45 vs 47 blower

[juniorc82]

I recently ditched a smaller truckmount and got into a hx 47 blower machine. I love the machine. Cleans well and a huge difference coming from a 33 blower. I recently visited a friend who runs an eldiablo with a 45 blower and it seemed that my 47 pulled noticeably harder. Ok heres my dilemma: I have another van with a 33 machine I have used as an apartment truck for the chimps to rock and as a back up truck . This coming summer I will have to run 2 trucks full time no matter what. After seeing how much cleaner and drier the 47 leaves the floor I want to up grade the other truck. My hopes are that the bigger machine will bridge the gap in skill and allow the chimps to put out quality work and get decent dry times. I know I cant hold the help, accountable for quality work in a 33 blower machine. What I am wondering is the difference in cleaning between a 25 horse hx system with a 45 and my current 34 horse with the 47. I would like to save a few bucks and get the 45 if I can, however if it will be a noticeable difference in quality, dry times, or will drasticly reduce the hose runs I will pay extra for the 47 machine. I do feel like the 25 horse machine is an easier engine for the chimp to operate as the big block motors do get very hot very fast and can be down right dangerous if your head isn't in the game, plus they get tempermental when they get hot in the summer time I have noticed. So whats the pros and cons of this can I get away with the 45 and still be sending them out with a good machine that will produce good results? Sorry Cobb I must respectfully ask you to sit this one out since you claim a 45 or 4mr or whatever you call it to be a dual wand capable blower

 

[Shawn Forsythe]

You know the old saying...... All things being equal, ........

In this case, all other things being equal, the 47 will out-perform the 45. However, rarely are all things equal.

The potential of the 47 is dependent on plumbing, restrictions (blower HX), vac relief valve design, effective wand opening on carpet, hose dimensions and a few other factors.

I've seen 45's do a better job, than an ill conceived 47 design. As well, if your wand and hose setup on a single wand do not permit the additional airflow potential of the 47 at a given relief setting, the 47 is a waste.....unless, and this is a big "if", the 47 unit is providing better continual heat output (with the larger engine and BTU output) for cleaning efficiency.

Test your candidates against each other.

 

[dealtimeman]

The two inches of lobe length in the 47 is what you are feeling doing a better job performance wise. Almost always a bigger blower is better. You will consume a bit more fuel with the 47 compared to a 45 but the difference is maybe .1 to .2 gal per hour I would guess. I always prefer to have more power than I think I would need, so if a circumstance comes up where I might need the power I already have it at my disposal.

Also you must consider that it requires a little hp to spin the 47 and will requires more than likely a larger motor than that to spin a 45. Let me say again there is quite a difference between a 45 and 47 when they are plumbed right and in a machine that has proper design and implementation. That is 2 extra inches on both 4 inch lobes.

 

[Russ T.]

If it's for your guys to bang out apts fast and well, why not a PTO setup with a 47 blower? Push 2 buttons and away they go...


The Clean Machine

 

[GCCLee]

Find a SteamGenie PTO : )

 

[Jimmy L]

Get the simplest 45 blowered TM you can get for the apartment work.
Stay away from those that use couplers for the connect between blower and engine.

Look into one of the "Boutique" builders for that apartment machine.
So simple a CHIMP can fix it.

Also get a nice 14 inch wand with a 2 inch tube for the chimps.

 

[juniorc82]

If it's for your guys to bang out apts fast and well, why not a PTO setup with a 47 blower? Push 2 buttons and away they go...


The Clean Machine

That would be ideal russ, however I don't have the scratch for a new van with low miles and I already have worked out a deal with the manufacturer for trading in the 33 machine. I appreciate you guys trying to help but maybe I should ask you guys for the short version..... is a 47 really that much better than a 45?

 

[Shane T]

My 47 heat exchanger unit wasn't that much better than my 45 propane fired unit. Once I got rid of the blower heat exchanger and the other bad restrictions in the system the 47 has considerably better vac now. I did sacrifice some heat capability but well worth it IMO. Its still hot enough in the summer for 90% of my work, the rest of the time I post heat with the LG.

 

[Jim Martin]

That would be ideal russ, however I don't have the scratch for a new van with low miles and I already have worked out a deal with the manufacturer for trading in the 33 machine. I appreciate you guys trying to help but maybe I should ask you guys for the short version..... is a 47 really that much better than a 45?

short version.....depends on what is powering it..........and shorter version....not enough to make that huge of a difference..........

 

[Zee]

Get the simplest 45 blowered TM you can get for the apartment work.
Stay away from those that use couplers for the connect between blower and engine.

Look into one of the "Boutique" builders for that apartment machine.
So simple a CHIMP can fix it.

Also get a nice 14 inch wand with a 2 inch tube for the chimps.

What's wrong with the coupler? If the engine and the blower lined up well, there should be no problems with it.

I have -combined- ran 2 el diablos around 4000hours, with zero problems on the couplers.

You have to change belts a lot more often.


Btw what Shawn said is correct. I have seen 47s do worse than the el diablos with their 45s.

 

[GCCLee]

When we showed up w a 47 in our area, other cleaners really started to take notice. Long established apt communities had never seen cleaning like we do. Even from the V guy!!!
I quote
"Chris, I'm not sure they were even cleaning when they were in there, and our Maint team can now get in an finish up the same day you clean"

Does it make me the fastest cleaner? No
But a 300 hp driven 4.7 Roots Blower sure helps matters : )

 

[GCCLee]

Btw what Shawn said is correct. I have seen 47s do worse than the el diablos with their 45s.

Of course Shawn knows what he's talking about.
Why he's not still doing it i have no idea, but His brainchild rides in the back of my Rig!

 

[bob vawter]

did you guys know that Roots 45's and 47's are interchangeable
simply by turning the mounting legs around........

 

[Lee Stockwell]

did you guys know that Roots 45's and 47's are interchangeable
simply by turning the mounting legs around........

Although the drive end is identical, same belts and pulleys, the PLUMBING is larger on the 47. The 47 is several inches longer as well, front to back from the pulley side.

 

[GCCLee]

did you guys know that Roots 45's and 47's are interchangeable
simply by turning the mounting legs around........

Theres enough room for X2 of everything in there really : )

 

[bob vawter]

Although the drive end is identical, same belts and pulleys, the PLUMBING is larger on the 47. The 47 is several inches longer as well, front to back from the pulley side.

yep...if yor pump is blower mounted ...lik the Genie
you have to build another bracket as well......
thanks Lee....it's early here...going back ta sleep till The Price is Right is on...........

 

[renegade_cowboy]

I have a used 47 blower for sale if anyone is interested..

 

[GCCLee]

I have a used 47 blower for sale if anyone is interested..

Put it on the board classifieds, this place draws alot of attention : )

 

[Jimmy L]

Couplers.......just SUCK

Okay Zee from where ever.

 

[Larry Cobb]

Jon;

I can't stand it . . . .

We are the only company to have done the side-by-side blower testing .

Both the #47 and the #45 blower have the same power input level,

because they have the same 4" diameter gears.

Since the #47 has longer lobes,

it must operate @ lower vacuum lift levels.

Normally the #45 can operate 2-3" hg. higher lift.

We tested 4 TM systems with all the most common blowers at the Carpet Cleaner's BBQ last summer.

All were tested with the same 100 ft vac hose and single 14" wand.

Here are the results graphed:

View attachment 3306

The #45 provided the best performance on the carpet, measured at the wand (173 vs 155 for the #47 blower).

We normalized the #33 @ 100, so the #45 had 73% more performance on the carpet.

All blowers were set @ the maximum lift recommended by the manufacturer.

Larry

 

[Mikey P]

a bunch of drunks sitting around capping off hoses with dixie cups fitted with cocktail umbrellas does not constitute real world "testing" Mr Cobb.

 

[Lee Stockwell]

Good grief. Give it up Larry. There is no reason you "must" set the 45 vac relief higher than a 47, unless you plan a test to make the 45 look like a better choice.

You noted that you SET the levels. Then, surprise!, your 4 digit vac gage showed that level. ..

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk 2

 

[GCCLee]

Oh ........this should get real good.....

 

[Larry Cobb]

Lee;

With your college background, you of all people,

should understand that both the #47 and the #45 have the same 4" gear set & power capability.

This means with higher airflow of the #47 . . .

the #45 will always deliver several inches more lift.

Even if you set both of them above the recommended vac levels.

Larry

 

[Lee Stockwell]

Gear diameter has nothing to do with power differences.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk 2

 

[Lee Stockwell]

Power comes from an engine. The blower receives it via the shaft. The gears merely distribute part of it to the driven lobe and maintain timing.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk 2

 

[GCCLee]

What larry is trying to explain is something like,

dynamite comes in small packages ?

 

[Jimmy L]

And just what is a "Zee"?

Is it some sort of retarded BEE?

Perhaps some sort of mispronounced interpetation by a hair lip?

Or is it a name maybe from those peoples in Iran?

And just what does it mean?

A shortened word for ZEBRA?

Or is it really another foreign word for...........male prostitute?

 

[juniorc82]

my gosh is a 47 powered by a 34 horse engine gonna be a betterchoice over a 25 hp engine pushing a 45 for an employee. Give me the short version guys please!!!!

 

[Larry Cobb]

a bunch of drunks sitting around capping off hoses with dixie cups fitted with cocktail umbrellas does not constitute real world "testing" Mr Cobb.

Show me any side-by-side testing done by any TM manufacturer . . .

comparing #33, #36, #45 & #47 blowers.

We were not drunk . . .

yet (we did the testing 1st).

Larry