. thathurts



P.S.
I think we have at least a dozen different brands on our truck.
:mrgreen:

 

[Dolly Llama]

P.S.
I think we have at least a dozen different brands on our truck.
:mrgreen:

LOL...we're pretty much the same in that regard
Though I've whittled it down over the years to just a few for carpet.
and they're "specific" based on needs.
An "all around" top quality juice to handle most all res situations and a couple "sledgehammer" nukes for rat nasties or grease pits


it's rare we "boost" juices (generally an occasional need for a sodium perc boost in some situations)
But I'm of the opinion if a juice needs a "boost" (beyond adjusting dilution rates) to clean well, it's not such a great juice to start with...

..l.T.A.

 

[Desk Jockey]

Dwell time and aggitation will make up for a lot of booster......but then you don't get to play mad scientist.

I try to watch our purchases and question why we are using so much of this or that product. Most have a reason occassionally I get our distributor brain washing our guys with the new hot product. I usually stomp that out fast unless it has real merit. :mrgreen:

 

[hogjowl]

If you don't have a Grandi Groomer on your truck, then you are wasting your time.

Noel

 

[Jimmy L]

I tweak my main "juice" to the job description.

Adding maybe some oxy or maybe some citrus or maybe some deo bla bla bla.

 

[Desk Jockey]

You're the person I was thinking of when I posted.

LOL

 

[K P]

I think a lot of it has to do with standards,we all have different.Just like using a 45 blower to dual with,can it be done?sure,but not to my standards.

 

[Bob Foster]

Who wouldn't want to try out a new prespray to see if it wasn't better for them than what they are using? Who wouldn't want to get beyond the hype and perceived protectionism of certain vendors?

I like the idea of side by side comparisons but would take it a few steps farther.

An independent evaluation committee that each tried blind solutions premixed for them and those people would be chosen by their peers. They could not be a manufacturer or have a perceived bias to a manufacturer. That would eliminate quite a few around here including myself. (By the way I do use another prominent brand of prespray as well as my buddy's).

Also the evaluators cannot be a moderators either and must have a minimum of 5 years experience and run a TM not a portable.
Four different people in four different locations across North America with four different TMs all using pump ups or electric sprayers (no hydroforces). They would each clean three different types of carpet. This exposes the product to four different users and their different geographic location would imply different soil types and water hardness.

They simply report back, Jug A B C or D was best. Each jug is premixed and unlabeled and each product is used on the same carpet side by side to the other jugs. Each carpet would be preconditioned the same way and have the same dwell.

Complicated? Yup but it would be a non-biased peer result.

The 4 evaluators would each receive a gift from Mike for their trouble. The board members, not the moderators pick the evaluators.

 

[adamh]

Working for BLUEline I cleaned with guys all over the country. I noticed many many things but one is the difference in soils. Some areas dirt has red/orange in it, some areas the dirt was black and some it was more brown or gray. I noticed some cleaned different. I know that may sound funny, but I think the different minerals in the soil does make a difference. IMO

Az carpet is the easiest carpet to clean. The dirt comes off with little effort and it dries fast. I think a retard could be a good cleaner in Arizona.

Also I really spray down the pre-spray. Others just mist it on. I think 90% of the pre-sprays are good if you put down enough to let it work. Punp ups are silly for pre-spray IMO.

 

[Bob Foster]

I am only suggesting a pump up instead of a hydro force because of inconsistencies of mixture delivery that some have with a hydroforce. An electric would obviously be the best.

 

[Jimmy L]

Bob you would be disqualified from participating because you are a jUdSoN jUIcE whore.

 

[Connor]

How they balance the "pie" is also to be considered.

 

[Bob Foster]

Bob you would be disqualified from participating because you are a jUdSoN jUIcE whore.

Yup! Read my post again.

 

[Bob Foster]

I'm confident that the people on this board are capable of choosing competent cleaners. It would be up to them to be consistent in their cleaning technique with all test solutions.

 

[Hoody]

I've used a lot of different chems too. So many variables so little time. Most of my thoughts have been mentioned.

A lot of people use the glug method, and not actually consistently measuring the product they're using, most don't read the directions for proper mix ratios, or they don't really understand how to convert mix ratios from pump-ups to hydro forces and vice versa. Soils play a big part of it, so does equipment, heat, flow, but really from being able to observe as many companies as I have, mixing has been a big culprit.

 

[idreadnought]

wow, 18 posts and not one mention of water. Not only are the soils different in areas around the country but the water is different too. Some is hard, some is soft.

another thing to consider is the lifestyles of the people that you clean after. For a person strictly cleaning nasty oil filled polyester carpets in apartments would have a different perspective to someone cleaning an upper end home with moderate soiling and oils.

I am one of those guys that boost based off the situation. Citrus for oil issues, oxygen for brightening issues. I don't go mad scientist but I do boost when needed

 

[Bob Foster]

"This exposes the product to four different users and their different geographic location would imply different soil types and water hardness."

My post above....

 

[Jimbo]

Who wouldn't want to try out a new prespray to see if it wasn't better for them than what they are using? Who wouldn't want to get beyond the hype and perceived protectionism of certain vendors?

I like the idea of side by side comparisons but would take it a few steps farther.

An independent evaluation committee that each tried blind solutions premixed for them and those people would be chosen by their peers. They could not be a manufacturer or have a perceived bias to a manufacturer. That would eliminate quite a few around here including myself. (By the way I do use another prominent brand of prespray as well as my buddy's).

Also the evaluators cannot be a moderators either and must have a minimum of 5 years experience and run a TM not a portable.
Four different people in four different locations across North America with four different TMs all using pump ups or electric sprayers (no hydroforces). They would each clean three different types of carpet. This exposes the product to four different users and their different geographic location would imply different soil types and water hardness.

They simply report back, Jug A B C or D was best. Each jug is premixed and unlabeled and each product is used on the same carpet side by side to the other jugs. Each carpet would be preconditioned the same way and have the same dwell.

Complicated? Yup but it would be a non-biased peer result.

The 4 evaluators would each receive a gift from Mike for their trouble. The board members, not the moderators pick the evaluators.

Wow, Bob...next you be working for Clean-non-Trust doing all their testing...probably have to report your findings to Harry Wheelwright!!



Seriously...in 31 years I have tried so many prespray products...even built a few of my own...and I don't really want to be the testing guinea pig for companies anymore...when they have a product that does not work all that well...it makes me and my job look bad.

I would actually rather just buy the premium product that has worked well for me in the past...and be able to depend on it doing it's premium work!

 

[Ken Snow]

What Jim said!


Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk

 

[Leslie Judson Jones]

Bob you would be disqualified from participating because you are a jUdSoN jUIcE whore.

Jimmy watch this video and think this as you watch it !
I will only use Judson Juice, I will only use Judson Juice, I will only use Judson Juice.

e]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=urXKcmdHmVke]

 

[lance]

Style of cleaning and expectations matter also. If you're a fast cleaner you want and expect your cleaners to affect the dirty carpet fast. You will also wand fast and that will affect how good a cleaning agent you think you are using.

Quality of carpet and how worn it is will affect the perceived results of any "testing" that a cleaner does on his own. "If something works or not" is really just a matter of opinion.

Patient cleaners will lay down a good amount of PS, let it dwell, and then slowly rinse the dirty PS with lots of hot water. I bet these cleaners will probably use some kind of aggitation to help get the results they want. They are not in a hurry because they are not doing 6 jobs a day....so they understand that you need a system to get the job done, not just one magic bullet.

 

[Leslie Judson Jones]

Style of cleaning and expectations matter also. If you're a fast cleaner you want and expect your cleaners to affect the dirty carpet fast. You will also wand fast and that will affect how good a cleaning agent you think you are using.

Quality of carpet and how worn it is will affect the perceived results of any "testing" that a cleaner does on his own. "If something works or not" is really just a matter of opinion.

Patient cleaners will lay down a good amount of PS, let it dwell, and then slowly rinse the dirty PS with lots of hot water. I bet these cleaners will probably use some kind of aggitation to help get the results they want. They are not in a hurry because they are not doing 6 jobs a day....so they understand that you need a system to get the job done, not just one magic bullet.

Lance! watch this video and think this as you watch it !
I will only use Judson Juice, I will only use Judson Juice, I will only use Judson Juice.

m]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=urXKcmdHmVkm]

 

[Bob Foster]

Jim, I'm quite happy with what I'm using. As far as testing is concerned its time other people to step up and do this stuff. Besides I've disqualified myself.

One thing is for sure, a lot of people buy on the basis of recommendations of others. But the question was asked why is one mans good stuff another bad stuff.

Pick you answer
A. Its better than the last juice I tried
B. Because someone I trust said so
C. Everyone else uses it
D. Its cheap
E. Its expensive
F. Because I've always used it and nothing new out there could possibly be better
G. I'm a friend of the manufacturer so it has to be good stuff
H. They have big ads in the magazines and banner ads on the boards so it must be the best

Just don't believe the suggested dilutions because in reality
1. You actually need to use more so you have to buy lots of it from your supplier
2. The suggested dilution isn't true because there is no way that the juice is 2 to 3 times as concentrated as its competitor, that's not possible.

 

[Desk Jockey]

What big Jim said!

 

[rwcarpet]

one thing I've noticed during my 20 years sucking rugz..

One man considers a particular brand of juice or powder as the BEST.
another man finds that same juice sorely lacking compared to his best flavored koolaid.

why is that?

i understand regional water supplies vary greatly across the country .
I understand the ones in soft water regions will need less chems to do the same job compared to us in Hardrock Waterville regions ..but it must be more than that

many MANY times over the years I've heard on the boards ,
"this is the greatest juice ever!"
and a handful of guys will join in and chant the same mantra

But when I do side by side evaluations comparing them to "my" best, they don't preform as well

i don't get it.....

makes me wonder if they haven't tried enough juices in different situations to "know" the difference between a "great" juice and an a "good" one (cause pret'near ALL on the market are "good")

or..

it's something else??


any thoughts ?


..L.T.A.

Remember, larry......you've got the advantage of killer heat with that powermatic. That does change the equation to the better. Most HX guys here can't match the heat output of your PM. You can use Tide and get better results than most with that heat!

I've had great success with that "white powder" that alot of cleaners here say is just salt and acid. It starts with a "P" and it ain't piss! Other cleaners have tried it once and never used it again.

 

[floorguy]

wow, 18 posts and not one mention of water. Not only are the soils different in areas around the country but the water is different too. Some is hard, some is soft.

another thing to consider is the lifestyles of the people that you clean after. For a person strictly cleaning nasty oil filled polyester carpets in apartments would have a different perspective to someone cleaning an upper end home with moderate soiling and oils.

I am one of those guys that boost based off the situation. Citrus for oil issues, oxygen for brightening issues. I don't go mad scientist but I do boost when needed

Larry brought it up to begin with....

I like Adams answer though...different soils...and the one mentioned above...different life styles...Think if you had to clean for those people who love their deep fry...or those who smoke like no tomorrow...


Though I think Adam called Jim a retard :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:

 

[Mikey P]

Stench plays more into my choice that just about any other factor.


D'Limo and Butyl stink and 25 years of exposure have fooked me up.


I chose SnG for my nasties, and Red Line for my not so nasties. O2 with O2 rinse on wools.
Sng and RL can be rinsed with soft water alone but O2 rinse helps dry the carpet quicker.


Redline need a peroxide boost for coffee and pee pee. SnG does not.


I dont care what you use.


Bob's test/survey even if done to perfection, would still not come to a conclusion that was worth the effort.


Larry does not clean normal carpet, he cleans fuzzy garage floors so do not listen to his advice.


Jimmy cleans 3 house a week (his wife's co workers) for light beer and clown make up money so dont listen to his advice either.