The Vegetarian Thread.

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There are lots of meat head living into their ripe old age... I knew a chemist, jim, died at 40yrs old. He was a die hard vegetarian. Excercise everyday and healthy as one can be... His brother carl is a metallurgical engineer, eats burnt steak and potatoes.. alot.. coffee diet coke by the gallon everday. Eats BK for lunch everyday..you can tell alot about man diet in his trash.... He is now 65 and just got a raise as a consultant. I think the payrate sheet said $22,000/month salary... He is a fat ass too.

So @FredC there are a lot of bacon eater in their 90s....they are everywhere...and smokers.. but they are dying off and replacing them with just bacon eating non-smoker...

Real health comes from eating in moderation and keeping weight in check... I actually eat 1 or two servings of meat per week. My diet consist of egg and superfood but i am overweight only because i eat in excess and not healthy as a result..
 
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For every 90 year old bacon eating smoker there is a cemetery full of them that died in their early 60s. They probably talked about how their grandpa ate like shit and lived to 90 too. Then heart disease or cancer got them.

Relatively speaking there aren’t really that many 90 year olds period much less ones that ate like shit their entire lives
 
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Keep in mind that being overweight is what kills..

Really? I’m not sure I’ve heard of that as a cod. Maybe a comorbidity but It is diet related.

The leading causes of death in the USA are cancer and heart disease. I have provided peer reviewed studies/ sources showing that eating processed and red meats is linked to both even when other factors are accounted for.....

You have presented a couple anecdotal “ I knew a guy” and “keep in minds”, and an infographic designed to drive traffic to a website.


Idgas what you eat but the facts are the facts. Does eating bacon mean that YOU will get cancer or heart disease? No, but the odds are significantly increased.
 
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You may feel that i have no claims to my statement...one thing that i do know that from the statistics you'd showed me.. it is highly subjective. in fact, there is still not enough studies on that matter. To many variables excluded.. Your argument is one sided to support your cause. I prefer to see the whole picture... Let just agree that you dont eat meat mainly because it has eyes....
 
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You may feel that i have no claims to my statement...one thing that i do know that from the statistics you'd showed me.. it is highly subjective. in fact, there is still not enough studies on that matter. To many variables excluded.. Your argument is one sided to support your cause. I prefer to see the whole picture... Let just agree that you dont eat meat mainly because it has eyes....

You clearly didn’t read the links I posted or the links within them.

You would have seen that there have been hundreds of studies.

You would have seen that processed meats are a group 1 carcinogen. They are known to cause cancer.

You would see that the variables you think are not accounted for are.

and let’s not kid ourselves.......most people who consume processed meats on the regular are going to check a few other boxes but those boxes didn’t make them eat bacon.

Saying something is subjective or has too many variables out of hand is just lazy.
 
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I did read the links @FredC, i wouldve deftly like to know more about the people that they tested on... Were they non smoker? What was their avg daily intake of sugars? Etc... Those information do matter...

Hundreds of testing is never sufficient... One would need to spend hundreds of millions dollors to do enough adequate testing to truly understand the cause of death by food (they haven't)... One thing for sure is too much sugar, obesity and improperly cooking food(not just meat) breathing smogs, stress etc will increase the chance of early death

That 2010 bar chart, sharp drop in population as they gotten older is probably because they got fat off processed food, not enough veggies(or lack nutrients) and no regular excercising... Its never because of eating meat... To many variables, not enough testing. Not enough genectic testing and probabilities testing... It goes on..

Im not even hardly lazy when it comes to knowledge and understanding. I just recognize that logical fallacies is all too common..
 
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Fred, I don't know if you have any Yves veggie cuisine products down there but they have been very popular here for quite a few years. For people who would like the texture of meat in a meal without any meat. I have had their hot dogs, not bad and their ground meat product in a lasagna. Pretty good.
 
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I did read the links @FredC, i wouldve deftly like to know more about the people that they tested on... Were they non smoker? What was their avg daily intake of sugars? Etc... Those information do matter...

Hundreds of testing is never sufficient... One would need to spend hundreds of millions dollors to do enough adequate testing to truly understand the cause of death by food (they haven't)... One thing for sure is too much sugar, obesity and improperly cooking food(not just meat) breathing smogs, stress etc will increase the chance of early death

That 2010 bar chart, sharp drop in population as they gotten older is probably because they got fat off processed food, not enough veggies(or lack nutrients) and no regular excercising... Its never because of eating meat... To many variables, not enough testing. Not enough genectic testing and probabilities testing... It goes on..

Im not even hardly lazy when it comes to knowledge and understanding. I just recognize that logical fallacies is all too common..

To say it is never because of eating processed meat is false. Processed meat is a group 1 carcinogen. Again that means that it is known to cause cancer when consumed regularly. Cancers that have quite high mortality rates.

And again you clearly did not read the links. “One thing is for sure”. Really? All these things are for sure but the thing that doesn’t mean you can stuff bacon in your throat even though it has overwhelming scientific consensus isn’t?

Logical fallacies indeed....






Edit...and the point of the bar chart was to show just how many 90 year olds there are....despite all the anecdotes of 90 yo bacon scarfing smokers suggesting you shouldn’t be able to throw a stick without hitting one



But it does show where people start dropping off....mostly of heart diseas and cancer
 
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Fred, I don't know if you have any Yves veggie cuisine products down there but they have been very popular here for quite a few years. For people who would like the texture of meat in a meal without any meat. I have had their hot dogs, not bad and their ground meat product in a lasagna. Pretty good.

I don’t think I have seen them. I’ll keep an eye out and give it a try if I do. I generally don’t like faux meat but if it taste good who knows
 
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Just a note on the bacon thing. The flavor is easy to reproduce. Most of the “bacon bits” out there are actually just flavored TVP. No meat
 
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To say it is never because of eating processed meat is false. Processed meat is a group 1 carcinogen. Again that means that it is known to cause cancer when consumed regularly. Cancers that have quite high mortality rates..
Still insufficient data...who are these people subjected to group 1 exposed to processed food? What were their lifestyle(s).... Hardly an overwhelming scientific consensus...it only serves to create circular arguments..
Yes, post hoc ergo propter hoc, it never just because of bacon..to say otherwise is a fallacies. When you have a story that widely varies, it is safe to assume that it is a crappy story...same with research. I choose to look at the whole picture..

And yes, you can gobble bacon and live a long a healthy life..as long you're not a fat ass and excercise regularly.. vice versa, you can not eat bacon, eat healthy and excercise regularly and not be a fatass and still die young because of carcinogens...

Its all ultimately genetics and probability...
 
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You do realize that you are not reading the studies but a synapses right? That we are talking about meta studies of hundred/thousands of other studies that include millions of people? That the actual studies include and account for the variables you are mentioning like age, history, smiling, environment, etc.
That we aren’t talking meat vs veggies here? That people who regularly consume processed meats have constistently been shown across many studies to have higher incidence of disease?

That the fat, lazy, smoking, smog living hamburger eating pucks have less occurrence of disease than their counterparts who regularly consume processed meats?

The only logical fallacy here seems to be your understanding of logical fallacies

You can’t just keep saying “logical fallacy” when the things you are claiming are incorrect. Well, I mean you can but.........
 
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Nothing that i claim are incorrect, how could i be if i choose to see the whole picture... Moderation.

Do you even know what Logical fallacy? Post hoc? Ad hominum? Continuum fallacy? Circular?

Yeah I do know that I am reading a synapse..

"That we are talking about meta studies of hundred/thousands of other studies that include millions of people? That the actual studies include and account for the variables you are mentioning like age, history, smiling, environment, etc."

Only if that were true... Never works out like that. Are you a researcher yourself? Have you ever conducted comprehensive research? Have you ever been a person subjected to studies? Do you know what it takes to do a research? Do you know for a fact that the research that you support is objective with no political agenda?

You mean to tell me that you trust scientist and their research? Good lord..
 
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oh for crying out loud


The world according to me....

it's really pretty simple
eat a nutritious and balanced diet (that can include all the food groups)
don't live a sedentary life style
Drink plenty water
and most importantly eliminate as much stress/turmoil/negative thought as humanly possible

and you'll live well til you die


..L.T.A.
 
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Nothing that i claim are incorrect, how could i be if i choose to see the whole picture... Moderation.

Do you even know what Logical fallacy? Post hoc? Ad hominum? Continuum fallacy? Circular?
Yes. Your post are filled with them. I have chosen to support my argument rather than get side tracked with them though.

"That we are talking about meta studies of hundred/thousands of other studies that include millions of people? That the actual studies include and account for the variables you are mentioning like age, history, smiling, environment, etc."

Only if that were true... Never works out like that.
"After reviewing hundreds of studies, the International Agency for Research on Cancer (IARC), the WHO’s cancer research arm, concluded that processed meats should be classified as carcinogenic to humans for colorectal cancer."
http://www.iarc.fr/en/media-centre/pr/2015/pdfs/pr240_E.pdf


"The researchers, led by Micha and HSPH colleagues Dariush Mozaffarian, assistant professor in the department of epidemiology and Sarah Wallace, junior research fellow in the department of epidemiology, systematically reviewed nearly 1,600 studies. Twenty relevant studies were identified, which included a total of 1,218,380 individuals from 10 countries on four continents (North America, Europe, Australia, and Asia)."

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20479151


Where are all the studies that say it does not increase risk?

The only thing that isn't nailed down is the mechanism of action. Gut flora, specific chemicals, gut floras reaction to certain chemicals. Who knows......


What we are talking about though is something that you do not need to put in your mouth which the overwhelming number of studies say increases the risk of disease. Much less likely to harm you than cigarettes but similar argument.

Are you a researcher yourself?
Nope

Have you ever conducted comprehensive research?
To the point of publishing for peer review? No

Have you ever been a person subjected to studies?
Yes. As have others close to me.

Do you know what it takes to do a research?
I have a pretty good idea.


Do you know for a fact that the research that you support is objective with no political agenda?
Which research exactly? Is that what your issue is? There might be some secret political agenda? Is it the hamburger guys trying to take out the salami producers?


You mean to tell me that you trust scientist and their research? Good lord..
A lot more than some random guy on the internet with an unsourced "big picture"

I have provided support for the fact that processed meat is in fact labeled a group 1 carcinogen and that and that regular consumption is linked to increased risk of diabetes and heart disease. You? Well you "see the big picture". You want to argue that what I have stated is wrong and then turn around and say "moderation". Why the moderation?
 
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I just want to know what food group Little Debbie Snack Cakes fall into..

the "yummy" food group
Little Debbie Oatmeal Cream pies specifically
slathered with Jif peanut butter ..CREAMY!!.not that kid stuff crunchy crAp







LD Nutty Bars gets honorable mention in the yummy food group too

upload_2017-11-27_17-31-3.jpeg



LD cupcakes ??...meh
day old Walmart bakery donuts are better





don't over think it

live well, laugh often, love much

..LT.A.
 
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