Help with White Magic Pro 2000 direct drive

[Sammie]

Purchased this machine and it keeps dogging down and stops after being run for 10 minutes or so. I have checked the voltage to the serpentine clutch (like the book says) and it does appear to be low when the machine is turned on but ok with it off. Could this be the culprit or could it be the serpentine clutch??? Any ideas are welcome.

 

[Clean Response]

Doubt it is the clutch if it spins the machine runs the clutch is working fine. I not sure if the white magic uses vacuum to regulate the rpms but I am guessing it does I would check the vac pods if it has them.

We need more info on how old the machine is to really help.

The problem is with that is regulating your rmp older machine it is vacuum line/pods newer it is all computers.

 

[Sammie]

I think it is a 2000. When the truck mount stops the van engine is at 1500 rpm or above until we shut the truck mount down. Then when we try to restart it, the engine rpms increase but the truck mount is sluggish and fails to start. If we wait 15 minutes sometimes it will start right back up and the cycle continues.

 

[Mark Saiger]

Blower gummed up?

Not sure if I am reading everything correctly but blower could need a cleaning

This is for a Butler but if the heat exchanger is not hooked up to the blower and I believe this could be similar to the Butler, this would work.

 

[dgardner]

When the truck mount stops the van engine is at 1500 rpm or above until we shut the truck mount down. Then when we try to restart it, the engine rpms increase but the truck mount is sluggish and fails to start.

So the TM bogs down but the van engine continues to run at normal speed?

Could be the clutch if so.

Or could be a gummed up blower like Mark says - if that's the case and the gummed blower is causing the slippage it soon will be the clutch too.

You definitely want full voltage to the clutch in any case to maximize lockup holding force.

As always, check your vac relief setting to be sure it's not set too high.

 

[Lee Stockwell]

We have one. Haven't had that problem yet.

Talk to Tom at Modernistic in Michigan.

 

[Sammie]

Thank you for the suggestions. So this morning when I check the voltage if I disconnect from the clutch I have a full 12 volts but when I reconnect the clutch the same test shows only 8 volts and the wire as well as the clutch pulley gets very hot when machine is turned on. I cannot find anyplace in my owners manual where it addresses cleaning out the blower with moisture so my question would be can't that hurt the blower system??? The only thing the manual addresses is using WD40 if the machine is not in use for 2+ days. The vacuum filters on top of the tanks appear dirty but I cannot find how to clean them or remove them for cleaning in the manual. Any ideas? Sorry to seem so illiterate about the machine but direct drives are new to me so any help is greatly appreciated! I don't know if I can post a video on here but if I can and it is needed I will video the problem and post. Thanks in advance for any help

 

[FredC]

I'm guessing the clutch needs to be replaced.

Not sure how yours is set up....mine was a mid-90s but flushing the blower might be difficult with the mufflers/silencers (pic below)......unhooking would be a major pita.....and likely not needed anyway

The tanks should have housings on top that hold the filters (where the hose connects).....pop those off and the filters screw into them. Think I used a strap wrench after soaking them in liquid wrench to remove them. Replacements available at jondon


View attachment 8568


View attachment 8569

 

[Sammie]

So can we wash the filters and let them dry? Or do they have to be replaced? We looked at them but my husband was afraid to try to remove them without being sure how to do it so we will try that now. I agree about cleaning the blowers out with everything that would have to be taken apart but if we have to do that we will....thanks for the info and we will try it now. Where do you get your parts?

 

[FredC]

When I initially purchased the unit I couldn't get them off ...so , while not the best solution, I just washed scrubbed them with a nylon brush and rinsed them. Didn't have any issues until I replaced them. Was difficult to get to the top of the filter. Don't puncture them of course.

Other than the heat exchangers most parts are just off the shelf parts. Jondon, Interlink, Kleenrite. Parts you can't get there you may be able to get at Modernistic or through sapphire.


again....this is more likely a clutch/switch/etc issue

 

[dgardner]

when I reconnect the clutch the same test shows only 8 volts and the wire as well as the clutch pulley gets very hot when machine is turned on.

I'm guessing the clutch needs to be replaced.

At the very least sounds like the field coil for the clutch has some shorted turns internally and probably needs to be replaced (don't know if it's available separately).

 

[Sammie]

Thank you so much! Guess we will buy a new clutch and see. Hate to just guess for that much $ but we need it fixed so????

 

[dgardner]

An automotive AC shop may be able to replace just the field coil - wouldn't hurt to ask...

 

[FredC]

and before you do that I would take a look at the switch connections/switch

probably a clutch issue..............but I also had switch issues..........much cheaper repair

 

[dgardner]

Talk to Tom at Modernistic in Michigan.

when I reconnect the clutch the same test shows only 8 volts

Sounds like you have a meter. With the clutch disconnected you could take a resistance (ohms) reading of the coil. Then if you can get a sympathetic supplier (that has one in stock) to take a resistance reading on a new coil it could help you to decide if the coil was bad. Shorted turns will indicate lower resistance.

 

[dgardner]

and before you do that I would take a look at the switch connections/switch

Absolutely. Be sure to check the coil ground connection.

 

[dgardner]

You could also grab a set of jumper wires and go directly from the battery to the coil to bypass all the wiring as a test:

http://www.oreillyauto.com/site/c/detail/OTC0/3902.oap?pt=N0221&ppt=C0371

 

[Lee Stockwell]

Relatively cheap part

 

[Sammie]

I removed the ground connection and cleaned very well then I checked and there is continuity between ground and the clutch housing leaving me thinking it isn't a ground issue. I will try the jumper idea to rule out the switch being the problem. Thanks so much for all the information!

 

[JS41035]

I have a PDF of the pro2000 manual if you need it.

 

[Mark Saiger]

I can't quit smiling about this place.

Some of the best in the industry right here

Sure hope you are able to find this gremlin and get it fixed!

 

[Sammie]

Thanks but we have the original owners manual that came with the machine if that is what you are referring to???

 

[Lee Stockwell]

Pdf files are usually more comprehensive and recent.

 

[dgardner]

We also have a manual here in the MB Library that covers the 1000, 1200, and 2000. It's version 2.0 dated March 2006.

http://www.mikeysboard.com/forum/index.php?library/white-magic-pro-2000-and-pro-1200-manual.1/

 

[FredC]

We also have a manual here in the MB Library that covers the 1000, 1200, and 2000. It's version 2.0 dated March 2006.

http://www.mikeysboard.com/forum/index.php?library/white-magic-pro-2000-and-pro-1200-manual.1/

Thought I had uploaded the old version too...........I'll have to do it tomorrow

I have a super old paper one too but it doesn't have much useful information except for some diagnostics so I haven't scanned it

 

[Scott S.]

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I can't quit smiling about this place.

Some of the best in the industry right here

Sure hope you are able to find this gremlin and get it fixed!

your one of them! always helping people, your helpful videos. keep up the good work Mark!!

 

[Sammie]

UPDATE: We ended up ordering a new clutch and when we pulled the serpentine belt off found that the idler pulley was going out (probably what ruined the clutch). We replaced it and the clutch and are back up and running. Can't thank everyone enough for all the help! If we ever learn this machines in and out it will make life much easier!

 

[Lee Stockwell]

Thank you for letting us know how it turned out!

 

[Dan]

I removed the ground connection and cleaned very well then I checked and there is continuity between ground and the clutch housing leaving me thinking it isn't a ground issue. I will try the jumper idea to rule out the switch being the problem. Thanks so much for all the information!

Sammie,

Glad to hear you got it fixed. I would like to ad that you should change the front and rear belts as well as check the rear idler bearing.

 

[Sammie]

Ok, so now the van has started overheating but only when the truck mount is in use...any ideas???