The level of HWE experience in most "VLM only" cleaners.

[Goomer]

It seems to be a recurrent theme amongst most VLM only cleaners that there is a severe LACK of experience and knowledge in regards to proper HWE technique and equipment.

It's interesting that I don't believe I know of any current VLM only advocates that have any significant, long term proper HWE experience under their belt, and have still decided to go support a VLM only philosophy.

Coincidence??

Any of you VLM only Goobers claim to have any significant HWE experience worth sharing in support of your decisions to remain VLM only?

 

[GeeeAus]

What I will say for VLM has going for it is it targets the area of most concern in carpet cleaning, the face fibre. In realistic terms the carpet owner is only likely to come into physical contact with the top few millimetres of carpet pile. Very few people will actively part carpet fibre to rub their fingers in the backing layers. Encap does a reasonable job of cleaning this face fibre and if the likes of a good oxidiser are used then the disinfection of this area, along with the chemical removal of oils means that for most practical intents and purposes the carpet is satisfactorily clean to be in service.

Even in a domestic setting.

So if you like, encap is very efficient becuase it uses very few resources and concentrates what limited consumption of resources it consumes on the area of most concern.

Grant

 

[GCCLee]

What I will say for VLM has going for it is it targets the area of most concern in carpet cleaning, the face fibre. In realistic terms the carpet owner is only likely to come into physical contact with the top few millimetres of carpet pile. Very few people will actively part carpet fibre to rub their fingers in the backing layers. Encap does a reasonable job of cleaning this face fibre and if the likes of a good oxidiser are used then the disinfection of this area, along with the chemical removal of oils means that for most practical intents and purposes the carpet is satisfactorily clean to be in service.

Even in a domestic setting.

So if you like, encap is very efficient becuase it uses very few resources and concentrates what limited consumption of resources it consumes on the area of most concern.

Grant

Do NOt Believe That at all.

1.kids
2.we SUK as we BLOW resulting in the REMOVAL of foreign particulates from the Carpeting we are servicing.
3. You don't have a magic dirt magnet : )

 

[GeeeAus]

Do NOt Believe That at all.

1.kids
2.we SUK as we BLOW resulting in the REMOVAL of foreign particulates from the Carpeting we are servicing.
3. You don't have a magic dirt magnet : )

I'm happy to pay encap it's due. HWE is still my choice for much of the reasons you state.

Grant

 

[GCCLee]

I'm happy to pay encap it's due. HWE is still my choice for much of the reasons you state.

Grant

VLM has it's place, Between HWE Cleanings as a VISUAL APPERANCE, Fiber Face maintenance cycle maybe. Other than that its over abused!

 

[John G]

Pray tell us all about your vast experience Goomer..

 

[Mardie]

GOOMER or is it Goober? I have been doing this for almost 5 years But I have many clients that have been hiring carpet cleaners for 20-30 years and it is their opinions and experience that I draw on. I do not validate or need some internet mouth piece to tell me how I am doing.

 

[Mardie]

VLM has it's place, Between HWE Cleanings as a VISUAL APPERANCE, Fiber Face maintenance cycle maybe. Other than that its over abused!

According to who a competing carpet cleaner or the happy client ? Ya know if the clients did not like their VLM services VLM would not be making the leaps and bound that they are in the carpet cleaning industry.

 

[GCCLee]

And the Writer for Puff The Magic Dragon never smoked weed so : )

 

[Zee]

So if you like, encap is very efficient becuase it uses very few resources and concentrates what limited consumption of resources it consumes on the area of most concern.

Grant

That is not entirely true... Just look at how much "resources" using mardie testified for the other day..

A few gallons of water in the customer's home plus chemicals. A bathtub full of hot water and chemicals at home to soak the pads after use. A washing machine and chemicals to wash those pads after soaking.

So if we are talking about resources, I would say -a tm running for an hour and a half on a job using a gallon of*gasoline and the water being used on a job is maybe 30-50gallon- is not any different from the padding.

 

[Lee Stockwell]

We have been cleaning carpet for over 43 years and have NEVER had the bad hwe experiences "vlm only" proponents claim.

I own and use 2 op machines along with other vlm tools.

I am a CARPET cleaner. ..what ever it takes.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk 2

 

[Steamin McFadden]

It seems to be a recurrent theme amongst most VLM only cleaners that there is a severe LACK of experience and knowledge in regards to proper HWE technique and equipment.

It's interesting that I don't believe I know of any current VLM only advocates that have any significant, long term proper HWE experience under their belt, and have still decided to go support a VLM only philosophy.

Coincidence??

Any of you VLM only Goobers claim to have any significant HWE experience worth sharing in support of your decisions to remain VLM only?

I agree 100% with your observation.!!

Very true, I know several Former VLM only guys that after gaining some experience have bought truck mounts and tossed the VLM gear, (my self included). It just takes a little time for the VLM brain washing to loosen it's grip .

Between my self and several other guys I know that made the switch ,the average is 3 to 5 years in the bizz.

So Mardie that means statistically you will be running a TM next year.

 

[Mikey P]

I just sold a Rotovac 360i to a board member who has worked his way up the evolutionary chain from a VLMr to a Electro TMr on his way up to a small Tm.

His first experience with real flushing was like seeing God on a tortilla for the first time.


Next he'll be buying my Vortex.


I can guaranf'ntee you that if Mardie came on a ride along for about five jobs with me, he'd go home and sell most of that junk and whore his family out to buy an Aerotech.

 

[Zee]

I just sold a Rotovac 360i to a board member who has worked his way up the evolutionary chain from a VLMr to a Electro TMr on his way up to a small Tm.

His first experience with real flushing was like seeing God on a tortilla for the first time.


Next he'll be buying my Vortex.


I can guaranf'ntee you that if Mardie came on a ride along for about five jobs with me, he'd go home and sell most of that junk and whore his family out to buy an Aerotech.

I've been offering a ride along, if some of these guys want to go on a vacation in San Diego or Orange county...I offered it to mardie since he first came on the board.

 

[Goomer]

Pray tell us all about your vast experience Goomer..

It's not about how vast my experience is.

It's more about diversification of different methods that I have enough first-hand hands-on experience to draw a conclusion that is based on my own testing and observations, as opposed to merely drawing a conclusion based on the "tales of others".

Isn't such a key decision such as choosing a primary method important enough to warrant gaining enough personal experience to make the choice an educated one as opposed to one made in ignorance??

 

[Jeremy]

It seems to be a recurrent theme amongst most VLM only cleaners that there is a severe LACK of experience and knowledge in regards to proper HWE technique and equipment.

It's interesting that I don't believe I know of any current VLM only advocates that have any significant, long term proper HWE experience under their belt, and have still decided to go support a VLM only philosophy.

Coincidence??

Any of you VLM only Goobers claim to have any significant HWE experience worth sharing in support of your decisions to remain VLM only?

I regard this statement as a broad generalization... While I had portables and a TM at my disposal I found that in most commercial scenarios they were less efficient than an OP machine with decent chems. The exceptions to that being impacted grease and bodily fluids. While HWE (even with high heat) did a better job of brightening overall, it did tend to leave something to be desired in the way of spot removal. In my experience the best method was to pre-scrub then rinse and post pad/post encap. You'll notice that both methods were employed... Neither was always "the best".

Both methods have a a place and are simply tools that allow us to do a job... Any mechanic will tell you he's only as good as his tools.

 

[Mardie]

Jeremy I think that almost every one knows that dual processing is superior in almost all situations BUT yet you get these yahoos that just seem to post comments to mislead and manipulate the unknowing.

 

[Goomer]

I regard this statement as a broad generalization... While I had portables and a TM at my disposal I found that in most commercial scenarios they were less efficient than an OP machine with decent chems. The exceptions to that being impacted grease and bodily fluids. While HWE (even with high heat) did a better job of brightening overall, it did tend to leave something to be desired in the way of spot removal. In my experience the best method was to pre-scrub then rinse and post pad/post encap. You'll notice that both methods were employed... Neither was always "the best".

Both methods have a a place and are simply tools that allow us to do a job... Any mechanic will tell you he's only as good as his tools.

In a commercial setting I can definitely see the logic and benefits of low moisture methods.

My statement was directed mainly towards the residential VLM only practitioners.

 

[Lefty724]

Well I'm the guy that bought Mikey's 360i (thanks Mikey!)....and I can honestly say that this is the cleanest carpet is going to get....Period! All I can say is that using a RE tool is pretty much "cheating" compared to a 175/wand IMO.

I have been HWE, VLM, and now back to HWE. Right now I'm using my Techno Viking until my new TM comes in.

I still use VLM almost everyday and think it has it's place in our trade. I do think that HWE is more efficient and gives a deeper clean, especially when using a RE. I am using HWE for ALL apts, move in/outs, and foreclosure/short sales, it just makes me sleep better at night.

I mostly use VLM for vacation rentals, commercial, and touch up/spotting using Releasit products.

 

[Mikey P]

Jeremy I think that almost every one knows that dual processing is superior in almost all situations BUT yet you get these yahoos that just seem to post comments to mislead and manipulate the unknowing.

I dual process every day.

With out a truck or portable, how are you Mardie?

 

[Mardie]

I dual process every day.

With out a truck or portable, how are you Mardie?

VS/Cimex and now VS/OP

 

[Mikey P]

Scrubbing and scrubbing is not a dual process. .

 

[GeeeAus]

I dual process every job........

Grant

 

[John G]

It's not about how vast my experience is.

It's more about diversification of different methods that I have enough first-hand hands-on experience to draw a conclusion that is based on my own testing and observations, as opposed to merely drawing a conclusion based on the "tales of others".

Isn't such a key decision such as choosing a primary method important enough to warrant gaining enough personal experience to make the choice an educated one as opposed to one made in ignorance??

Now we are getting somewhere...

Ok, over 40 years, I have used portys, an electric Tm, crbs, rotaries, and of course OP, and guess what, they ALL clean..
I have cleaned with countless other cleaners all over the country..
I chose OP because of the benefits "I SAW".

 

[GCCLee]

Um, common sense says if you rub a spinny pad on the floor your gonna smear some shit : )

 

[John G]

That ain't common sense, that is ignorance of how the system works..

I've been offering a ride along, if some of these guys want to go on a vacation in San Diego or Orange county...I offered it to mardie since he first came on the board..
Zee, I will be in San Diego January 27th, take me cleaning....

 

[bob vawter]

common sense tells us that G is a sh*t smearer.....
this ain't rocket science girls....!

 

[GCCLee]

Give U a ride along.

Show ya wut a lil suction does big guy! After that, we can compare the slop outta my tank vs yur spinny pads : )

Please tell us Mikey pays you to post!

 

[Mardie]

Scrubbing and scrubbing is not a dual process. .

Steam Cleaners such as your self are old school thinkers and just are not capable of comprehending the mechanics and science of cleaning. Your opinions on how carpet cleaning is done with different methods is based on ignorance and arrogance.

 

[Mardie]

I dual process every job........

Grant

Grant I would put my money on you in a clean off with any one on this board. I think you and your BISSEL would humble this BB with your attitude, dedication and knowledge. I can see it now Bissel vs AT and wins.