Pro Chem Performer/405

[TConway]

I have a question, I have always heard pretty good things about the PC 405 but I was going through the online manuals and was wondering why the 405 was sold as a dual wand unit?

The motor is a 4 banger so I can see better BTU's from that, it also had another blower HX added.
What is kinda odd to me is it has the same 4M-L blower as my PC Legend SE.

The 405 manual says the rpms on that blower were set at 2650 rpms.

On my legend the same 4M-L blower in the manual says it is spinning at 3195 rpms ?

I am guessing that the 405 just had better heat and this made poeple think it was more powerful?

 

[Desk Jockey]

Dated info. When was that? Mid 90's?

We've done it and I wouldn't recommend it.

However it's better a whole lot better than using portables. But yeah it's not a true dual wander.

 

[Zee]

They all do it.....


Ask Masterblend what their truckmount is capable of... Dual wanding...or 700 feet of hose... okay then..... I have tried with 85 feet of 2.5" hose and the rest 2" hose all the way to one 2" Greenhorn 325' total. Hahahahahahhaaa ridiculously weak even at that length.

 

[Nate The Great]

Dated info. When was that? Mid 90's?

We've done it and I wouldn't recommend it.

However it's better a whole lot better than using portables. But yeah it's not a true dual wander.

I know a guy who will disagree with you................... @Bob Savage

 

[Desk Jockey]

They all do it.....


Ask Masterblend what their truckmount is capable of... Dual wanding...or 700 feet of hose... okay then..... I have tried with 85 feet of 2.5" hose and the rest 2" hose all the way to one 2" Greenhorn 325' total. Hahahahahahhaaa ridiculously weak even at that length.

This is true. The CDS'S and Butlers we've owned had dual ports but they were no better than the Performers.

 

[TConway]

It makes you wonder if they were doing this back then..mid 90's, and doing it often, then the TM's of today have really come a long ways, and guys of today are still wanting MORE.
How much do you think the dry times have improved from when the PCP/405 was going strong, to todays units. Dual wand set up.

It is also making me wonder if 24 hr dry times are all that bad? I bet there is still a lot of PCP/405 out there today
Maybe they were running dual 1.5's with whips too

 

[Nate The Great]

It makes you wonder if they were doing this back then..mid 90's, and doing it often, then the TM's of today have really come a long ways, and guys of today are still wanting MORE.
How much do you think the dry times have improved from when the PCP/405 was going strong, to todays units. Dual wand set up.

It is also making me wonder if 24 hr dry times are all that bad? I bet there is still a lot of PCP/405 out there today
Maybe they were running dual 1.5's with whips too

That was the normal back then when it was sold as a dual wand capable machine....

 

[JS41035]

If you were coming from a bane , it was three wand capable.
But the blower size was always the weak link to me for the 405. Arguably the best single wand slide in ever. But 13 hg and the equivalent of a 47 on that big of a machine just never felt right.
Everybody tried dual wanding with it. But it just didn't have the vac.

 

[Desk Jockey]

It makes you wonder if they were doing this back then..mid 90's, and doing it often, then the TM's of today have really come a long ways, and guys of today are still wanting MORE.
How much do you think the dry times have improved from when the PCP/405 was going strong, to todays units. Dual wand set up.

It is also making me wonder if 24 hr dry times are all that bad? I bet there is still a lot of PCP/405 out there today
Maybe they were running dual 1.5's with whips too

We've run CDS'S and currently have both Butlers and Performers. I can't tell a difference in dry times between them. It has more to do with the operator and the tool.

Prochem wasn't about 1.5 hose. All the big machines came with 2-inch hose and 2-inch wand.

 

[MerCrewser]

We dual wanded with the 405 this weekend and it was great. Cgd 200'ish each way. I'd rather more oomph but I was pleasantly surprised. Moving up to a big machine for this account this summer.

Carpets were dry when we left sop

 

[TConway]

If you were coming from a bane , it was three wand capable.
But the blower size was always the weak link to me for the 405. Arguably the best single wand slide in ever. But 13 hg and the equivalent of a 47 on that big of a machine just never felt right.
Everybody tried dual wanding with it. But it just didn't have the vac.

This is what kinda shocked me as I was looking at the manuals online and the 405 has the same blower as the PC Legend Se and mine is a #4 or = to a 45 blower?
On the PCP/405 it is actually spinning at less rpm?

 

[MerCrewser]

The performer has a 45 blower. The 405 has a 47 blower. I'm thinking the performers turn their respective blowers faster than the smaller units regardless of what the brochures say. Only way to tell is to look at each machine in real life.

 

[Nampa Carpet Cleaning]

I have a question, I have always heard pretty good things about the PC 405 but I was going through the online manuals and was wondering why the 405 was sold as a dual wand unit?

The motor is a 4 banger so I can see better BTU's from that, it also had another blower HX added.
What is kinda odd to me is it has the same 4M-L blower as my PC Legend SE.

The 405 manual says the rpms on that blower were set at 2650 rpms.

On my legend the same 4M-L blower in the manual says it is spinning at 3195 rpms ?

I am guessing that the 405 just had better heat and this made poeple think it was more powerful?

I always questioned how much performance the 405 really has. I know it is one of the most popular Prochem units made. If you look back in the archives you can find where one guy went to a SS 370 and he like it better than his 405.

 

[Lee Stockwell]

New machines beat old machines because of poor maintenance.

 

[Nampa Carpet Cleaning]

Plus old used blowers most loose a little performance as the hours add up

 

[rwcarpet]

I had a 405 Performer Cat. (still have it) Would get crazy hot, but as a dual wander? Nah. It was acceptable as a dual wand, short run machine, but true cleaning performance wasn't there. At least not acceptable to me. I ran a Powerclean Genesis 59 for 13 years. Claimed an 800 cfm performance, but fell far below that. It would dual wand but not to peak performance. My idea of true dual wand performance is full power at each wand, just as if single wanding. Maybe some of the SS, Prochem, and Hydra master big machines will do it, the the ultimate would be an Aerotech.

 

[Lee Stockwell]

Our WM pro 2000 has dual 45s and separate waste tanks.

 

[rwcarpet]

Our WM pro 2000 has dual 45s and separate waste tanks.

Well now Lee.....that's a different animal! If you have dual blowers, you're going to get better performance. I'm saying that some of the mid range TM's don't perform to my expectations as a dual wand machine, unless you're just dualing upholstery.

 

[JS41035]

New machines beat old machines because of poor maintenance.

I thought you were super busy today?

 

[John Olson]

This is what kinda shocked me as I was looking at the manuals online and the 405 has the same blower as the PC Legend Se and mine is a #4 or = to a 45 blower?
On the PCP/405 it is actually spinning at less rpm?

Someone already answered you but your not looking at the 405 manual your looking at a performer. Same Animal different species. Go back and read it again

 

[KevinD]

I thought you were super busy today?

He didn't say doing what

 

[Jeffrey Tobian]

On a big commercial I will run two wands on my prochem 405 at 100 feet each , both have green glides on the wands and on the other side of the building I have a blue line thermal wave HP II and on the unit I run two wands at 150 feet. If I have to go further I just run one wand. It helps to run the hoses all the way to the truck and to keep the wands to the floor and use green glides. I really like my prochem 405 , I use that unit the most and use my blue line thermal wave HP II as a backup unit . I will say the blue line with a 3,000 psi pump rocks for cleaning tile and grout, just don't use a SX12 with that unit the dome collapse with the heat and vacuum and the jets made a circle in the tile

 

[SamIam]

Performer had the same blower as a legend. The performer 405 has 405 cfm, the legend 300 cfm, the legend has a 4.5 blower the 405 a 4.7 blower.

I had both and yes the 405 has way more suck.

Like John said the manual is for a performer with a 4.5 blower and the performer 405 with a 4.7 blower.


http://www.prochem.com/Upload/KCPro...2c44_67-945324_PerformerPlus_Performer405.pdf

Note the Performer plus _ Performer405 2 different machines.

 

[SamIam]

Dated info. When was that? Mid 90's?

We've done it and I wouldn't recommend it.

However it's better a whole lot better than using portables. But yeah it's not a true dual wander.

I would say if your using 2 glideless PC quad wands with 4-6 flow each it's doable ATW 100 feet hose run tops.

 

[Desk Jockey]

It's more and insurance policy. Should a unit go down on a big job we will run dual to finish up or until we can get another until to replace the one that went down.

 

[TConway]

Well I went back and looked,....scrolled down one more page, I didn't realize the two were different but yep the 407 does have a bigger blower 47. So this makes much more sense now. I think one of these, if found clean would be a nice single wand unit.
Thanks guys.

 

[Captain Morgan]

What size Nissan engine does the 405 have? Is it 49 hp? Is that the same engine the chemspec 860 uses spinning a 59 blower?

Playing devil's advocate here but, if the 405 engine has enough horses to turn a 59 couldn't you swap out the 47 and replace it with a 56 and have all the vacuum you'd need to be a "true dual" wand rug sucker? Or is simply a matter of the frame not being large enough and strong enough to hold a 56?

The guy I started with part time in early 2000's had a 405 and would clean commercial accounts with 2 long hose runs probably 175-200 ft each at times and never got complaints about over wet carpets or slow dry times and he used the prochem 4 & 6 jet wands.
**Disclaimer.. I don't know what his pressure or flow rate was on the wands though...but I think it was more than 4 or 6 flow.

 

[Cleanworks]

There is a performer 405 for sale near me. It is installed in a trailer with all the hose reels and a rx 20 for 12,000.00. For myself, I would hav to transfer into my van and sell the trailer. Is it worth it? All you Yankees you know you can buy it for 40 percent less right now. Ps the trailer is heated, used to belong to a school district used for cleaning schools.

 

[John Olson]

Good deal or bad deal all depends on condition. If the governor is bad that's a grand. Lots of machine out there that when the governor goes they never replace them. Same with HX'ers lots of guys just by pass them and run off the cat HX. You could end up with a mint machine or a money pit. Does the blower knock at all? Does the pump pulse? Pulsation dampener is another thing people don't replace like they should. Does the Chem Pump work correctly? How about the Peter Paul valve? I can go on and on. When we do a ground up restoration we sell them for around 10k but they look and run like brand new. Lots of pictures in mikeysboard

 

[John Olson]

here is an Everest we did. I have pictures of the 405 we just did last year on here at least I thought I did i'll keep looking http://www.mikeysboard.com/threads/prochem-everest-resurrection.250205/#post-4015338