Diesel fired water heaters.....?

[Nate The Great]

I've always ran Little Giant propane water heaters since I was little. I'm ignorant when it comes to diesel. I'm looking/asking for direction with diesel fired heaters. I was looking at the northstar heater to replace my LG. I would also be able to use my 3,500psi pressure washer if I ever needed too.

I'd like to hear pro's and con's...

I was also looking into the Silver Eagle Manufacturing heater and they're SS coiled model too. I also seen something about the MasterBlend diesel heaters with Stainless steel coils about $3k. Made in Italy makes me worry some, but MB should stock parts.

I understand you need a 15amp outlet to run the blower fan?!?


Mods, please don't move the thread to the hardware room... Give it some discussion before moving it. Thanks!

 

[Goomer]

I used to have the Northstar unit.

Strong fuel and exhaust odor and rediculous exhaust heat. Idealy should be vented outside of vehicle.
You will need to swap out the stock flow switch to a lower flow model (40 bucks).
Big and heavy.
Sitting water will turn black and will need to be flushed before use.
Requires 4 amps to fire the igniter, not a blower.

Absolutely rediculous heat for only 15 hunert.

 

[Dolly Llama]

3500psi??
you pressure washing??

I've run fuel burners more than anything..they make crazy heat but can be more quirky than propane due to more parts to the system
All the ones I've used (Wayne and the Italian burner MB uses ) ran/run on 110vt.
It's my understanding they're generally more reliable than the 12vt systems

I run K1 kero in mine..it's cleaner and doesn't stink like diesel
it also my opinion they're less troublesome with kero


..L.TA.

 

[Shane T]

3500psi??
you pressure washing??

I've run fuel burners more than anything..they make crazy heat but can be more quirky than propane due to more parts to the system
All the ones I've used (Wayne and the Italian burner MB uses ) ran/run on 110vt.
It's my understanding they're generally more reliable than the 12vt systems

I run K1 kero in mine..it's cleaner and doesn't stink like diesel
it also my opinion they're less troublesome with kero


..L.TA.

What do you use for a fuel tank? An outboard fuel cell setting on the van floor?

 

[Dolly Llama]

What do you use for a fuel tank? An outboard fuel cell setting on the van floor?

yep


..L.T.A.

 

[Shane T]

yep


..L.T.A.

That's one nice thing about a propane belly tank, it frees up floor space.

 

[Dolly Llama]

That's one nice thing about a propane belly tank, it frees up floor space.

True that, Shane


.L.T.A.

 

[Zee]

Mods, please don't move the thread to the hardware room... Give it some discussion before moving it. Thanks!

I love how you asked for it and it was moved immediately and other threads like this stick around sometimes for a long time in the clean room.

 

[Nate The Great]

I love how you asked for it and it was moved immediately and other threads like this stick around sometimes for a long time in the clean room.

Yea, Mikey was pissed I didn't bring him poi this past MF.... How do you like your MB heater Zee? Any problems you had with it?


And Larry Capitoni, you always come to mind when I think of diesel heaters.... I have a pressure washer that's 3,500psi.. I don't really do pressure washing, but it would be a nice option to have.. At least it'll be able to handle higher pressure and hold heat better... I don't know of a place that I've seen Kero/K1 sold at.. I was just running the options through my head.. I'm mechanically inclined, so I know how to spin a wrench or 2...

I've also read where guys add a belt driven generator to their TM's like the El Diablo does to run the outlet.. I'll be ducting the exhaust outside the van.. I like the fact you can fill up while filling the van at the gas station without having to go to a propane station.. I do have a few different propane tanks I can switch out for my LG before making a run for more propane... But propane is about the same cost, if not higher than diesel here (Propane $4.89gal--- Diesel $4.69gal roughly).

 

[floorguy]

i have the silver eagle one....its been pretty good.....the ignitors, go out for me, more then i would like...about 1 a year...but the mfg said they have a 3 yr warrenty....so i got like 3 back (kept my old ones) for free

if you run soft water it should be fine...i ran mine with out for 7 yrs, and yea it finally got pretty bad, i had to take it in to a PW place to descale it...

and once it gets "seasoned" run it for about 2 mins to flush the line, and you are good to go...

plus you are already use to propane....and its a 12v system

 

[Zee]

With the El D type diesel burner you will have some pros and cons to consider.

I believe there is a fundamental flaw in design with the water temp sensor being closer to the front of the tm rather than being right at or inside the heater.

If you DON'T run soft water and or run chems thru the system you'll have problems with the flow switch constantly getting stuck in the on position.

That's where the design flaw is important: if you don't constantly listen to your tm, you could blow up your heater.

When the water is not traveling thru the system the flame should NOT burn- ever. I hate the fact that I have to work with a tm listening to the sound of the heater. To make sure I don't blow it out.

I always descale every couple hundred hours and no chemical runs thru it other than water. Yet the burner has blown hoses wide open because of a stuck flow switch.

Working 3 floors up 250 feet away you can't hear your burner burning out of control blowing a hose or worse.


The pros are things like almost instant heat as much of that as you want and more. Kinda addicting like the big blower guys with their blowers. I haven't had to fix on the burner anything other than the blown hoses and connectors. Electrical wise its running perfect with the belt driven generator.

 

[GCCLee]

You wanna talk about lightin burners!


400yrs experience in the industry and I had to light the dang heaters in cali.


Buncha weenies!


Sent from da middle of a Trailure park

 

[Desk Jockey]

We'd have been frozen weenies without you Chris!

 

[GeneMiller]

Duane Oakley has a diesel burner he builds and it has a flow switch that is supposed to be reliable. It senses flow instead of temp I believe. Is also rated to 10,000 psi so you don't have to worry about it freezing and breaking. 110v is more reliable but he claims he has the problem solved.

Gene

 

[Zee]

Duane Oakley has a diesel burner he builds and it has a flow switch that is supposed to be reliable. It senses flow instead of temp I believe. Is also rated to 10,000 psi so you don't have to worry about it freezing and breaking. 110v is more reliable but he claims he has the problem solved.

Gene

I have first hand experience (thosands of hours) with Oxley's stuff....not better than others out there at all! I can't tell you how many times I had to take apart the flowswitch that he put on the tm.

If anything I would rather take the El D burner than deal with Duane and his units.



Edit: I realized you said diesel burner. I have the experience with his propane burners. But I'm assuming it is the same flowswitch or very similar.

 

[Jimbo]

Hey Nate...Check this place out... http://kleanline.net/ Kleanline® CWHG Series I think they will make a stainless coil also.

 

[floorguy]

whats funny is....

a flow switch is a flow switch is a flow switch....

its a little fooking magnet that moves when water pushes it....then it goes across the metal reeds to make contact, thus sending a signal it has water......

i just bought a new ohhhh 3 mths ago....when i had my coil scaled....i told them to take it off (and they did)...anyway get it back and still had issues (thought it was so full of shit it didnt allow enough FLOW)

anyway....bad top to the part that moves...it was loose instead of in place.....robbed one from a old switch....WAHLAH....works fine

 

[tmdry]

I've had 2 of those northern tool diesel heaters, the only thing went bad on one was the thermostat ($30 part univeral), and the flow switch again $40 bucks. Yes, the 12v cord sucks unless you have a pto/direct drive than you can run an inverter to battery while leaving the truck on.

I also have 2 little giants and have spent way more $ and headaches w/ fixed coils, new coils, new regulators, cleaning jets/burners, time off fixing the darn things, and heat not as impressive as the 360k btu.

 

[Shane T]

whats funny is....

a flow switch is a flow switch is a flow switch....

its a little fooking magnet that moves when water pushes it....then it goes across the metal reeds to make contact, thus sending a signal it has water......

i just bought a new ohhhh 3 mths ago....when i had my coil scaled....i told them to take it off (and they did)...anyway get it back and still had issues (thought it was so full of shit it didnt allow enough FLOW)

anyway....bad top to the part that moves...it was loose instead of in place.....robbed one from a old switch....WAHLAH....works fine

I think the vibrations we get with TMs has an affect on these type of switches. I know it did on the reed type of level switches that where used on my PowerClean.

 

[floorguy]

I think the vibrations we get with TMs has an affect on these type of switches. I know it did on the reed type of level switches that where used on my PowerClean.

your talking about when the heater is mounted to the machine right?? Like an eldiablo or steamway...

that i would agree on...

but if its a separate unit, i wouldnt think it matters....

 

[Shane T]

Yes

 

[Nate The Great]

I've had 2 of those northern tool diesel heaters, the only thing went bad on one was the thermostat ($30 part univeral), and the flow switch again $40 bucks. Yes, the 12v cord sucks unless you have a pto/direct drive than you can run an inverter to battery while leaving the truck on.

I also have 2 little giants and have spent way more $ and headaches w/ fixed coils, new coils, new regulators, cleaning jets/burners, time off fixing the darn things, and heat not as impressive as the 360k btu.

How long have you owned both LG and Northstar? I was reading your posts about your northstar heater. The heat sounds amazing!

I have my 2 LG #3 heaters 1 from the late 1980's and the other from early 1990's. I also have a LG #2 dollied i got for $100 and only needed to buy a new thermostat because someone broke the stud for it. I use it for portable work. Other than replacing the thermocoupler, and cleaning the jets, they've been pretty maintenance free for me.

I want the constant 230-240 heat. I just don't know about the diesel soot. I also don't know where to buy kerosine at. I've been on the fence for awhile now. So plugging in the cord (110v) starts the burner? Propane is pretty simple to me, but that's only what I know.

 

[Goomer]

..............

 

[Goomer]

So plugging in the cord (110v) starts the burner?

When plugged in, the unit is "live", but the burner/igniter only fires intermittently, on command, as needed.There is a thermocouple on the output side, which connects to the thermostat dial. If this thermocouple reads output temps below your desired thermostat setting, it will allow the burner to fire ONLY when the flow switch ALSO gives a the burner a green light to fire. It should never fire unless a tool is actively being triggered thus closing the flow switch circuit.

You can download the complete manual and parts list here.............http://www.northerntool.com/images/downloads/manuals/157495.pdf

 

[Duane Oxley]

whats funny is....

a flow switch is a flow switch is a flow switch....

its a little fooking magnet that moves when water pushes it....then it goes across the metal reeds to make contact, thus sending a signal it has water......

Not exactly, but correct for most of them.

There are also paddle style flow switches and vacuum- operated ones. Back in 1996 to 2001, we built systems with the vacuum operated ones and they were ultra- reliable. Then people wanted to have large water tanks, which, when nearing empty, would actually create a vacuum due to the weight of the water in the hose being pulled back down by gravity, which caused the heaters to fire when the tanks were near- empty, so we changed to the reed switch type that most people are familiar with today.

The reed switch type do have their quirks, especially if they're the "universal mount" ones that are spring- loaded so that they can be mounted in any position.

 

[hogjowl]

Dang ... So Duane really ISN'T dead!

 

[Captain America]

Jimbo. Do you have a kleanline burner....and do you know the prices....

I have always had northstar but these burners have a lot less weight....

 

[Captain America]

I have had 3 northern tool kero Heaters....1500$. Each

Positives.....
1...,plenty of heat......hotter than propane...look at buts
2....never broke down....runs forever
3. Safer than propane...my opinion.....
4...,very little odor....if u use kero...this is a must in my book
5...easy to service...northern tools in almost every state
Negatives
1...must change the float valve.....
2... A little heavy.....300lbs
3...must find kero.....not deisel....
4...also the coils will spit out rust from time to time....
Hafta keep the wand filters cleaned daily...and not run too much acid rinse thru the burner or rust will happen...

Stembrite has these and can help you....

 

[Lee Stockwell]

A coil rated for 10,000 psi is still subject to rupture from freezing.

 

[tmdry]

What's the flow switch model again? link please?