BS, Dane Gregory sucked.

[Mikey P]

How did you learn to clean T & G
Posted By Little Aggie on 4/13/2009 at 9:14 PM

By just doing it your self (trial & air.) - Going to t&g cleaning class. - Go out with someone for 2 or 3 days and learn the cleaning process.


Re: How did you learn to clean T & G
Posted By Jon Firari on 4/13/2009 at 9:39 PM

Of all the cleaning processes, this requires least amount education. Pretty much put down the correct prespray for the correct application, agitate and extract. I may have over simplified the process, but the learning curve is much quicker then something like upholstery.

Pre-inspection is very important, finding damaged grout, cracked tiles, natural stone vs ceramic, and the subfloor, making sure the tile is stable...concrete backer-board on wood subfloors. I plan to attend the hard surface cleaning class at Interlink this month......Dane Gregory is a great instructor.
Modified By Jon Firari on 4/13/2009 at 9:46 PM

Re: How did you learn to clean T & G
Posted By Con Schultz on 4/13/2009 at 9:48 PM

I went to the class & was disgusted as that is the reason I went - but cleaning T&G was discussed for a whopping 30 mins... but I know a whole lot about diamond grinding...

Con


Re: How did you learn to clean T & G
Posted By Dominick Cassano on 4/13/2009 at 9:51 PM

Dane Gregory is a great instructor for stone tile and masonry. My son and I both got our SMT certification from his class. It was a great 2 day father and son bonding. We ate fast food, drank coffee until 3 am to stay awake and finish the book, and enjoyed the ride there and back blasting classic rock on the radio. Awesome!
Modified By Dominick Cassano on 4/13/2009 at 9:54 PM

Re: How did you learn to clean T & G
Posted By Jon Firari on 4/13/2009 at 9:52 PM

Con,

You did not see any value in the class? I dont plan to specialize in natural stone or using glazing compounds. Jon


Re: How did you learn to clean T & G
Posted By Peter on 4/13/2009 at 10:00 PM

I also attended Dane's class (Pensacola) "SMT", and thought it was very good. But started by going out with others to jobs...then class built more confidence with more technical knowledge.


Re: How did you learn to clean T & G
Posted By Jon Firari on 4/13/2009 at 10:05 PM

Hmmmmm classic rock, and stone cleaning class
Modified By Jon Firari on 4/13/2009 at 10:05 PM

Re: How did you learn to clean T & G
Posted By Dominick Cassano on 4/13/2009 at 10:08 PM

If you can identify ceramic from natural stone by eye, you're pretty safe. Just don't use acid on natural stone and you'll do fine.


Re: How did you learn to clean T & G
Posted By Jim Williams on 4/13/2009 at 10:40 PM

I ordered the $99 DVD from magic wand.It is a class taught by Taf Baig that was recorded.It teaches you enough to keep you out of trouble.


Re: How did you learn to clean T & G
Posted By Jacked up pt on 4/13/2009 at 10:43 PM

In the Army with a toothbrush .


Re: How did you learn to clean T & G
Posted By rick on 4/13/2009 at 10:55 PM

Most of the time in residential it is pretty easy but you need to learn how to test for foreign substances on the grout. Also what was said in an earlier post about identifying stone vs tile and problem areas.
I learned by studing via the Internet and working with someone.

Dane went on for two days about geology and for about 20 minutes about actual Turbo style cleaning.


I could and would kick his ass in teaching a real world carpet cleaners introduction to TnG

 

[Louis]

I took his class. I learned where stone comes from. A lot about slip and fall stuff. A few hours before test we learned the basics on cleaning. Nothing about color seal, or when the grout still looks like crap after an acid cleaning. Nothing about when the maid uses mop & glow for months and it won't come clean. I learned all of that the hard way. Lost a lot of $$$ learning about mop & glow. Wished they would have covered that in class.

 

[Mikey P]

exactly.

 

[Jim Pemberton]

Mike and Louis (and others)

List the points you'd like to see covered in a T & G class. Forget certification issues, just give me the practical "must know" and "nice to know" stuff that you wish you had learned.

It would help me with a few projects that I'm working on.

 

[floorguy]

my problem with these YAHOO teachers, is

they think or rather someone thinks they know all this and that...

when in all reality they havent been "in" the biz for so long, they arent up to the new and cool stuff..

itd be fun to ask these midgets about 2.5, high flow, ridiculas heat. etc.

Ran across umm who is it??? has a beard, does the teach everything he can make money at classes. Want to say his name is Bill but cant think of his last.. it was like 5 yrs ago, asked him about an article i read in one of the mags.. Where he goes on to tell them to put stripper in the auto scrubber tank :shock: :shock: as a way to apply stripper and strip the floor... I was liek WTF are you telling these people... He was like well, uh, and gave me some BS reasoning...

Stupid people

 

[Louis]

The stone info was nice but took too long and lost everyone. A basic cheat sheet of what stone is related to what would be nice. A breif overview of diamond polishing and where to go if you would like to take this on but enough info to know when to walk away or refer to someone else.

How to clean real world tile & grout. Wax in grout, crapy grout that falls out. When to color seal.
And stop senidng these guys out thinking they can charge $2.00 a sf from day one.

 

[CapeCleaner]

I took Dane's class and didn't enjoy it at all. That said, he's teaching a certification course so you're going to get what's on the exam. (I did pass!) I honestly think the IICRC should do away with that particular certification.

For Jim Pemberton:

• Do not try to combine tile and grout cleaning and restoration with natural stone care and restoration
  Provide a step-by-step process for cleaning tile and grout
  Spend time on color sealing
  Address strange coatings on grout and how to remove them
  Minor regrouting
  Shower rehabs
  Working with Satillo
  Residential vs. Commercial - pricing is in different worlds

When to color seal.

Every chance you get!

 

[hogjowl]

What the heck DO you do about mop and glow residue?

 

[Shawn Forsythe]

SMT, like the LCT (Leather) is a foundational class. For the most part, you are learning identification and the basis for the maintenance processes.

The in-depth teaching of methods varies so much depending on the manufacturer of the equipment and chemical, that you really need to attend product specific seminars and classes, after you have the foundational information. I don't know anyone who has taken an SMT who says they learned all they need to know, unless they already had the product specific training before they went.

We hold an SMT in our locations once per year, but find that we have to have product specific training almost every month to reach the people who want it.


If the instructors were to teach in-depth product specific cleaning methods in an SMT, the class would be a couple of weeks, if you were to be fair, even then you would still leave out something for someone to say that you were not even handed.

 

[Aaron Richards]

It's not just Dane's SMT class that sucks, Bill Griffins class was about the same. No real world help at all, just blah blah blah diamonds blah blah blah honing powders blah blah blah. Almost zero mention of actual grout cleaning or sealing. I was pretty disapointed. That being said, Doug H. does a good CCT class, a little heavy on the "buy my marketing stuff and secret formulas" speil, but overall I was happy. And Barry Costa's WRT was excellent.

 

[alazo1]

Dana's class was very informational as far as the background on stone but not for real world. But hey, you're a certified tile and stone expert after. It's funny how many times I've heard how great the class was. I was afraid to say something, glad someone did.

Albert

 

[Guest]

What the heck DO you do about mop and glow residue?

Stripper

 

[hogjowl]

Thanks.

I was beginning to think nobody had any idea.

 

[Mikey P]

Jim

Yoakums pretty much nailed it.


And dont drop a phone book thick study guide in my lap on Thursday AM and expect me to have it all read and memorized by Friday afternoon.


AND 25% of the questions on the test he didn't cover in the class.


Granted this was when he just started

 

[clean image]

There's book smart and there's street smart

when i took SMT from Bill G. and Ed H. 4-5 years ago?, Bill was book smart, Ed was steet smart


I still remember their story as they walked into a casino in Las Vegas and peered down at the cystallized polished Marble floors


Bill G. says, these floors look awesome

Ed H. says, these floors look terrible


carl

 

[Doug D]

I too took Dane Gregory's class. Was not happy at all with the class. :roll:

 

[Joel D]

I took it, learned a few things. I was new and had never done a job. Minor grout repair, looking out for trouble spots should be part of it.

I remember him going on about how he would seal granite counter tops in a lab coat and tie and how he would "listen" to the granite so mrs. P would think he was strange and artistic so he could charge a fortune.(i kept thinking is this guy for real?)some got annoyed with the stories.

Definately went on about money too much.

 

[Fon Johnson]

Jim, you just need to add a day of vct, with me teaching of course..

Mop and Glo: If there is much on the floor, Marty already knows how to remove old floor covering and install new. That's all you need to know..

 

[TimP]

I thought the class was good.

I think it's the IICRC that is the problem.

There needs to be classes that focus on "hands on" and "real world" cleaning. And not all this BS to make a test to get a certification.


Carpet cleaning should start from the proper steps of cleaning and actually do them. Then be able to identify and spot clean and then actual stain removal. Provide as much real world problems that can occur and how to over come them.


Tile cleaning should be actual hands on too. Like stated in the above posts I agree 100%.

The problem is there aren't enough facilities with the resources to teach a proper hands on class. But it's what needs to be done.

 

[Gary T]

CapeCleaner wrote:

Do not try to combine tile and grout cleaning and restoration with natural stone care and restoration
Provide a step-by-step process for cleaning tile and grout
Spend time on color sealing
Address strange coatings on grout and how to remove them
Minor regrouting
Shower rehabs
Working with Satillo
Residential vs. Commercial - pricing is in different worlds

Very good points. Shower rehabs and saltillo would have to be their own classes.

What I would include in a class for a 3 day T&G class.

Classroom would include (and important to set yourself apart from the other guys)

Brief history of tile
Tile manufacture processes
Tile ID and their uses(this can be important when IDing failures)
Diff between tile & stone and procedures to ID.(don't want to f'up someones stone now do we, and that would be it for stone in this class)
Proper install procedures and why(this can be quite valuable when performing your inspection to point out failure causes)
Proper procedures for minor repairs.

Grout:
History
Manufacture process
The importance and function of grout(to dispel the many rumors, mainly in marketing of cleaning processes, spread about its purpose and function)
Types of grout and their uses.(sanded, non-sanded, epoxy, urethane, etc)
Procedures to ID different grouts.
Grout failure and failure ID(this is sometimes a guessing game but at least they would be educated guesses)
Proper grout repair procedures.


Some of you are thinking "why do I need to know all that crap just to clean T&G?". Because it gives you the knowledge of "why and how" that the others have no clue. Why the grout or tile is cracking there, how to fix it, and will it continue to happen. Why the shower is leaking, and why it needs to be replaced and can't just be repaired. Why the tiles outside keep cracking in the winter. If you can answer these questions, you are light years ahead of the other guys, and your customers will know it. Also it only adds 10-20 mins to an evaluation maybe.

I've got to go finish installing a shower, but will continue my T&G class outline later if Mikey will let me edit it.

 

[TimP]

Most of those problems above are installation problems, or foundation/subfloor problems most of the time at least. Showers leaking are usually due to shower pan failure or installed wrong. I've actually seen many shower failures due to tile being installed directly on sheetrock.....

Most grout/tile you fix is due to cracking are most likely going to crack again as soon as the subfloor expands or contracts (which can be fixed in most cases with crack suppressant). Crack suppressant doesn't take care of verticle shifts only horizontle shifts in the subfloor and to varying extents due to the product being used and of course it has to be installed correctly. Tile cracking can also be due to not having enough thinset to support the tile, which usually woud corespond with hollow sounding tile. That's the difference between seeing one tile crack and a whole long line of cracks (subfloor movement/crack problem).


I guess since I knew most of above due to working in a floor covering store for a few years I didn't really miss the need in the class. But those are things that should be tought in the Tile cleaning class.