Flakey custies are killing me-- new booking/cancellation/changing policy are in order

Papa John

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We had 19 jobs this week alone that needed to be changed or cancelled-- 6 of them 'No-Shows" by the custy!

For the past 3 years- appointments made from Oct 1 to Dec 25 had an 18%-30% cancellation or change--- The figure is probably higher for changes because of the way my dispatcher handled appointment time/date changes--

we turn away business during this time because we are booked up-- only to have gaps in our schedule caused by these flaky custies.

I really think I'm going to require a $30 non refundable deposit at the time of booking, beginning Oct 1st. The deposit is lost if the custy changes or cancels the appointment for any reason.

I know there is a risk of losing customers since I think I'm the only one with this type of policy-- hopefully ill only lose the flaky ones..

maybe I'll reach out and inform my competitors of change so that they may consider doing the same thing?
 

Brian H

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If you know you have 18% to 30% cancellation rate during that time, why not overbook?

We get around 5 a day that need to cancel or reschedule. When we are busy, we will overbook at least that many. Any stops that are "close to home" get the last appointment slot and are not assigned to any crew. As the cancellations come in, those close to home stops take the place of the cancelled stops.
 

Desk Jockey

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Wow that is a lot of changing for one week. :eekk:

I don't think money will do it, if they HAD to move or cancel there must have been a good reason. Plus $30.00 isn't really going to make you happier.

Can you make a cancellation list the way dentists do and just work those in that are already scheduled by telling them you have a cancellation?

I can understand your frustration, its deserved but the charging for cancellation is so negative. I'd explore other options if possible.
 
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Papa John

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You get a deposit when they book through Fiddlebug right?


Hows does that settle with the customer?

Sorry Mikey for last response-- this topic and its possible outfall has been of much debate within my business.-- so I've revised the policy, which ill share near end of this post.

Yes we collected a 10% deposit through Fittlebug (FB). most of the flakes were bookings made Off line where didn't in the past collect a deposit. Of the FB orders that cancelled or changed most have done so within the 48 hour limit... but it sucks when the do so on a Friday night and their appointment is Monday morning and it cant be filled- I've solved that in the revised policy. Some FB flakes have made changes or cancelled more then once without penalty!-- the new revised policy also handles this matter. Most custies with FB orders seem to forget about the deposit they made online and I often have to refund it when the tech forgets to adjust the balance due because of the deposit. Of the few custies who have had to forfeit their deposit there has been no negative fall out-- that may be due to the fact that most deposits where only $15. I had one forgetful custie who forgot her appointment or changed it 3 times and could have lost all three $45 deposits-- but I only had the heart to keep two deposits.

Lets face it--- This Policy will have the Same effect as if I raised my prices-- Which is fearful for many Carpet cleaners to do. There will be some "Fall-Out"
The Best Time to Raise Prices or Increase Capacity, by adding a helper or truck, is to do so when you are getting more work than you can handle. We are booking 2 weeks out now and we turn away work everyday. I figured that since it would be months before I could properly Staff our 4th truck-- which we already have as a back-up--- It would be better to "cut out the waste" and increase our efficiency but letting go or charging the customers that decrease it.

I may not agree with Walmart's tactics-- don't get me started-- but what I learned from the documentary about them, was that they Challenged every vendor to find ways to cut out waste and increase efficiency. I feel as a business owner I owe it to my customers to cut out waste, without lowering quality, and improving efficiency before raising prices overall.

I understand that the possible fall out from this policy might create an opportunity for my competition-- but maybe only the flakes will run to them-- there by decreasing their efficiency? I will keep MB posted on how it all works out.

When I was a teenager I said to the richest man in my county-- "Mr. Hammer, It is said that you are the richest man in the county-- what does it take to be Rich?"

He replied, "Wow! John-- Most people just ask me for money-- but you have asked for wisdom instead-- and you will be better for it. It Takes BALLS to be rich. Balls and hard work. By Balls I mean the Guts to take intelligent Risks. The average person will not work 60+hours per week and most will waste their money instead of investing it so that it can grow."

Here is the policy--- I think I've been able to "Spin It" into a positive?

Health Care Tax, Booking, Cancelation and Change Policy

These changes are required in order for us to continue to offer On Time bookings-- as opposed to dreaded 2-4 hour window bookings.
All Phone bookings will require a $30 deposit. All Online Orders will require a 20% deposit. $30 of The deposit is forfeited if you violate our Cancelation or Change policy. You may not change or cancel your appointment within 60 hours of your appointment time. The hours between 3pm Saturday and 9am Monday are excluded from the 60 hours. You may cancel or change an appointment BEFORE the 60 hours only once without penalty. If YOU are late to your appointment or security measures in your high-rise building make us run late to next appointment, you will also lose the deposit.

We reserve the right to make minor changes to your appointment due to computer glitches in the system. We will usually inform you of needed changes within few hours of booking. If we are running ahead of schedule, the tech may call you to see if you would like to be serviced earlier.
These changes will not carry a penalty.

To be fair-- we will deduct $30 from your bill if we are more than 30 minutes late. We will deduct $50 from your next bill if we need to cancel your appointment due to equipment failures or illnesses.

All invoices will have a 4% "health care tax" added to them.
 

Papa John

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If you know you have 18% to 30% cancellation rate during that time, why not overbook?

We get around 5 a day that need to cancel or reschedule. When we are busy, we will overbook at least that many. Any stops that are "close to home" get the last appointment slot and are not assigned to any crew. As the cancellations come in, those close to home stops take the place of the cancelled stops.

We cant overbook because our clients love the fact that we have On time booking.. and having on time booking has really helped our reputation and growth.
 

Papa John

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Wow that is a lot of changing for one week. :eekk:

I don't think money will do it, if they HAD to move or cancel there must have been a good reason. Plus $30.00 isn't really going to make you happier.

Can you make a cancellation list the way dentists do and just work those in that are already scheduled by telling them you have a cancellation?

I can understand your frustration, its deserved but the charging for cancellation is so negative. I'd explore other options if possible.

This is only a problem during the holidays, but it seems to be happening sooner. This has been a problem that has eaten at me for about 3 years now. I've tried the suggestions made by you and Brian H and they have not worked for us.

The goal of the policy is not to make money-- because you are correct- $30 wont make me happy-- But I know $30 will change my customers negative actions and they will respect my time more.

I feel like I'm jumping out of an airplane-- hope the Parachute opens up! haha
 
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WillS

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I've noticed our competitors adding this cancellation fee, their fees are around $45 for a cancellation not within 24 hours. To obtain this cancellation charge, don't you have to ask for a credit card from everyone customer booking? Do you already ask for a CC at time of booking?
 

Papa John

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I've noticed our competitors adding this cancellation fee, their fees are around $45 for a cancellation not within 24 hours. To obtain this cancellation charge, don't you have to ask for a credit card from everyone customer booking? Do you already ask for a CC at time of booking?

My dispatcher is starting to do it now-- but now she wants a raise because she claims its more work for her.. I said it would be less work because their would be less changes and cancellation... Her and I are still in negotiations.. haha --but still a busy day with 16 booking today.
 

WillS

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Do you a POS system that validates it is an actual CC or if she mis types a number it will inform her? 16 bookings - sweet. I love October - May. It is our busiest time in LV since the temperature isn't 110 outside.
 

Papa John

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Do you a POS system that validates it is an actual CC or if she mis types a number it will inform her? 16 bookings - sweet. I love October - May. It is our busiest time in LV since the temperature isn't 110 outside.

Glad you asked that!! Looks like I have a "training opportunity"!! Seems my reluctant dispatcher has entered the CC info into SM but hasn't processed the CC in "Square" I'll have to MB for a little while-- haha
 

Brian H

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Glad you asked that!! Looks like I have a "training opportunity"!! Seems my reluctant dispatcher has entered the CC info into SM but hasn't processed the CC in "Square" I'll have to MB for a little while-- haha

Yikes, you enter customer credit card information into your system? :eekk: I hope that information is some how protected against hacking.

Besides that, good luck with that policy. I will be watching to see how it works out for you.
 

Papa John

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Yikes, you enter customer credit card information into your system? :eekk: I hope that information is some how protected against hacking.

Besides that, good luck with that policy. I will be watching to see how it works out for you.

She didn't enter the CC numbers into Service Monster-- just that payment was made by CC and what type.--- But since she didn't process the CC through Square yet-- I had to train her that payment hadn't been made yet..
Everyone here is trained that CC numbers are never to texted, emailed, faxed or in anyway Transmitted electronically except though the Square reader/app.

Hell!! with the Raise I had to give my dispatcher the Flakes don't seem too bad after All.. haha Actually she is a very valuable asset to the company and was due for a raise.
 

Brian H

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John,

Glad to here that you aren't entering those CC #s in your system. Too many places getting hacked nowadays. Even with systems a lot more sophisticated then us carpet cleaners use.

I am glad you are taking care of your dispatcher too, though it is our Customer Care Coordinators that do the communicating with the customers. Our dispatchers are the liaison between the Customer Care Coordinators and the cleaning crews. They also route each days work. It can be a very fast paced job!!
 

smithbrothers

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you need to look at your operations and figure out what is wrong. Eighteen to thirty percent cancellations on carpet cleaning is astronomical. My be your booking policy. Whatever it is you need to figure it out and fix it. Good luck.

Matt
 

The Great Oz

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you need to look at your operations and figure out what is wrong. Eighteen to thirty percent cancellations on carpet cleaning is astronomical. My be your booking policy. Whatever it is you need to figure it out and fix it. Good luck.
Matt

My hair stood up looking at that percentage as well. I'm going to assume that, because a customer is given a set time, the majority of that percentage is made up of people that decide 9am is too early and are being lumped together with outright cancellations.

For the past 3 years- appointments made from Oct 1 to Dec 25 had an 18%-30% cancellation or change

We don't promise time of day so would only count reschedules to another day as a change, and our reschedules and cancellations are closer to 3%. No deposits or penalties - even for a no-show.

I'd suggest digging down a little and separating every type of schedule change, the reason given for the change, what information you can gather about the customer type, and compare all of those percentages between phone and on-line bookings. It may be that your booking system is at fault, or your website design attracts goofballs, or who knows what, but adding a deposit is only putting a band-aid on the real problem. I hope it works for you, but i'd worry about generating negativity if your customers can choose to use a company that doesn't have the same restrictions.
 

Papa John

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you need to look at your operations and figure out what is wrong. Eighteen to thirty percent cancellations on carpet cleaning is astronomical. My be your booking policy. Whatever it is you need to figure it out and fix it. Good luck.

Matt
Its only that bad during the hectic holiday season. Other times we have been very glad to get a cancellation and go home early or catch on rugs in the plant. Most of the cancellations rebook at a later time when the customers are not so busy.. Some where price shoppers that cancelled because they went with a competitor who offered a Groupon/Deal-- We Actually try to quote Higher Estimates because we do not want to be accused of Bait n Switch-- we also do this to scare away people who shop by Price Alone.-- These people seem to be the biggest headache and the least loyal.

When I was growing up there was a saying that described something happening quickly or at fasted paced-- It was: "Faster then a NYC second/minute!" well I think Life here in SF is even more hectic then NYC-- but we do have kinder people here.

The Problem may be the demographics/psychology of our clients... EVEN Full Circle commented on how difficult it was to book for my clients-- I've just spoiled them and they have high expectation-- They Choose us because we do offer on-time booking.. We've thought about doing 2 hour booking windows and then over book the day but felt that would also cause us problems. But Maybe IF this new policy doesn't work out I'll try the 2 hour window thing.

Some of my custies are stay at home homes with nannies and housekeepers-- and They have the nerve to complain about how busy their lives are--(Spoiled!) I can understand the mom's that are CEOs or upper management being busy.

I had a 92 year old custie that wouldn't let me start a cleaning job because I was 10 minutes Late!-- because she would be late to a date with friends to go climb Mt. Tam! Well, she is 103 now and has been a very loyal customer- Since SHE trained Me to be on-Time-- haha

Its very interesting running a business here in the land of "Froot Loops and Granola" -- It would have made a very entertaining Realty Show-- I say would have-- because the really "entertaining" custies have died off because of their "eccentric" lifestyle.
 

Papa John

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My hair stood up looking at that percentage as well. I'm going to assume that, because a customer is given a set time, the majority of that percentage is made up of people that decide 9am is too early and are being lumped together with outright cancellations.



We don't promise time of day so would only count reschedules to another day as a change, and our reschedules and cancellations are closer to 3%. No deposits or penalties - even for a no-show.

I'd suggest digging down a little and separating every type of schedule change, the reason given for the change, what information you can gather about the customer type, and compare all of those percentages between phone and on-line bookings. It may be that your booking system is at fault, or your website design attracts goofballs, or who knows what, but adding a deposit is only putting a band-aid on the real problem. I hope it works for you, but I'd worry about generating negativity if your customers can choose to use a company that doesn't have the same restrictions.

Sometimes people cancel for the lamest reasons-- just the other day a lady cancelled because HER dog was sick!

One of my business customers, a pediatrician, Charges $175 for missed or cancelled appointment! Since we serve the same Demographics-- She must be experiencing the same flaky customer issue too..

Ofer! Chime in here- please- can a Brother get a back-up here-- haha Isn't SF made up of High Maintenance People!?
 

Shane Deubell

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I'm sure that is all true to an extent but 30% is way too high. You are definitely doing something wrong, somewhere.

Cant just blame others, I would be going through my whole system trying to figure it out.
 

Papa John

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What percentage are re scheduling
And what % are outright canceling?

We really didn't keep accurate enough records to know for sure. kinda treated them all the same in the past.. Dispatcher says-- most rescheduled and were repeat customers. She says we Lose even more potential business because we need more trucks-- They don't want to wait 10 days+ nor even 7 days.

Also the 30% for the previous years is not really an accurate nor true number because of how Full Circle handles calls and booking. FC enters in all the info into SM, then books them even if they are not totally sure if they wanted the appointment. The Callers would then call around and maybe find a lower price--- which is easy to do-- then call us back to cancel. The way My Dispatcher handles the calls is that she will answer all their questions FIRST-- then ask if they would like to be booked-- some do - but many just shopping or getting info - and then call us back later--- The Difference between the two ways of handling calls is that Our dispatcher will have fewer cancellations from Prospects. (My definitions- "Prospects"-- someone who booked an appointment but not serviced yet.)

Weird how just one week can get me so worked up. The Friday before THAT week began I had a Long-Time Client do a No-SHow-- I called her to let her know I arrived early and was outside her home and ready to start If that worked for her... She replied, "Oh So Sorry John I Totally forgot about our appointment and I'm on Vacation--- I feel Just Horrible that I did this!-- What is your policy in this type of situation?"
"Forgiveness is our Policy" I replied.
"Really!?"-- "you may add a fee to my bill if you need to-- I feel really Bad about this!" she said
"Mary- you were to be my last customer today- Its Friday- And I leave for Vacation tomarrow-- I'm Very Happy to be Off early today"
"Wow- what a way to build Brand loyality!"

I think I'm going to rewrite the policy again. stay turned.. BTW people are still booking-- another good day-- 16 bookings again. today-- same with yesterday.
 
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Desk Jockey

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Every now and then like a dumb shit I forget my haircut and then have to call and apologize for missing it. She is always so gracious and refuses to charge me anything. I always pay for the time I cost her plus my current haircut.

Have to keep myself in good graces for the next time I screw up! :biggrin:
 
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Mikey P

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John if and when you find a San Franciscan who is masculine, hard working, honorable and doesn't live on his mom's couch how long does it take you to train him to be on his own and how much does it cost you to keep him happy and loyal?


I know, it's rhetorical.
 
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ruff

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Yea!
I want to know that too.

and how, where, when, who etc. he finds them?

......and we don't give didley...about "masculine" and or the "mom's couch", honorable and hard working will do just fine, sir.
 
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Papa John

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John if and when you find a San Franciscan who is masculine, hard working, honorable and doesn't live on his mom's couch how long does it take you to train him to be on his own and how much does it cost you to keep him happy and loyal?


I know, it's rhetorical.
The problem is that is hard to find a person like that in SF.. Even Ofer had a hard time. My Main Guy -who is my Ex-biz partner n ex-brother-in-law-- makes about $65k- 70k a year and Rents a room in my place at below market price of just $600-- and He is still is Broke!!!

He has been with me for 4.5 years and still doesn't know everything-- but he thinks he does. But I'm Blessed to have him.

It takes about 3 months to learn the Basics to where they will have LESS chance of ******* things up-- I don't want to "Buy" anymore sofas or rugs! But its always a risk when you hire someone.
Training should be an on going Thing.
 

Papa John

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What percentage are re scheduling
And what % are outright canceling?

Auditing all this info is turning my brain into Oatmeal! I didn't try to figure numbers or %s because my head would explode-- but here is the over all picture Of the people who Cancelled:

Almost All called into the office and didn't pay a deposit. Of the people who booked online and Paid a deposit- Only 3 out of 71 online bookings for September cancelled their appointment- and all 3 got their deposit back.
All exciting clients rebooked. Most of the people who cancelled and never rebooked-- have never tried us before. They may have went with someone cheaper then us-- which is ok with me. But I do worry that they may have a bad experience with the company they choose and their view on professional CC turns negative.. If they found a cleaner that pleased them- then so be It-- THAT cleaner earned their business.

I think the bottom line is--- The deposit makes them respect OUR time... And Don't WE Carpet cleaners also deserve some Respect of Our time?!?
 

Papa John

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So After much debate I've decided to Scrap the "Booking, Cancellation & Change Policy" I'm going to go a different route-- I will keep MB informed on how it is working out-
Below is what is to replace that negative policy:

On Time Booking Guarantee
We will deduct $30 from your bill if we are more than 30 minutes late. We will deduct $50 from your next bill if we need to cancel your appointment due to equipment failures or illnesses. Missed appointments caused by lack of parking are exempt from these discounts. .
All bookings will require a $30 deposit. The deposit is forfeited if you change or cancel your appointment within 60 hours of your appointment time. The hours between 3pm Saturday and 9am Monday are excluded from the 60 hours. You may cancel or change an appointment BEFORE the 60 hours only once without penalty. If YOU are late to your appointment or security measures in your high-rise building make us run late to next appointment, you will also lose the deposit. We reserve the right to make minor changes to your appointment due to computer glitches in the system. We will usually inform you of needed changes within few hours of booking. If we are running ahead of schedule, the tech may call you to see if you would like to be serviced earlier. These changes will not carry a penalty.
These changes are required in order for us to continue to offer On Time bookings-- as opposed to dreaded 2-4 hour window bookings.
All invoices will have a 4% "health care tax" added to them.
 

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