How are you keeping employees from stealing? Working for cash - not reporting it.

Discussion in 'the CleAn Room' started by jcooper, Dec 23, 2017.

By jcooper on Dec 23, 2017 at 9:02 PM
  1. jcooper
    jcooper

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    Cleaned for some wonderful "gray hairs" a few weeks ago. Super nice people, happy to work for them. Start blabbing away with the fellow and he informs me how he didn't like the last "large(but not the largest)" franchise they had out for the cleaning.

    Guys cleaned the upstairs, like the invoice said. Cleaned the downstairs, deodorized & protected for cash. Custy didn't like this, but still took the deal and I don't blame him.

    As someone hopeful of getting an employee(not family) someday, I found this very disappointing...

    Hard and expensive enough to get the work and these guys are stealing for the boss, his family, the biz, etc.



    Other than after cleaning calls how would an owner/boss even know? What are you doing to stop theft?


    Have a great Christmas, fellas(and ladies)...
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Comments

Discussion in 'the CleAn Room' started by jcooper, Dec 23, 2017.

    1. Jim Pemberton
      Jim Pemberton

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      While I have "the floor"

      Its not just the "guys on the truck" who steal from the company. Watch the "gal (or guy) at the desk". Lot's of people who cash checks and pay bills find ways to skim off some in between.
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    2. Spurlington
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      Yeah .. like the White Magic lady !!
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    3. Jim Pemberton
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      I had forgotten that. It was a very sad story.

      I had in mind some "mom and pop" cleaners where "mom" got tired of working for nothing, or needed to get a "real job" to take care of the family, and so they hired a church member, daughter, neighbor, someone they thought they could trust.

      The way the scam starts is the person they hire rapidly gets "good" at doing all the management and customer relations tasks, and reassures the owners that she can take care of more things for them and they don't have to worry about all the details anymore, they can just relax and leave it to her.

      Its so common that I can almost complete the conversation word for word as it progresses when I'm called by the crushed company owner once they discover the betrayal.

      We live in a complicated world, where people are driven to do things they wouldn't imagine just a few years back by financial pressures they create and can't escape easily.

      Sad stuff, but just be careful with those who you let "handle the books".
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    4. Spurlington
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      Customers who participate in this cash deal 9 times out of 10 wont say anything. Theyre making out as well. What might be a good idea is to add wording to your invoice in highlight that says," Please report any unethical offers made by the tecnician for a full refund on his or her offer.'' With that on the invoice/work order .. no tech in his right mind would make any cash offers.
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    5. Radar Foster
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      I wouldn't want that on an invoice of a service provider

      Would make me suspect they unwittingly hire crooks.
    6. Spurlington
      Spurlington

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      Can go either way .. cash jobs - side jobs are nothing new !! The statement could show that you run a tight ship !! Which could say alot about a company. People gotta know you dont intentially hire crooks but a few will slip through the cracks.

      Ive always wanted to ask them to put cash n jewelery away but afraid they wont hire us thinking were there to steal.
    7. Radar Foster
      Radar Foster

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      I'm not disagreeing with the comment you emphasized with double exclamation points

      Just opposed to involving my clients via financial incentive regarding criminal behavior and raising the concern on an invoice in general
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    8. hogjowl
      hogjowl

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      You’re disagreeing.

      Who do you think you’re fooling?
    9. Spurlington
      Spurlington

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      Haha .. sorry Fred !! The double exclamation points have no meaning behind it. I do understand its a way to emphasize emotionally but Ive been texting this way forever with no emotionial attachment. Now that you bring it up, I wonder how many have been offended by my symbol used incorrectly. If you check my previous texts, you will see the !!, which wont make sense other than thats how I end the sentence.
    10. Radar Foster
      Radar Foster

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      Gotcha !!

      My 15 year old does that too :stir:
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    11. Jim Pemberton
      Jim Pemberton

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      This reminds me of one of my favorite send ups on "text confusion creating wars".

      I had a crazy girlfriend who was just like this....

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    12. Spurlington
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      Great !! Now youre offending me with your 15yr old statement !! What are you trying to say ?!!!!!

      Ok .. just kidding !! Its none of my business what you think !!
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    13. Jim Pemberton
      Jim Pemberton

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      A very important life lesson...
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    14. steve_64
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      I've been trying to get Genny to understand that.

      I saw a saying that says it's an art form to not give a shit and nobody knows it.
      I say it's a way of life.
    15. steve_64
      steve_64

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      I couldn't post the way I do if I cared what anyone else thought.
    16. WillS
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      This is a good thread. I've had it happen to me with one of the guys before. Was gone over Thanksgiving break in 2016 and had a customer call and complain about a cleaning. I'm sure the tech sped through it because it was a last minute add on the day before Thanksgiving. When I said I see the invoice complete for 3 rooms total with urine extraction. $200. She says no I added on 2 additional rooms with urine and paid cash $335.

      Ok, well when I checked the deposits, only $200 was deposited from that job. I asked if she added on any rooms, and he told me he did all the rooms because she said it was only $200 she was supposed to be charged. The tech was lying and was gone the next day. It hurts having to let someone go so quickly without having a back up, but stealing is no bull shit for small bushiness. We even had his gift cards(their bonus) ready to give to him on Dec 1st. He really fu...ked up for $135.
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    17. Hoody
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      That is exactly what happened to me. Set up a purchasing agreement for 80% of the company with a local guy after I moved back. He had a bunch of equipment half working and cleaned for a few local small property managers for extra cash when his factory job shut down for 8 weeks in the summer. His wife ran the phones and jansan part of the apartment turn over. I was able to get enough parts around between what he had to get 1 reliable machine going(butler), sold a Bane he had to a local competitor who exclusively uses them. Took the cash and went and bought a Legend from a guy over by Chris and Stephanie who originally bought it from you Jim.

      Anyways, I reached out to some of my old prop. manager contacts, gave them a price list, and we had another 64k in work between the carpet cleaning and jansan part of turnover. Long story short, I didn't pay attention to the books because I was too busy out hustling, doing the work, and paying myself a small hourly wage to keep the money in the company. We had wages to pay for the jansan crew of about 25 people and supplies as well. Went to buy a water claw online because the bottom level of the one apartment complex always had water come in when it rained hard in the summer and the company card got declined. Logged into the bank account and found out the wife bought new tires for her Yukon and an 8k living room suite on the company card. Originally I made them sign a contract drafted by a local business attorney and ended up suing them. They had two choices, a lump sum or monthly payments(which cost them more). The guy made a comment similar to, "Whatever, we've got your apartment contacts so you're screwed." When they all found out I wasn't a part of the company anymore they jumped ship and went with someone else no matter how low they guy gave his bid.

      I got lucky with the contract but as you've stated Jim, most people don't get that lucky. Still a hard lesson learned but I took what they were paying me and put it into what I'm doing now and it let me limp along while I went to school too.
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    18. Brian H
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      I have lots of stories about employees and office staff who think they know how to steal from the company and get away with it. Some do get away with it for a while, but sooner or later they all get caught (I think).

      When I started here in 1990, we had a loose policy that you got a 2nd chance if caught stealing. I quickly changed that because in my mind it was a license to steal until you got caught, once that happened, then you couldn't steal anymore. We have a zero tolerance for stealing, even when it is a "family" member.

      Some examples:

      • Cashier taking payment for rug cleaning and reducing the amount of the invoice after the customer left. The daughter of one of office manager.
      • Doing a cash job and changing the invoice (and log sheet and "cash turned in" sheet using different colored ink). 17 year employee whose mother and brother-in-law worked for us.
      • Cleaning furniture on the side and doing a really poor job, enough that the customer called to complain. She knew the work was done on the side but was not happy with the results. 18 year employee and the brother-in-law of the one above.
      • Having customers call in and cancel while the crew is there doing the cleaning. We finally found it when we noticed this crew had a higher then average cancellation rate, so we started monitoring and drove by the job, witnessed him cleaning and fired him when he turned in the day's work showing the job cancelled. 20 year employee and his son still works for us.
      • Customer called into complain that the carpet the crew did in the side browned out and they couldn't correct it. She knew the crew did it on the side but felt we should be responsible because we sent the crew to her home. 3rd generation family member. His grandmother, grandfather, father, brother and sister had all worked for us. His dad still works for us. That incident devastated him.
    19. Jim Pemberton
      Jim Pemberton

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      Thanks for sharing these details Brian.

      The hardest lessons are those that involve family and close friends. Its heartbreaking, and often in the end costs everyone more than the services and cash stolen.

      When I was a young man, a wise old man (in retrospect, I think he was 40...but old to me then) told me this:

      "Jim, your friends will screw you after your relatives are done with you"

      He was a cynical alcoholic on this third wife, but sadly some of it rings true when we share these stories.
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    20. Cleanworks
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      Some times you have to think about not putting temptation in the way. Never let an employee take a truck home. Follow up every job with a phone call. Track vehicles with gps.
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    21. Mikey P
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      Or hire good humans and don't be a dick.
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    22. Jim Pemberton
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      Agreed. There is a lot to be said about being the kind of leader people like and wouldn't want to let down.

      But, I'm sad to say, if "being a dick" means carefully monitoring employee behaviors and trusting people as far as you can throw them, I'm on board with that.
    23. Mikey P
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      Depressing.
    24. hogjowl
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      Is 50% of that useful? :shifty:
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    25. Brian H
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      Trust but verify!!
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