Tile and Grout Truck mount: 2,500 PSI / 240 degrees

[Duane Oxley]

After looking into the topic of tile and grout cleaning and checking various sources at the request of a customer, we decided to build a specialized T&G system. We were told that one is being used by a very large company that is said to deliver "up to" 230 degrees and "up to" 3,000 PSI. In following up, we found out that that particular system, while reliable, loses temperature quickly when the wand is constantly keyed open, "lower than the gauge goes, which is 160 degrees".

The system we designed maintains whatever temperature it's set at, up to 230 degrees, at 2,500 PSI, through a rotary tile tool, and fluctuates only plus or minus 10 degrees as the thermostat comes on and off to limit the output temperature.

It features a 20 Kohler Command Pro engine, Roots 36 DSL blower, Cat 5CP pump and clutch, continuous discharge of waste water and 280,000 BTU boiler. In addition, it has 3 hose reels, 200 ft. of Vacuum and Pressure hose. It comes in propane and oil- fired versions.

We're looking into the tile tools themselves, so that we can supply them as well.

This system, without the tools, retails for $15,000

In addition, I'm in the process of designing a continuous filtration system, so that the waste water can be recycled, if desired. (Having designed the UltraFlow filter, I have some specifics in mind that would make this filtration system very efficient with regard to airflow and able to filter down to "silt" size, which is important for pump longevity.)

At any rate, I thought I'd mention this system here.

It's built on the Dominator (belt driven) frame and named the "TG2500" (Tile and Grout 2,500 PSI).

If this sounds of interest to you, get in touch. We can have one ready in the propane version in a matter of days.

Thanks,

Duane

 

[carolinasurface]

Sounds like a PowerClean Industries machine you are describing.

 

[Duane Oxley]

I didn't mention the other system for a reason. I don't post negative / semi- negative stuff about competitive systems as a rule.

The main thing is that the one we designed does exactly what it's supposed to. In truth, I could boost it for "more", but don't see the need to.

However, I am now looking into designing a dual- wand version, tentatively- priced at $22,000. Generating the heat isn't a problem. But the pump necessary will not fit on the current frame, so it would have to be done on a frame dedicated to just that model.

I'm not even sure that such a system would be in demand enough to warrant production...

Time will tell.

 

[Carpet Cleaning Fool]

"Beavis, have you noticed Duane Oxley makes cool truckmounts?"

"Well...huhhh huhh huh.....could you repeat the question?...huhhh huhh,,, oh yeah......yes!""

 

[ACE]

2500 psi and 230F sounds like way too much for tile cleaning. I run into allot of bad installs that can hardly take 800 PSI. I can see guys doing some $erious damage with that set up.

 

[Carpet Cleaning Fool]

"Ever occur to turn down the heat and PSI, bunghole?"

2500 psi and 230F sounds like way too much for tile cleaning. I run into allot of bad installs that can hardly take 800 PSI. I can see guys doing some $erious damage with that set up.

 

[ACE]

um, well, yes, sortof but it there are alot of bevis techs out there.

I know it can be turned down but, I'm missing the selling point; 2500 PSI is To much for tile and not enough water flow for true power washing. I'm sure it could be handy for lite duty pressure washing.

Duane's unit's look soild and I am a big fan of oil fired heat. Bump it up to a number 4 blower and I would be more impressed.

 

[Duane Oxley]

um, well, yes, sortof but it there are alot of bevis techs out there.

I know it can be turned down but, I'm missing the selling point; 2500 PSI is To much for tile and not enough water flow for true power washing. I'm sure it could be handy for lite duty pressure washing.

Duane's unit's look soild and I am a big fan of oil fired heat. Bump it up to a number 4 blower and I would be more impressed.

The Dominator frame that the system is built on will handle a 36, 45 and 47 blower.

As I understand it, the 2,500 PSI mode, coupled with 200- plus degrees of constant temperature is for concrete.

Flow rate at 2,500 PSI is just over 4 GPM.

I'm looking at designing a similar system for 2 wands, that flows 8 to 10 GPM and maintains 200 or more.

 

[roro]

We're looking into the tile tools themselves, so that we can supply them as well.

The heat generated may be an issue Duane. My understanding is that spinners bearing/seal can't take real high heat. From memory the maximum recommended is 100 degC :?:

roro

 

[Rambo]

We have been running our Turbo hybrid at over 200 for two years now w/o problems. High Heat rocks!

 

[Captain Morgan]

I'm looking at designing a similar system for 2 wands, that flows 8 to 10 GPM and maintains 200 or more.

I have doubt Duane's oil fired machines can maintain heat with that sort of flow but, wouldn't you need a blower bigger than a 47 to extract 8-10 GPM? Like a 56 or 59? Or does a tile (only) system not need as big a blower because it's extracting from a flat/hard surface and not extracting from carpet and therefore easier to recover the water?

Did that question make sense?

 

[Duane Oxley]

I have doubt Duane's oil fired machines can maintain heat with that sort of flow...

That's the one thing I'm not concerned about. The system below was delivering 275 degrees at the wand, through a 12 flow, while the outside temperature was 14 degrees, F.:

w]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cxAKhqu0Shsw]

As for recovery of 8 to 10 GPM, I know that some is lost along the way. And most likely, it will require either a 47, or an over- driven 45 blower.

 

[Bob Savage]

I have doubt Duane's oil fired machines can maintain heat with that sort of flow but, wouldn't you need a blower bigger than a 47 to extract 8-10 GPM? Like a 56 or 59? Or does a tile (only) system not need as big a blower because it's extracting from a flat/hard surface and not extracting from carpet and therefore easier to recover the water?

I would like to know how you are going to get 8-10 GPM through a 1/4" solution line.

And the other question I have is, "How do carpet cleaners know more about which blower is better than the people who design, make, and test the truckmounts?"

 

[Duane Oxley]

I would like to know how you are going to get 8-10 GPM through a 1/4" solution line.

You don't. You have to use 3/8" for the system plumbing, then split it into two branches. Ideally, each branch would also be 3/8", but there has been some resistance to that, for the same convenience of maneuverability that exists in standard carpet cleaning systems. Keeping that in mind, the tentative plan is to use 3/8" through each of the two live reels for the first 100 ft., then go down to 1/4".

And the other question I have is, "How do carpet cleaners know more about which blower is better than the people who design, make, and test the truckmounts?"

They don't. But then, they are the customer. If they're convinced of something, the best thing to do is build it to suit their tastes...

 

[Captain Morgan]

"How do carpet cleaners know more about which blower is better than the people who design, make, and test the truckmounts?"

Not sure how to read your question Bob... but if you were asking "how dare I question or "challege" Duane's design and choice of equipment. That wasn't my intent though I understand that seems to be the mantra here.

I'm asking questions simply to become more educated about cleaning systems, what they can do and can't do. What I've picked since being here is that there are a lot of cleaning systems advertised as dual wand systems but the reality is they are not. Either they can't maintain heat or are under powered in the vac department, or both. Hence, guys adding 2.5 hose, reducing restrictions where-ever possible and adding post-heat to their systems.

At 8-10 gallons total flow through two wands.. I thought a 47 blower was undersized. But like my original clarifying question asked.. is a 45/47 blower adaquate because it's not having to pull water off of carpet fibers but a hard surface.. Duane answered the question that his research has revealed that a 47 is adaquate. I trust his answer.

I've read some guys who have 56 blowers say that their systems "can" dual wand, but aren't REALLY optimally designed for proper dual wanding. I read that to mean that carpets are significantly wetter when they dual wand... which in my mind defeats the purpose of dual wanding. Maybe I just have a lot more to learn about this business and expectations of customers and what I can deliver and what manufacturers can deliver at affordable price points too..

I meant no disrespect to Duane or any other manufacture.

 

[GeneMiller]

well said Duane.

gene

 

[Duane Oxley]

At 8-10 gallons total flow through two wands.. I thought a 47 blower was undersized. But like my original clarifying question asked.. is a 45/47 blower adaquate because it's not having to pull water off of carpet fibers but a hard surface.

You're right. "Hard surface" is the key here. Systems we built with a 36 blower did extremely well at recovery at 4 GPM.

I've read some guys who have 56 blowers say that their systems "can" dual wand, but aren't REALLY optimally designed for proper dual wanding. I read that to mean that carpets are significantly wetter when they dual wand... which in my mind defeats the purpose of dual wanding. Maybe I just have a lot more to learn about this business and expectations of customers and what I can deliver and what manufacturers can deliver at affordable price points too..

The thing to keep in mind is that 80% or more of the systems in use today are heat exchange systems. And heat exchange systems that deliver substantial heat do "funny things" with blower airflow, in order to generate more heat. (Basically, they restrict the airflow in order to place the system under constant strain.) Yet secondary fuel systems (like propane and oil- fired) don't need any "boost" from straining the blower. As a result, for a given blower size and RPM, they have more airflow... as much as 50% more, in my opinion... but definitely a surprising difference.

So, a 47, unrestricted for all intents and purposes, will have a huge increase over a 45, and approach a 56 that's restricted for heat gain, in terms of airflow.

I meant no disrespect to Duane or any other manufacture.

None taken, Bill. If you can't ask a question of someone on a subject for fear of rattling them, then something is wrong with the picture, IMO. :roll:

 

[floorguy]

i liked bills thoughts...

and BOB....maybe because we are running the machines out there and MOST of the designers arent???? just a thought there...

They claim this and that, and really you get NEITHER.

I would dare say Duane at least puts them out there for a bit in the REAL WORLD to check his findings...

also i would like to see one with a bit of exchanger to it...nothing much, just get the chill off the water, so you can utlize the most out of the boiler type units...


hey do you use a multi jet burner or the double jet???

me thinks i want to pull my single/double burner ring and put in a multi jet