A word on beating odors...

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There are a number of means we might employ to counter an offensive odor. The very best way is complete source removal. If you can completely remove the source of an odor from an environment, then simply aerating the vicinity is all that is necessary to alleviate any trace of perceptible odor, permanently. However, this is not always practical, or even doable. Porous materials, or location can make complete source removal impossible (as is the case most of the time you are performing a deodorization). Hence, all we can do is remove what is practical, and treat the remainder. How we treat the remainder determines both the short-term and the long-term success.


It can’t be stressed too strongly that every effort to clean or remove as much of the source as possible, is the very first step that must be taken. No deodorizer, short of complete incineration, will work to permanently remedy an offensive odor situation without a thorough cleaning. As well, special steps may be required for certain causes of odors a carpet cleaning technician encounters. Urine is a good example. Fresh urine rinses out with routine cleaning rather easy. However, let it dry and age, and it undergoes changes that both make it harder to simply rinse to remove enough source to be effectively deodorized. Urine then requires tailored acidic cleaning compounds to make soluble the urine salts for rinsing. If you leave these salts behind, your subsequent deodorization may only be temporary.

Any deodorization compound subsequently employed must reach every bit of the remaining trace substances emanating odor. This might mean saturation, fogging, or liberal spray, depending on the use instructions. But all are the same. Unless the deodorizer physically reaches its target, it simply doesn’t work.

By far the oldest method of treating an offensive odor is masking. By using a pleasing fragrance, we may try to overpower, or "mask" the offensive odor. By using a strong, volatile oil fragrance, the masking can be made to linger, hopefully long enough, for the trace source material to either "dry up" or decay to imperceptible levels. The downside to complete reliance on masking, is that you have not done anything to alleviate the actual presence of the offending trace source after cleaning, and the occupants are forced to breath a concentrated new odor. Your fragrance mask at first may be pleasing, but soon wears thin on anyone’s tolerance. So, you look for a better way.

Where odors emanating from the activity of residual bacterial respiration are present, some deodorization compounds that rely on masking utilize an additive to literally “kill” the residual source. The use of an antimicrobial compound is combined with the masking agent. The antimicrobial kills the bacteria generating the odor, while the masking agent “covers” the already generated residual scent until it is dissipated. The downside to this methodology is the use of broad spectrum antimicrobial compounds, which can have adverse health effects on occupants and technicians. As well, these antimicrobials only work on bacteria generated odors, at best, relying solely on the mask agent for anything else. Manufacturers of these products also must be careful that no actual claims of bactericidal activity crosses the threshold of needing EPA registration. For this reason, users don’t often know that they may be even using what might be a rather harsh disinfectant, at all.

Ideally, a good deodorizer would attack offensive odor molecules, while minimizing any problems with long lingering scents, nor present potentially adverse health consequences. To this end, true deodorizers are made to target odorous molecules, and little else. These compounds ordinarily fall into a few categories we are used to hearing;

· Neutralizers
· Pairing Agents
· Encapsulants

However, that is not to say that any deodorizer you may use is even labeled correctly. A Pairing Agent might be labeled or called an odor neutralizer by the company who makes it. It’s not unknown to see even cheap odor masks called “neutralizers”.

Neutralizers, to the odor chemist, are chemical compounds, which react with other compounds (odor molecules) to decay, to degrade or change the former odor molecule to a non-odorous one or more. Ozone and Hydroxyl neutralization is a couple of examples. These, in addition to peroxide type chemistry, work by oxidation, or “chemical burning” of the odorous materials. But Neutralizers also work as more complex formulations that target and react with certain classes of chemical compounds known to create odors humans find offensive. Enzymes are such a form of odor neutralizer, as they serve to chemically bio-degrade generally only biologic odorous compounds to simpler non-odorous substances. On the other hand, the oxidation neutralizers are rather non-specific, and can represent safety hazards during application. Ozone itself can also negatively affect certain materials such as plastics and leather.

Most, but not all, offensive odor molecules produced by natural processes are odorous because their molecules exhibit a structure with what are called “characteristic functional groups”. Our nasal receptors respond to these functional groups and give us the sense of smell, experiencing their existence. Humans seem to regard certain types of these groups as universally offensive. Amongst these are compounds called mercaptans, sulfides, amines and certain aldehydes. With a formulation of specialized chemical compounds that combine with these target molecules, a deodorizer serves to change them and remove the ability to have usable functional groups to bind with our nasal receptors.

A Pairing Agent is a specific chemical compound with an affinity to molecules with a functioning group from one of the classes, such as mercaptans, sulfides, amines and certain aldehydes. In “pairing” with these odorous molecules, they render them inert to our sense of smell, and hence are no longer detectable.

Another type, an Encapsulant is broad descriptive term for a deodorizer. These should not be confused with encapsulant cleaners, as they are unrelated, except in name. This type of deodorizer may be said to work either macroscopically, or microscopically. If of the “macroscopic” variety, the encapsulant type deodorizer seals a porous material, to prevent the escape of odorous substances to the breathable airspace. A microscopic Encapsulant actually interacts directly to “envelope” odorous molecules, trapping them and rendering them incapable of using their functional groups to generate a scent response. The microscopic encapsulants generally, but not always, purposefully exhibit functional group affinity (reactivity) to certain molecules.

As Pairing Agents and Encapsulants seem to garner the greatest attention to research and development in our industry, there is a wide variety of product offerings with a range of applicable odor types. The product label may only list examples. It helps to know what functional group type these examples represent, so that other applications may be presumed. Here is where you ask the supplier what he might know about the product, so you can know both the limitations of and other non-label cases you may find for the deodorizer.

Whether the deodorizer be a Neutralizer, a Pairing Agent, or an Encapsulant, pleasing fragrances may be added, but not usually to serve as a mask., so to speak. The reason such a deodorizer may contain a quick dissipating fragrance is strictly for marketing. It is well known that buyers and users of deodorization compounds often prefer a pleasing fragrance for the product itself, or in use, to offer some tangible evidence of benefit apart from eliminating odor.

Because all these types of deodorizers have associated strengths and weaknesses, it’s helpful to know to what the source odor will respond with the least undesirable effects or cost. One should ask a lot of questions of their supplier to understand what product may be best chosen for which type of odor situation. Fortunately there are some rather broad-spectrum Pairing Agents and Encapsulant deodorizers to work for general purposes, but it should be noted that some Neutralizers have no equal for efficacy in other specific situations. Knowing more about your deodorizers means you buy and carry all you need to work, and don’t buy what might not work, or duplicates what you already have.
 

bob vawter

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great info......now can you tell us which catagory the Genie Care product "Good Stuff" would fall using the guidelines you've stated above...being a solvent based product....
AND how you feel it compares to the products they're selling now......1-10?
 
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Goodstuff was/is an Encapsulant type deodorizer. The product uses a chemical compound specific to the functional group odors, as mentioned above. This compound itself has no odor (but Goodstuff does), and Goodstuff would be just as effective without the added fragrance. The product uses a traditional oil-based fragrance (cherry, here), along with isopropyl alcohol to help make the fragrance itself soluble in the water-based encapsulant base. The reason behind using the IPA is to lessen, what might be a resoiling problem, if a surfactant were to have been used.

Disclaimer: This information is a few years old, and may, or may not apply to any possible recent reformulation. For the record, I don't sell or endorse the product. As side note, I personally detest the fragrance used. The sweet cherry fragrance is rather disgusting to my tender nose, IMHO. LOL

Taking my disclaimer into account, I'll refrain from rating it.
 
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bob vawter

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all the little old black ladies jus LOVED that stuff..errrrrGood Stuff!
when i arrived on a job....usually the first two questions were:

Mr Bob.....you brought PAPER and that good smellin' stuff ....right?

funny....everyone thought it smellt lik bubblegum.....
 
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Jimmy L

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Ah GOODSTUFF I bought a gallon many years ago to try.
Nothing like using something that smells like a URINAL CAKE at a strip club.

Got rid of that fast.
 

bob vawter

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smells like a URINAL CAKE at a strip club.
Jimmy
if i were you...
i'd be careful bendin' over the urinal at a strip club....


jus sayin'
 
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Desk Jockey

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all the little old black ladies jus LOVED that stuff..errrrrGood Stuff!
when i arrived on a job....usually the first two questions were:

Mr Bob.....you brought PAPER and that good smellin' stuff ....right?

funny....everyone thought it smellt lik bubblegum.....
It smelled like strong bubble gum
 

Jim Pemberton

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Shawn's best advice is what he repeats as the most important part of odor removal:

Source removal.

When I was first working in our supply business answering the phones and shipping orders in the late 70's (and glad to be out of the cleaning company...that's another story for another time) I got a call from a guy in Arkansas having trouble removing skunk smell from a pick up truck. Some enemy of the truck owner had put a dead skunk behind the seats.

I suggested our best stuff, we shipped it, he tried it and called back complaining it didn't work. We had just started working with Cliff Zlotnik (founder of Unsmoke) and he would often make special formulas for individual problems, so we had him make some magic potion for us, shipped it out, the guy sprayed the inside of the truck, and still the odor remained!

I asked my father about the issue, explained all that was tried and he asked me if the skunk was still in the truck.

I laughed and said I was sure he took the skunk out. Lee gave me "the look" that father's give sons who question them on anything.

I wilted under his glare, called the guy in Arkansas, and half laughing asked him what he did with the skunk.

I'm sure you guessed the answer by now:

"The skunk is still in the truck! I am not touching that filthy thing! The guy who owns the darn truck can pull it out after I get the odor out!"

I will never forget that as long as I live.
 
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When Goodstuff's fragrance was chosen, I think a focus group similar to Bawb's customer base was the deciding entity.

I always thought that a more culturally diverse panel should have been chartered to decide whether maraschino candy cherry is a universally acceptable, ahem, stench that people want to breathe for several days after being previously exposed to cat urine. Then again, maybe it was the alcohol that pushed it over the top. LOL
 
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ruff

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Shawn,
Thank you for the information and great explanation.

We know that at times the use of a certain deodorizer (the correct one for the specific problem and yes the source was removed if practical) would still not accomplish the hoped for results.

Would the use of two different deodorizers that work on different principle, possibly enhance the results or will they work against each other?
 
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Jimmy L

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Deodorizing racial diverse homes or the stench of a strip club bathroom.................what's the differernce?
 

Desk Jockey

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Deodorizing racial diverse homes or the stench of a strip club bathroom.................what's the differernce?
smiley-shocked012.gif


James my house does not stink. But there again, when I need to use the shitter, I go outside. Oh no I don't want to but my wife makes me. :evil:

I guess the double wide wasn't big enough, should have bought a triple with a second shitter near the back. Oh well, it's fine cept in the winter,when my fat ass sticks to the cold frozen seat. :neutral:




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Last edited by a moderator:
Joined
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Shawn Forsythe
Shawn,
Would the use of two different deodorizers that work on different principle, possibly enhance the results or will they work against each other?

Not usually a problem, but I would still ask the manufacturer or supplier of each product before doing so. Some encapsulants are compounded with specific compatible fragrances, wherein the fragrance from the other mixed product might create issues. As well, oxidizer and enzyme products used with other deodorizers might also be of concern.


may I ask what your analysis of this agent is please?
https://www.scotstuffdirect.com/shop/cleanscent-deodorizer/

Based on the marketing information, it would appear at first glance to be a pairing agent. But this is a question best asked of Scots. A comprehensive answer would also better indicate the isolated group of odors the product would best target.
 

GeeeAus

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Grant Baverstock
Not usually a problem, but I would still ask the manufacturer or supplier of each product before doing so. Some encapsulants are compounded with specific compatible fragrances, wherein the fragrance from the other mixed product might create issues. As well, oxidizer and enzyme products used with other deodorizers might also be of concern.




Based on the marketing information, it would appear at first glance to be a pairing agent. But this is a question best asked of Scots. A comprehensive answer would also better indicate the isolated group of odors the product would best target.

Thanks Shawn, I have good success mixing it with their liquid peroxide booster product OxyShot! Obviously this is an oxidiser and burns away the source of contamination. I mix them in hot solution and deep irrigate if carpet or hot spray on hard surface. It has proved an effective combo on most household decay based odour sources.

Thanks.

Grant
 

bob vawter

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bob vawter
When Goodstuff's fragrance was chosen, I think a focus group similar to Bawb's customer base was the deciding entity.

sooooooo.an admission on yor part that a specific culture MAY
have a PROPENSITY to agree on certain issues....

is that what yor sayin'?

OHH MY!
 
Last edited:

Desk Jockey

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You love that word! <!--[if gte mso 9]><xml> <o:OfficeDocumentSettings> <o:RelyOnVML/> <o:AllowPNG/> </o:OfficeDocumentSettings> </xml><![endif]-->
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QFormat="true" Name="Subtle Reference"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="32" SemiHidden="false" UnhideWhenUsed="false" QFormat="true" Name="Intense Reference"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="33" SemiHidden="false" UnhideWhenUsed="false" QFormat="true" Name="Book Title"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="37" Name="Bibliography"/> <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="39" QFormat="true" Name="TOC Heading"/> </w:LatentStyles> </xml><![endif]--><!--[if gte mso 10]> <style> /* Style Definitions */ table.MsoNormalTable {mso-style-name:"Table Normal"; mso-tstyle-rowband-size:0; mso-tstyle-colband-size:0; mso-style-noshow:yes; mso-style-priority:99; mso-style-parent:""; mso-padding-alt:0in 5.4pt 0in 5.4pt; mso-para-margin-top:0in; mso-para-margin-right:0in; mso-para-margin-bottom:10.0pt; mso-para-margin-left:0in; line-height:115%; mso-pagination:widow-orphan; font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"; mso-ascii-font-family:Calibri; mso-ascii-theme-font:minor-latin; mso-hansi-font-family:Calibri; mso-hansi-theme-font:minor-latin; mso-bidi-font-family:"Times New Roman"; mso-bidi-theme-font:minor-bidi;} </style> <![endif]-->
 

Jimmy L

Member
Joined
Oct 7, 2006
Messages
15,218
Location
Ne
Name
Jimmy L
As Chris Connor wood sez................it smells like ###### lives up in here!
 

GCCLee

Supportive Member
Joined
Jan 29, 2012
Messages
5,113
Location
East TN
Name
C. Lee
Tag for participation


Sent from da parking garage of dee detention center
 

ruff

Member
Joined
Apr 19, 2007
Messages
11,010
Location
San Francisco, CA
Name
Ofer Kolton
Not a single one of you guys read all that.

Stop acting like you're interested.

Nobody thinks your smart.

Could somebody please press the Ban button. Like you did last summer.
Marty is just trying to keep us bare feet and all.
 

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