PowerClean Diesel D-XT

[Jim Bethel]

I thought I would put photo's it up to get some comments.

We are very impressed with this new PowerClean machine. For a Diesel, it maintains heat every bit as good as the Petrol slide in's do, but the vacuum is awesome. The diesel has more than enough torque to run the 59 blower and 3" kunkle valve without a drop in revs. The air filters are now in a custom external stainless steel housing box so the blower air filters (that normally sit inside the waste tank) cannot get covered with lint and debris and possibly loose vacuum.

The other super nice thing the amount of things that have had a ceramic heat reducing coating applied to it. We tested this machine in a box truck (posted under the Installs thread) for 3 hours under full load, and there was simply no heat build up in the pantec. None! It runs very cool. Cleaning with a single wand, we have been running it at 1500 rpm, not too much above idle and it is very quite as well.

And you can see the size of the waste tank. For a slide in unit, it has a large 125 gallon waste tank. It also has a series of jets that wash the internals of the waste tank down.

When I have posted photo's of some of the other Genesis machines and installs we have done, normally I get a few comments or emails suggesting to put a bigger waste tank with the beast or to let it breathe easier with larger plumbing.

So what do you think of this unit?

Jim

 

[Jimmy L]

"Lose vacuum"


NOT


"Loose vacuum"

 

[TimP]

What's the internal blower plumbing set up like. Does it come with 2.5" ports. And what kind of heat can it maintain with 1.5 gal per min flow constant, and what kind of heat can it keep with a spinner...I'm sure it can't handle two spinner heat wise for tile though. How does the heat exchange system work? What kind of fuel efficiency numbers would one be looking at?

 

[lance]

Looks great. Can you take out the blower filter and take a pic? You guys said at Connections that you were working on an external SS debris filter like the one used in the trucks down under. How is that going?

 

[Dolly Llama]

looks good Jim, thanks of sharing.

tell me, what's that ball valve and port under the vac ports?
It that for the pump out?

also, what kind of heat does it maintain when running in single wand mode?
(1500rpm)

lastly, is the 125 gal waste tank a "usable" 125 gal?
Reason I ask that, word on the street is, the gas Genny waste tank starts sucking water thru the blower well before it's rated waste tank capacity

ps..hope to hear the GPH fuel usage that Tim asked too.
i hear the GPH on the gas Genny is in the 2.5 to 3 gph range.
Diesel fuel typically runs .25 to .35 cents per gal more than reg gas in my area

..L.T.A.

 

[Blue Monarch]

Blower filters outside the waste tank. That's a good idea IMO. I tend to neglect the filter I've got 'cause of the PITA factor.

Neglect on this one wouldn't even be noticed.

 

[Shane T]

The new location of blower filters should be much more convenient and add greatly to the usable space in the tank but I don't see why the filters will stay any cleaner. Won't the air flow just carry debris further down to the filters?

I think the cleaning jets in the bottom of the tank is a great idea. Do they actually get the gunk out the drain?

 

[The Preacher]

what brand of diesel (JD, Kubota, Cat???)

 

[TimP]

Danny on their web page it says.

Diesel Power! - Isuzu diesel engine delivers 52hp and loads of torque!
More Fuel Efficient - The Genesis-DXT is 25-40% more fuel efficient than similar, dual wand truck mounts using gas engines.
More Durable! - Stainless waste tank and stainless steel base frame.
More Vacuum! - Kunkle valve and 4" plumbing throughout the vacuum system delivers more power to the carpet than competitive units.
More Pressure! - True 3,000 PSI heated pressure washing ability makes the Genesis the best choice for tile and grout cleaning.
More Heat! - Hotter cleaning temperatures increase efficiency and productivity


http://www.powercleanind.com/products_t ... php?id=105

 

[The Magician]

Nice looking machine and its gets hot. It would be awesome if the gas tm was like this one.

 

[R W]

Larry......the Genesis doesn't have a lot of usable waste tank, and it does start sucking water IF your APO isn't working right. (or you forget to turn it on)

 

[SRI Cleaning]

Looks cool! what are all of the qd's on the from for? What is the expected price for the u.s. gonna be?

 

[Scott Rogers]

What is the Valve in the middle of the dump tank for?

 

[Jim Bethel]

I hope Marty doesn't read this as it's going to be long

"Lose vacuum"


NOT


"Loose vacuum"

Where would we all be Jimmy without your expert eye picking up such things ???

What's the internal blower plumbing set up like? Does it come with 2.5" ports. And what kind of heat can it maintain with 1.5 gal per min flow constant, and what kind of heat can it keep with a spinner...I'm sure it can't handle two spinner heat wise for tile though. How does the heat exchange system work? What kind of fuel efficiency numbers would one be looking at?

The internal blower plumbing exits the blower then goes straight into a large bore blower exhaust heat exchanger and then from there flows through 2 x 2.5" mufflers upon then exiting the machine.

As for what heat can it maintain, at 2700 rpm it will easily hold 235-240 with a wand with 6 gpm jets. But your probably never going to run that engine at them revs constantly unless you are doing external hard surface cleaning, dual wanding or flood restoration.

I honestly did test the unit myself at lower revs, but I rang out client today that purchased this machine and asked him his thoughts. He is, or was a HydraMaster CDS user. His CDS machine in under 3 years old and has the salsa heater pack as well. He said at 1500 rpm, the Diesel Genesis was as hot as his CDS, but has A LOT more vacuum in his words. He also said at 1500 rpm, it was quieter than his CDS. He was quite impressed thus far with his new toy.

I agree with you though, due to the flow (unless your going to purchase an after market diesel burner or LPG setup) nothing is going to keep up with sub 240 deg temps with 2 tile cleaning spinners. It will however with 1 tile cleaning tool, hold very good temps still. You still will get temp with two tile tools, but nothing exciting I don't believe.

Bear in mind, from memory, a Diesel engines exhaust temp is around 800 deg F, whereas a gas engine the same size is around 1200 deg F, so the Diesel's aren't going to have as many burnable BTU's and therefore not feed the exhaust heat exhangers with as much heat. But what they slightly lack on the heat department, they more than make up for on the torque, reliability and longevity over the gas engines.

Rather than quoting something inaccurate, I will put them up after the weekend when we can calculate it and let you know real world figures.

Looks great. Can you take out the blower filter and take a pic? You guys said at Connections that you were working on an external SS debris filter like the one used in the trucks down under. How is that going?

Hi Lance,

Did you want to see in behind the blower filters? If so, I can do that a little bit later on. We have a third of our state under flood at the moment, and the client that owns this rig is flat out working. I will take you some photo's shortly however. The boys are PowerClean USA are working on a pre-filter like the one pictured. I don't know how theirs are going over there as I am from 'down under' and this is the one that we manufacture

looks good Jim, thanks of sharing.

tell me, what's that ball valve and port under the vac ports?
It that for the pump out?

also, what kind of heat does it maintain when running in single wand mode?
(1500rpm)

lastly, is the 125 gal waste tank a "usable" 125 gal?
Reason I ask that, word on the street is, the gas Genny waste tank starts sucking water thru the blower well before it's rated waste tank capacity

ps..hope to hear the GPH fuel usage that Tim asked too.
i hear the GPH on the gas Genny is in the 2.5 to 3 gph range.
Diesel fuel typically runs .25 to .35 cents per gal more than reg gas in my area

..L.T.A.

Larry, the ball valve under the 2.5" vac ports on the waste tank is part of the self cleaning waste tank system. It has a large filter basket that sits directly above that tap inside the tank. It has a shelf in there that collects any of the debris that comes through the bottom of the filter basket, so when you start the self cleaning system, a lot of the heavier debris will collect here and is easier to wash out of that shelf, than getting caught and having to try and wash it out of the bottom of the waste tank. There is also a flood jet that pushes from the back of the tank towards to big on/off tap down the bottom of the tank as well.

In regards to the waste tank size, you are correct. It is not "usable" to 125 gallons. But then again, no TM manufacturer (to my knowledge) ever quotes usable. The quote overall size and vacuum. Just like blowers. Manufacturers do this, I think not to misinform, but rather as a benchmark. The waste tank on the gas Genesis, just like the Diesel Genesis, and the same as the Prochem and HydraMaster waste tanks never will get to 100% capacity before the high waste water shut down kicks in or the APO float switch engages. But it won't suck water into the blower on the PowerClean machines or any major machine manufacturer for that matter (unless someone disconnects the high waste water level shut downs every manufacturer uses in the waste tanks). It may however, suck through some foam if it is floating around inside the waste tank. I will also get back on here as I stated above and post the diesel consumption.

The new location of blower filters should be much more convenient and add greatly to the usable space in the tank but I don't see why the filters will stay any cleaner. Won't the air flow just carry debris further down to the filters?

I think the cleaning jets in the bottom of the tank is a great idea. Do they actually get the gunk out the drain?

By the time the waste gets sucked through out large pre-filter and then through the standard waste tank filter, there is hardly any debris that enters the waste tank. But you are right, you will still get some, but nothing like a standard slide in waste tank with 'in-tank' blower air filters. And yes, the wash down waste tank jets to a good job, but bear in mind, most of our heavy debris is caught in the external filter first.

Larry......the Genesis doesn't have a lot of usable waste tank, and it does start sucking water IF your APO isn't working right. (or you forget to turn it on)

The Genesis is no different to any other slide in waste tank as I stated before. I am puzzled though how you mentioned your Genesis sucks water through the blower. Have you checked your high level shut downs. If they are routinely cleaned and tested, there is NO WAY water can flow into blower. As I wrote above with in Larry's reply, most blowers will suck foam/moisture if there is some in the waste tank. I normally see this if one of our customers is using a cheap and nasty prespray that has excessive foam.

Since you already own a Genesis (how old is your unit by the way RW?), you would have noticed in the photo above that PowerClean is now utilizing a larger and more industrial APO system. Under full vacuum load, this thing really pumps that large tank out quite quick. We were impressed.

Looks cool! what are all of the qd's on the from for? What is the expected price for the u.s. gonna be?

The large S/S on the bottom left if for incoming water. Because the Genesis runs a multi-temp cleaning system, that is what these are for. One Q/C is for cold water, another for warm water, and two high temp, high pressure Q/C outlets.

I am sorry, I don't know what the price is over there in the USA, but your nearest PowerClean distributor will be able to inform you. If not, Larry, the director of sales for PowerClean could shoot you an email.

What is the Valve in the middle of the dump tank for?

Hi Scott,

I mentioned this in Larry's reply. It is part of the waste tank wash down system.

Thanks for the questions/input guys. We appreciate hearing real cleaners questions and concerns.

Have a good weekend everyone (it is Friday afternoon over here so I am typing this from the future)

Jim



8)

 

[lance]

Sorry Jim, I didn't mean take away the blower filter rather take the filter that is in the SS holder out. I am wondering what shape it is and how it protects the blower.

It looks like it's oval and I wanted to see if the blower sucked air from in the middle of it so any debris would be caught on the outside of the filter. The canister looks really cool...i love seeing custom jobs.

 

[Kelly]

genesis 59....no thanks

 

[Dolly Llama]

genesis 59....no thanks

well sh1t, Kelly
you've been touted as some kind of gUru TM expert,
so tell the class why you don't like the G-59

then tell us why you like White magic
(I see you sell them??)
I hear their custy service SUCKS
(and not just from that dude that bought that abortion called a Titan(?)


..L.T.A.

 

[White-Magic rebuilder]

genesis 59....no thanks

well sh1t, Kelly
you've been touted as some kind of gUru TM expert,
so tell the class why you don't like the G-59

then tell us why you like White magic
(I see you sell them??)
I hear their custy service SUCKS
(and not just from that dude that bought that abortion called a Titan(?)


..L.T.A.

OUCH!!!!!! You mean Triton?

 

[LeeCory]

I have a Genesis and have been happy with it except two things.

The waste tank. As stated above my 95 gallon tank starts blowing water through the exhaust at around 60 gallons or less. As far as I can tell they all do this. If I were to adjust the float so it doesnt blow water, I imagine I would have to adjust it down so I could only get around 50 gallons or less and that is horrible. I didnt get the pumpout initially because I was told by Calvert that it had a 95 gallon tank.

Also the machine has plenty of power to put whatever load I want on it if it were not for the belts. I have to keep my lift set around 13 and cannot use a water claw more than a couple times without shredding all the belts. The blower has 3 belts and shred them about every 4 months.

From what I understand, they have come out with a new kevlar belt that may hold up better, but the last time I took my machine in for belts they didnt have them for my almost 2 year old machine.

I would love to get that new waste tank in the picture, and probably would be able to hold 90 gallons which would be wonderful. It is a shame to have such a nice machine that cant run for long without dumping. It would also be nice if it shut off before all the water started shooting out the exhaust. So after I while I have my helper start watching for the water.... LOL It would also be nice if this powerful machine had the ability to run a water claw without the belts slipping and then schredding.

I have been happy with the machine with the exception of these two things. I wouldnt be so happy however if it were not for Jeff Smith from Steamway Express in Zoarville OH. He is a great guy and provides exceptional service.

 

[R W]

Jim.....I've had a few overflows, as Lee Cory has, but I haven't had any lately. Sometimes the shut off works, sometimes it doesn't. The APO is working alright now....it just leaks and I've got to replace the inner seal on the Jabsco.


Lee Cory.....does your Genesis have the Hayes Torque absorber mounted on the back of the engine, or is it direct drive from the engine to the blower? I know the newer Genesis's don't have the torque absorber. I've only changed belts once in 2800 hours. The first set lasted about 2300 hours.

 

[LeeCory]

Robert, I don't know the answer to your question. But I'd like to know what you are talking about. I wish I had your luck with the belts. Jeff Smith in Zoarville has the blower perfectly aligned, but my machine just can't take the load for any length of time.

As far as the water blowing through the exhaust it depends on the angle you are sitting in a driveway. The shutoff float works fine when it is engaged, but on the right slope "which seems to be often in my case" the water shoots out horribly for awhile. Drenches the inside of the van and blows all over the place. I hate it when I let it get that bad cause I then have to dump the drip pan, dump, and let it run to dry the blower. I hate to lower the shutoff float, but I may have to. It just seems a 95 gallon tank should be able to hold more than 50 - 60 gallons.

but like I said, all and all I am happy with the performance of the machine.

 

[lance]

If you want a waste tank that can hold more water look at one made by Duane O. He made one that sat behind the seats and also went under them a little too. He also talks about how much they really hold not what they should on paper.

If you want high flow it seems some kind of pump out is needed. The needs of the CC'er need to be built into the design of the TM. The box truck fits the bill more than ever.

 

[R W]

Lee.....same here. It seems that the overflows occur when the truck is sitting at an angle. I'll get some pic's of the torque unit on my Genesis....I'll e-mail them to you.

 

[Kelly]

I was made a guru while I was away. lol. Yes you are right, Ive never been a fan of the genesis machine, It always bothered the factory that they just couldnt get me on board with that machine either. It bothered every one at J.W.C. (including John) that even though it was one of the machines they sold, I wouldnt tell a client to buy one of course since I was on the payroll I COULDNT tell you NOT to buy one, but I never would advise you to buy one, unless of course you were considering something WORSE to buy. Here comes the guru part....How many of you here have ever had the opportunity to enjoy watching a brand new chevrolet fuel injected small block in say... a corvet idle?... any one?When I worked for a local GM franchise I saw them every day and right out of the gate you could stand a nickel on its edge on the intake manifold while the car was running and it seldom would fall over. Now ....ever see a chrysler 318 engine idle? lmfao...now those of you who have had the opportunity to see the differance I just mentioned now know why I will never recommend you buy a power clean genesis lol there is other stuff too but Ive said enough. Now the white magic thing....yup we do sell them, along with steam action machines, and the master blend el diablo. And yup, we do actually service the machines we sell. And yes...we do warranty all of the machines we sell and thats why Steam Action Supply has full factory support.
Heres the facts...there is no such thing as a problem free, trouble free, maintenance free, carpet cleaning machine. It is my humble opinion (here comes that guru thing again) that virtually every machine that has ever been built at one time or another has had its share of problems. Blue line suffered from tensioner problems, vortex had troubles all of their own...prochem?...lmfao so there you go. I guess it also has to do with the dealer you buy from mostly, just like the lemon youre driving. Chances are theres more than one dealer who sells the pos car youre driving too, and I bet you chose your dealer wisely, I too advise you to carefully choose who you buy your equipment from as well, and you will be much happier than choosing of course unwisely. ttfn lol

 

[LeeCory]

Could someone explain that to me please... lol

 

[R W]

Lance.....the problem with installing a larger tank on the Genesis is that there isn't much room left in the van after installing the huge Genesis. I even have the extended Chevy, and it's full of "stuff". I've got an electric hose reel, a Kinetico water softener, and RX20, sometimes the Conqueror pad machine, an SX12 tile cleaner, and three wands, not to mention upholstery and step cleaning tools.


If I put a taller tank in, then I wouldn't be able to service my machine (the diverter is behind the tank).

 

[Jim Bethel]

I have a Genesis and have been happy with it except two things.

The waste tank. As stated above my 95 gallon tank starts blowing water through the exhaust at around 60 gallons or less. As far as I can tell they all do this.

Also the machine has plenty of power to put whatever load I want on it if it were not for the belts. I have to keep my lift set around 13 and cannot use a water claw more than a couple times without shredding all the belts. The blower has 3 belts and shred them about every 4 months.

It is a shame to have such a nice machine that cant run for long without dumping. It would also be nice if it shut off before all the water started shooting out the exhaust.

I have been happy with the machine with the exception of these two things

Hi Lee,

You are correct in your statement about the waste tanks. They are all rated based on the capacity. Full is meaning up to the filters. This is the case on all of the major manufactured units. I have sold Prochem, HydraMaster and PowerClean and they all rate their tanks like this. As you know, there is no way for a system to shutdown when foam is present and at times this can be a problem. If the truck is sitting on an angle, that will have an effect on the shutdown system also as you and R W have stated.

With such a large blower, as the Genesis has, the water inside the tank is actually "stepped" when it is under load, meaning there are 3 chambers, the one closest to the blower is the highest during load conditions. The float gets set in a manner that allows maximum volume without drawing water through the system under normal conditions.

As far as your belts go, the belt system on the Genesis has not changed in 10 years. There must be an underlying reason as to why your belts aren’t lasting. Have you replaced them with an unmatched set? If so, even though they are stamped to be the same size, they can be different lengths if they are not cut from the same lot.

The alignment also plays a major role in this as well. A good indicator is that when the belts go out, what happened to them of what is the condition of the broken belts? Are they glossy on the edges? Is one side of the belt more worn than the other? There is a document loaded on the PCI website (www.powercleanind.com.au) under the owners section that explains this. It explains the conditions of broken belts and what caused it with photos.

I think despite all of this, you have answered your own question though when you stated your “Belts are slipping”. After you or your distributor have fitted the new belts, they need to be retensioned after 15 hours of use. Without this critical service, they will slip, heat up and eventually fall apart. If I were you, I would take it back to Jeff Smith and get him to perform the retension using the appropriate belt tensioning gauge to eliminate this. I have clients over here in Australia that have got over well over 2000-3000 hours from their belts, and they are running the exact same system on their machine as you are on yours. The biggest thing down under that we notice that can prematurely cut belt life down is operating the Genesis in a vehicle that doesn’t have a large cubic volume of air, therefore heating the smaller vehicles up. These really decreases belt life – but it is the same with any truckmount. Operate a big machine in a van that is too small and you will always run in to this problem. Not saying this is your case (I believe your just needs to be retentioned) but just giving another possible example.

Also, if you find that you do want an APO on your unit, they can be retro fitted. Just because Calvert suggested that you didn’t need one from day one doesn’t stop you from getting one. Jeff Smith could fit it for you quite easily. And like always, if you have questions, Ed as PowerClean Industries is a wealth of info about your machine as well.

Sorry for the length of the post, but I hope it helps you to get your machine back near factory working condition again.

Jim

 

[Jim Bethel]

Hi Kelly,

Your initial post has intrigued me.

I'm sorry though mate, you have absolutely lost me. Can you explain to me (without all of the lol's and lmao if possible) what your analogy between the Chevy and Chrysler engines means. The reason I ask this is that you seem like a fairly straight shooter and I appreciate that. However, we simply do not have them engines over here. So I have no idea what you are talking about, but I would like too. :wink:

I fully agree 100% with your post here about there being "no such thing as a problem free, trouble free, maintenance free, carpet cleaning machine". Having sold quite a few brands of TM's over the years, I find the PowerClean units one of the easiest to service compared to some of the other big brands. But by no means are they infallible, no one is saying that. They are reliable, but yes, they are also a machine and will have problems. Like you said, every brand does.

By giving your initial slightly negative statement on this post

genesis 59....no thanks

I gather you have serviced or worked on a few D-XT 59 Genesis then to give a guru type statement like you did. What are you thoughts about it from the service side of the fence?

Jim

 

[Larry Cobb]

Hi Jim;

Nice photos of the Diesel TM.

I, too, would like to see the inside the vac filter assembly.

We mount our vac filters ABOVE our 100 gallon recovery tank on all of our our TMs.

Interesting comments on the Diesel exhaust temperatures. I've noticed that water-cooled engines have lower exhaust temperatures also.

Keep pushing the technology.

Larry