Sapphire Pro 1200 question

[hogjowl]

I have seen discussion regarding the waste tank on this rig before and came away confused. The site lists a 120 gallon recovery tank as a standard option and a 90 gallon sub-mount tank as optional. Is the sub-mount tank a fresh water tank?

 

[FredC]

No. Its a waste tank.

http://www.sapphirescientific.com/Uploads/Document/1653/Pro1200_Flyer_Print.pdf

 

[hogjowl]

Thanks, Fred. I can now see how the full thing would be laid out. I am sorry to say though that I will not be willing to purchase one after seeing that picture. If they are too sorry to roll up their hoses neatly in an advertising picture, imagine how lazy they must be when paying attention to mechanical detail?

 

[FredC]

lol..pretty sure I just heard Bruder's sigh of relief.......

 

[hogjowl]

For real ...

 

[FB7777]

That looks like a great design with the under mount tank... Too bad they had to reduce the capacity by 25%

 

[hogjowl]

120 gallons is plenty big. I'd have an auto pump out on it anyway.

 

[FB7777]

The under mount waste is only 90 gallons

Standard tank is 120

 

[hogjowl]

That's fine too. I currently have a 55 gallon waste tank with a pumpout, which I seldom have to use.

 

[Shane T]

Wouldn't the use of the under mount tank require additional pulleys and belts? If so, is there a reduced liability factor?

 

[Desk Jockey]

I'd like to see a big boy option for box trucks, 210 or more recovery.

 

[hogjowl]

Do you people not believe in auto-pumpouts?

 

[Desk Jockey]

No never heard of them. Splain it to me Lucy!

We don't have the cleanout's like Ofer does, so where are you pumping it? Their lawn? Might work for some but some higher end homes the owners would frown upon it, same as pumping into their toilet. We also get freezing weather here and pumping an ice slick would not be without some liability.

Our primary service area is two small towns, 10-15 minutes from side to side. It's easier just to come dump at out sanitary cleanouts when your tank is full and the 210's allow pretty much an all day of cleaning. It also works well for sewage, we bring it back to dump in our sanitary.

 

[hogjowl]

Then stick with your Butler rigs, Goober.

 

[Desk Jockey]

You talking to me?

 

[ruff]

If I didn't have an easy sewer hook up to dump the recovery tank practically on every job, I would want a large tank as well.
I do not see how anybody cleaning with high flow can get away without it, unless they are not exactly following the law.

I am sure Richard is not the only one who wants it and see no reason why Sapphire will not be willing to offer that.
Bill?

 

[hogjowl]

That would be because you two and the folks on *** don't make up a sizeable enough population to warrant the changes.

 

[Desk Jockey]

WELL, I never!!!

 

[Sapphire Savant]

If I didn't have an easy sewer hook up to dump the recovery tank practically on every job, I would want a large tank as well.
I do not see how anybody cleaning with high flow can get away without it, unless they are not exactly following the law.

I am sure Richard is not the only one who wants it and see no reason why Sapphire will not be willing to offer that.
Bill?

Ofer, Marty's response is correct, because it's not cost effective for a manufacturer to produce products of which very few will be sold. However if demand is, or becomes great enough, for a particular product or option, then it becomes a consideration to offer it. I'll forward the idea to the engineering and design folks at Sapphire. Perhaps they have had similar requests from people attending shows and distributor events.

 

[ruff]

Thanks Hank.
Please don't say that about Marty ("Marty's response is correct"), he's unbearable as he is. Just put yourself in our place and try to imagine how he'd be like, had he found out that for once in his life he was right.

A technical question: If the tank is bigger does that necessarily mean that the secondary vacuum will kick in a lot slower?
Or that one will need to somehow slow dry passes due to a slower response time (vacuum load)?

Being in San Francisco I can connect to a sewer inlet practically on every job, so I actually do not need the large tank. (Sorry Fig Newton, but they do do it differently in Topeka.) Though evidently there is a demand, as Butler sells quite a few of those, which helps them offer something unique.

 

[Sapphire Savant]

A technical question: If the tank is bigger does that necessarily mean that the secondary vacuum will kick in a lot slower?
Or that one will need to somehow slow dry passes due to a slower response time (vacuum load)?

"Secondary vacuum" is a new one to me. Never heard of that term. The larger the waste tank, the longer it takes to pump down the tank (remove the air) until there is vacuum, when the unit is first started. However, we're only talking a matter of seconds with the sizes of blowers on direct-drives and slide-ins. Once there is vacuum, performance and results would be the same regardless of waste tank size. Thus slower passes are not required. Obviously the slower the pass, with any machine and waste tank combination, the more residual moisture you extract, but you're going to extract the same amount of moisture as the speed of any given pass would, regardless of waste tank size.

 

[ruff]

Thanks Hank.
As a mechanically challenged individual that I am, that secondary vacuum is my expression.
On my CDS there is something that kicks in when there is more demand (resistance?) and increases vacuum, it could be that it just increases RPM, I'm not sure what is the right terminology.

 

[Desk Jockey]

Are you are talking about when the unit is cleaning and you making a seal with the carpet? If so the motor getting louder its because the engine is working harder to the pull the same vacuum under a load. I don't believe it can get any stronger that your vacuum relief will allow it to.

Too long a hose run could cause a brief delay in getting full strength of your vacuum but you'd only notice it when you broke the seal to the floor.

 

[hogjowl]

He's talking to an expert, Taco. Why don't you just stay out of the conversation long enough so that our local Hebrew can learn something.

 

[Desk Jockey]

That's what I like about you sMarty, straight and to the point.

Wait, I don't like that about you....in fact I think I hate that about you......in fact I may just hate YOU!

 

[hogjowl]

Damn ... that was actually FUNNY!

 

[ruff]

He's talking to an expert, Taco. Why don't you just stay out of the conversation long enough so that our local Hebrew can learn something.

Shalom.
Hava nagila!

Richard, it is not the engine working harder. There are vacuum pods that sense the higher vacuum load or resistance and increase the RPM's therefore creating more vacuum.

P.S. How's the Chavez family reunion going?

 

[Desk Jockey]

No same vacuum it just needs the additional rpms to maintrit under a load.


The Turkey's, I was going to shoot one but it soo much reminded me of sMarty! ; )

 

[ruff]

Hank,
Another question regarding the Pro 1200 which I intend to buy.
Like my old CDS, the water fittings (connection to dwyer meter etc.) are right above the electrical connection in the control panel. Considering Murphy's law and common sense, we know that sooner or later, with 100% certainty, (as they always did with the CDS) the water connectors re going to drip or spray and corrode the electrical connection. Why put it there?

And more important: What is SS going to do to correct it?
Now, I know that this is a legacy design from White Magic, still we will appreciate it if you find a solution to this accident waiting to happen. And Saphire Scientific name, after all is now on the machine.
What I finally did with my CDs was to take the Dwyer meter and connection out of the control box and attached to the side of the CDS. Works well, not cool.

Be much appreciated if SS will address this design flaw.