Interview with Lee Senter 8-07

Mikey P

Administrator
Joined
Oct 6, 2006
Messages
112,308
Location
The High Chapperal
Due to a unfortunate mishap that was entirely my fault, half of Lee's interview was lost.


My humblest apologies.





Lee is a good Inspector, Instructor of several classes including Health and Safety for the iicrc and also he's good friend of mine who lives in Toronto but please don't hold that against him

James Lee Senter is known by most as Lee. I have 6 kids/stepkids who view me as their father figure, they are aged 21-28 years old. I have requested 17 grandchildren and receive nothing back but stares. I have lived with Cynthia for almost 15 years and she permits me to be a rabid Toronto Raptors and Toronto Blue Jays fan. I have been in the carpet cleaning/flood damage business since 1979. Soon after I started in the business I found out I had hepatitis c. I needed to find a way to do my job using chemicals that were less hazardous for my liver. I took out bubble gum with peanut butter, removed coffee stains with egg whites, used lemon juice for blood and used souring milk on ink.Most of the "green cleaners' at that time just did not work. I used powdered enzymes as my main cleaning prespray. My sinuses have paid the price of daily use of enzymes. I have watched people get sick over the years using our industry's chemicals. My passion for health and safety came several years ago. I had a client with 30 buildings and at one of the buildings we were cleaning the hallway carpets and carpeted steps. The bottom steps were covered with plastic. My techs went to the super to have him remove the plastic because it was dangerously slippery. The super said yeah, yeah in a minute. Because the steps were at the end of the job, the techs wrapped up and again told the super to remove the plastic. Yeah yeah was the response. Sure enough someone slipped and fell. They sued my company and the building. We ended up having the same insurance company.We ended up going to court a couple of years later, the person who had the accident was still having convulsions and couldn't come to court. Well all I know of the case is I never heard another thing. It was a real eye opener. Since then I have had a passion for making our business a safer one. I know many BB regulars view me as a zealot. I really am not. I just feel that overall the fundamental part of health and safety in business was never taught to us. I would like to make a bit of a difference.

Last edited by harryhides on 09 Aug 2007 06:15 pm; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website Yahoo Messenger
harryhides
Sergeant At Arms


Joined: 07 Oct 2006
Posts: 2241
Location: MB, Canada
Real Name in full :: Tony Wheelwright
Cleaning equip brands you use.: Genesis 59, HM's, Mastermatics + Cimex/OP's
Equip Brands you make, or promote.: none
City, Country: Winnipeg, Canada
Business Name:: Leatherwright
Years In Business:: 32
PostPosted: 09 Aug 2007 05:04 pm Post subject: Reply with quote Edit/Delete this post Delete this post View IP address of poster
Here are some of the "pre-asked" questions and answers:

5) What do you look for on an MSDS?

One of the first things I look for is lack of information. I
feel an MSDS should be informative with as much info as possible. Many
companies like to have this "trust me its safe" attitude. They hide info
under "proprietary blends". They don't show exposure values for the
ingredients in the mixture, nor do they show exposure values for the
cleaning mixture. I always watch for toxilogic considerations, handling,
disposal (which can be very surprising sometimes) and stability and
reactivity data can be interesting. You know under incompatabilities
there are several chems that are not safe to use with strong acids and
others that are not compatible with oxidizers. There are cases of
hundreds of bleach marks occuring from a prespray and peroxide mixing
together (nobody seems to brag about these)
An excellent example of incompatibilities would be mixing ammonia with
bleach. Still every year hundreds of people die from mixing these two
household chemicals together.



6) How do find out the hazards of a chemical?

Each chemical has a CAS number. Note the number and go to
http://www.scorecard.org/chemical-profiles/and punch in the name
or CAS number. Scroll down to the bottom of the results
you receive the goods from other sources other than themselves.
I especially like the New Jersey fact sheets.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website Yahoo Messenger
harryhides
Sergeant At Arms


Joined: 07 Oct 2006
Posts: 2241
Location: MB, Canada
Real Name in full :: Tony Wheelwright
Cleaning equip brands you use.: Genesis 59, HM's, Mastermatics + Cimex/OP's
Equip Brands you make, or promote.: none
City, Country: Winnipeg, Canada
Business Name:: Leatherwright
Years In Business:: 32
PostPosted: 09 Aug 2007 05:06 pm Post subject: Reply with quote Edit/Delete this post Delete this post View IP address of poster
16) Are solvent protectors that big of a deal?

Solvent protectors are definitely a tool in the toolbox. Yes we
need it for certain upholstery. But the primary rule of health and
safety is implementing engineering controls. One of the primary
engineering controls is substitution of a hazardous chemical with a less
hazardous one. Since a solvent protector uses a solvent as a carrier for
the flurochemical as compared to a water based protector using water as
the carrier---the only difference is the carrier.Its the same
flurochemical. Whenever you can the principles of occupational health
and safety would dictate to use the safer product. I also believe that
the hazards of many solvent protectors are understated on the MSDS.
Google or Scorecard the ingredients and know the precautions necessary
for using solvents.
I have met at least a dozen people across the country who have been
hospitalized as a result of using solvent protectors. This includes one
guy who had his lungs shrivel up, he spent weeks in the hospital after
spraying three couches.
Imagine what this does to kids, pets. Tons of cases of birds dying from
protector application.



17) Are biocides really that dangerous?

Biocides kill micro organisms. They are generally covered by the
same laws that govern pesticides.
It is truly amazing how liberally people use these biocides in people's
homes. Read the MSDS, especially the PPE and disposal parts. You may be
shocked at what the manufacturers tell you is required. Did you know
that you can't even flush Microban down the toilet??
Good old Jim Henry, widely loved industry instructor told anyone who
would listen that he died from the chemistry used in our industry.
Know your routes of entry into the body.
Know that many chemicals work on your body systemically. This means
certain chemicals target certain organs of your body.
Some chemicals are carcinogenic, some affect your hormones, some
affect your reproductive system, some your nervous system. NPEs are
widely banned now, they are known as gender benders, in otherwords
they change male fish into female fish. NPEs were a major component of
many presprays and degreasers. These chemicals are not caught by the
sanitary sewer system.
Ultra Fresh was the best biocide of its time. Pulled off the market
because it was killing people.
Had a class in Alberta , two guys come up and tell me and Ron Valega
that they have a barrel of biocide at their shop. Everytime they fill their
jugs they feel woozy and sometimes even get a nose bleed, do we
think that everything is okay there???!!! Got to be kidding right?? True
story.
Look at the old Milgo, it used to have gluteraldhyde in it. We used this
stuff as regular deo!!!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website Yahoo Messenger
harryhides
Sergeant At Arms


Joined: 07 Oct 2006
Posts: 2241
Location: MB, Canada
Real Name in full :: Tony Wheelwright
Cleaning equip brands you use.: Genesis 59, HM's, Mastermatics + Cimex/OP's
Equip Brands you make, or promote.: none
City, Country: Winnipeg, Canada
Business Name:: Leatherwright
Years In Business:: 32
PostPosted: 09 Aug 2007 05:09 pm Post subject: Reply with quote Edit/Delete this post Delete this post View IP address of poster
18/ If these chemicals are so dangerous why are they sold?

They are sold under the assumption that the users are going to
follow the labels explicitely and know and follow the MSDS. Now if we
all did that,they would be far less dangerous wouldn't they.
Besides of which, the principles of occupational health and safety
dictate that if there is a safer chemical you should use it. So many do
use safer products..

Last edited by harryhides on 09 Aug 2007 05:22 pm; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website Yahoo Messenger
harryhides
Sergeant At Arms


Joined: 07 Oct 2006
Posts: 2241
Location: MB, Canada
Real Name in full :: Tony Wheelwright
Cleaning equip brands you use.: Genesis 59, HM's, Mastermatics + Cimex/OP's
Equip Brands you make, or promote.: none
City, Country: Winnipeg, Canada
Business Name:: Leatherwright
Years In Business:: 32
PostPosted: 09 Aug 2007 05:12 pm Post subject: Reply with quote Edit/Delete this post Delete this post View IP address of poster
If you any questions for Lee, you may now begin to post them since Lee used to very careful when using Rust Remover he is now only able to type with two fingers.


My first question for Lee is about using Iso Propyl Alcohol. In my Company we do not any other solvents and do not spray Iso either - just apply with a flip top bottle.

What can you tell me about this stuff? Pros and Cons.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website Yahoo Messenger
diamond brian
Supporting Member


Joined: 28 Mar 2007
Posts: 326
Location: OK
Real Name in full :: brian jackson
Cleaning equip brands you use.: pro chem
Equip Brands you make, or promote.: none
City, Country: tulsa, ok, USA
Business Name:: diamond carpet specialists llc
Years In Business:: 7
PostPosted: 09 Aug 2007 05:16 pm Post subject: Reply with quote Edit/Delete this post Delete this post View IP address of poster
Hi Lee. I haven't had great results with any of the safer prespray blends on the market. What would be your choice for a good combination of safety/performance in a prespray?
_________________
Any man who is under 30, and is not a liberal, has no heart; and any man who is over 30, and is not a conservative, has no brains.
--Winston Churchill
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Larry Cobb
Supporting Member


Joined: 07 Oct 2006
Posts: 647
Location: TX
Real Name in full :: Larry Cobb
Cleaning equip brands you use.: Cleaning Chems, Truckmounts
Equip Brands you make, or promote.: Dynachem, Century 400, Unsmoke, Chemspec, DriEaz, Mytee
City, Country: Dallas, USA
Business Name:: Cobb Carpet Supply
Years In Business:: 30+
PostPosted: 09 Aug 2007 05:19 pm Post subject: Reply with quote Edit/Delete this post Delete this post View IP address of poster
Hi Lee;

As a manufacturer, I am in agreement with you over the lack of real information on MSDS.

Many MSDS I see are a joke.

I also understand the reluctance to put some information out.

I am also shocked by the failure of carpet cleaners to even read the MSDS.

Solid information is the key to safely using cleaning products.

What do you think of D'limonene as a solvent ?

Larry Cobb
_________________
~~ Supplier Sept. Sale- PowerMax, Impregnator ~~~ Cobb Carpet Web Site ~~ Phone 800-634-2622

Check out the new ProCaps Cylindrical Brush Machines

Last edited by Larry Cobb on 09 Aug 2007 05:20 pm; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
harryhides
Sergeant At Arms


Joined: 07 Oct 2006
Posts: 2241
Location: MB, Canada
Real Name in full :: Tony Wheelwright
Cleaning equip brands you use.: Genesis 59, HM's, Mastermatics + Cimex/OP's
Equip Brands you make, or promote.: none
City, Country: Winnipeg, Canada
Business Name:: Leatherwright
Years In Business:: 32
PostPosted: 09 Aug 2007 05:19 pm Post subject: Reply with quote Edit/Delete this post Delete this post View IP address of poster
Here is another pre-asked question.

1) Why should cleaners always wear gloves?

Wearing gloves is imperative IMO. Almost every cleaning
solution's MSDS states in the section on exposure controls/personal
protection that gloves must be worn. That is just a small part of it.

We are cleaning carpets, most carpets are cleaned every year or more.
No matter how clean a carpet is, I would never eat off of it. The soils in
a carpet include just about every gross thing you could imagine. Look at
it under a 30x microscope(available at Radio Shack for about $15.00) and
even a clean carpet appears loaded with pubic hair and such. Kids
picking their nose, rotten food, oils form feet, sweat, oils etc. My
skin is a route of entry into my body. The part of my body most likely
to touch the soils in the carpet is my hands. Therefore even with the
safest cleaning chemistry, we wear gloves.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website Yahoo Messenger
leesenter
Supporting Member


Joined: 07 Oct 2006
Posts: 79
Location: Ontario, Toronto
Real Name in full :: lees senter
Cleaning equip brands you use.: Ontario
Equip Brands you make, or promote.: canada
City, Country: Toronto
Business Name:: freshandclean
Years In Business:: .
PostPosted: 09 Aug 2007 05:21 pm Post subject: Reply with quote Edit/Delete this post Delete this post View IP address of poster
diamond brian wrote:
Hi Lee. I haven't had great results with any of the safer prespray blends on the market. What would be your choice for a good combination of safety/performance in a prespray?


For heavy duty purposes, we love the DFC heavy duty degreaser. It is a food-based alkaline that saponifies oil in no time flat. I also particularly like Inventek's line of products, however we don't hear very much about them.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
harryhides
Sergeant At Arms


Joined: 07 Oct 2006
Posts: 2241
Location: MB, Canada
Real Name in full :: Tony Wheelwright
Cleaning equip brands you use.: Genesis 59, HM's, Mastermatics + Cimex/OP's
Equip Brands you make, or promote.: none
City, Country: Winnipeg, Canada
Business Name:: Leatherwright
Years In Business:: 32
PostPosted: 09 Aug 2007 05:24 pm Post subject: Reply with quote Edit/Delete this post Delete this post View IP address of poster
leesenter wrote:
diamond brian wrote:
Hi Lee. I haven't had great results with any of the safer prespray blends on the market. What would be your choice for a good combination of safety/performance in a prespray?


For heavy duty purposes, we love the DFC heavy duty degreaser. It is a food-based alkaline that saponifies oil in no time flat. I also particularly like Inventek's line of products, however we don't hear very much about them.


Lee, who makes this product ??
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website Yahoo Messenger
leesenter
Supporting Member


Joined: 07 Oct 2006
Posts: 79
Location: Ontario, Toronto
Real Name in full :: lees senter
Cleaning equip brands you use.: Ontario
Equip Brands you make, or promote.: canada
City, Country: Toronto
Business Name:: freshandclean
Years In Business:: .
PostPosted: 09 Aug 2007 05:24 pm Post subject: Reply with quote Edit/Delete this post Delete this post View IP address of poster
Larry Cobb wrote:
Hi Lee;

As a manufacturer, I am in agreement with you over the lack of real information on MSDS.

Many MSDS I see are a joke.

I also understand the reluctance to put some information out.

I am also shocked by the failure of carpet cleaners to even read the MSDS.

Solid information is the key to safely using cleaning products.

What do you think of D'limonene as a solvent ?

Larry Cobb


We definitely use D'limonene over other non-volatile solvents. However, I just don't buy the argument that this is a 'green' product. There are many carcinogens found in the scent of an orange blossom. D'limonene is a member of the terpene family, just like turpentine . It is just another solvent that needs to be dealt with with respect. Just because something comes from a natural source does not make it safe.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
leesenter
Supporting Member


Joined: 07 Oct 2006
Posts: 79
Location: Ontario, Toronto
Real Name in full :: lees senter
Cleaning equip brands you use.: Ontario
Equip Brands you make, or promote.: canada
City, Country: Toronto
Business Name:: freshandclean
Years In Business:: .
PostPosted: 09 Aug 2007 05:27 pm Post subject: Reply with quote Edit/Delete this post Delete this post View IP address of poster
harryhides wrote:
leesenter wrote:
diamond brian wrote:
Hi Lee. I haven't had great results with any of the safer prespray blends on the market. What would be your choice for a good combination of safety/performance in a prespray?


For heavy duty purposes, we love the DFC heavy duty degreaser. It is a food-based alkaline that saponifies oil in no time flat. I also particularly like Inventek's line of products, however we don't hear very much about them.


Lee, who makes this product ??


DFC is made by Chemspec. The newly formulated DFC 105 has many of the ingredients of the heavy duty cleaner. Why they didn't rename it, I'll never know. As with most chemistry, this product works much better with high heat. Inventek can be found on the internet at http://www.inventek.ca
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
harryhides
Sergeant At Arms


Joined: 07 Oct 2006
Posts: 2241
Location: MB, Canada
Real Name in full :: Tony Wheelwright
Cleaning equip brands you use.: Genesis 59, HM's, Mastermatics + Cimex/OP's
Equip Brands you make, or promote.: none
City, Country: Winnipeg, Canada
Business Name:: Leatherwright
Years In Business:: 32
PostPosted: 09 Aug 2007 05:30 pm Post subject: Reply with quote Edit/Delete this post Delete this post View IP address of poster
3) Do you ever use non-green chemicals??

Yes we use non-green chems. On carpets when we have CGD olefin
with heavy oils we'll go with an enzyme like Enzall (for foods) or a
heavy mixture of Ultrapac with a citrus 500 additive and powdered
peroxide.
But even these days are coming to an end. The new food based alkalines
mix well with oils and they saponify the soil into soap.
With upholstery for heavy oils we still stick to an upholstery enzyme
most of the time.
We use water based protectors, haven't tried the green protectors.
We use different encap juices, our all natural encap hasn't passed the
beta stage yet.
We use citrus mixed with butyls rather than using POG, its a bit safer
but not much.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website Yahoo Messenger
leesenter
Supporting Member


Joined: 07 Oct 2006
Posts: 79
Location: Ontario, Toronto
Real Name in full :: lees senter
Cleaning equip brands you use.: Ontario
Equip Brands you make, or promote.: canada
City, Country: Toronto
Business Name:: freshandclean
Years In Business:: .
PostPosted: 09 Aug 2007 05:32 pm Post subject: Reply with quote Edit/Delete this post Delete this post View IP address of poster
harryhides wrote:
If you any questions for Lee, you may now begin to post them since Lee used to very careful when using Rust Remover he is now only able to type with two fingers.


My first question for Lee is about using Iso Propyl Alcohol. In my Company we do not any other solvents and do not spray Iso either - just apply with a flip top bottle.

What can you tell me about this stuff? Pros and Cons.


We use Iso Propyl Alcohol all the time. Obviously, you would not want to ingest this or get it in your eyes. Because this is such a common household product, I have noticed people take fewer precautions with it. It is flammable, and toxic. Again, it has its hazards, but because it is so volatile, it is less likely to cause long-term problems.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
harryhides
Sergeant At Arms


Joined: 07 Oct 2006
Posts: 2241
Location: MB, Canada
Real Name in full :: Tony Wheelwright
Cleaning equip brands you use.: Genesis 59, HM's, Mastermatics + Cimex/OP's
Equip Brands you make, or promote.: none
City, Country: Winnipeg, Canada
Business Name:: Leatherwright
Years In Business:: 32
PostPosted: 09 Aug 2007 05:32 pm Post subject: Reply with quote Edit/Delete this post Delete this post View IP address of poster
Lee, I have a question:

My first question for Lee is about using Iso Propyl Alcohol. In my Company we do not any other solvents and do not spray Iso either - just apply with a flip top bottle.

What can you tell me about this stuff? Pros and Cons.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website Yahoo Messenger
harryhides
Sergeant At Arms


Joined: 07 Oct 2006
Posts: 2241
Location: MB, Canada
Real Name in full :: Tony Wheelwright
Cleaning equip brands you use.: Genesis 59, HM's, Mastermatics + Cimex/OP's
Equip Brands you make, or promote.: none
City, Country: Winnipeg, Canada
Business Name:: Leatherwright
Years In Business:: 32
PostPosted: 09 Aug 2007 05:35 pm Post subject: Reply with quote Edit/Delete this post Delete this post View IP address of poster
As far as I know some of the most dangerous chems that we often use are

Solvents

Biocides

HydroFloruric acid

Formic acid ( for fiber ID )

How would you rate them as to potential danger to those of us who use them?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website Yahoo Messenger
Albert Lazo
Supporting Member


Joined: 08 Oct 2006
Posts: 597
Location: CA, San Jose
Real Name in full :: Albert Lazo
Cleaning equip brands you use.: California
Equip Brands you make, or promote.: USA
City, Country: San Jose
Business Name:: Crystal Chem-Dry
Years In Business:: 2.5
PostPosted: 09 Aug 2007 05:36 pm Post subject: Reply with quote Edit/Delete this post Delete this post View IP address of poster
Hello Lee, good topic. What do you think about the safety of some of the so called soapless products. DFC 105 is one and you seem to favor it but have you tried/tested others.

Also, are there any ingredients that are not listed in an msds sheet that you feel should be listed?.

Albert
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
leesenter
Supporting Member


Joined: 07 Oct 2006
Posts: 79
Location: Ontario, Toronto
Real Name in full :: lees senter
Cleaning equip brands you use.: Ontario
Equip Brands you make, or promote.: canada
City, Country: Toronto
Business Name:: freshandclean
Years In Business:: .
PostPosted: 09 Aug 2007 05:37 pm Post subject: Reply with quote Edit/Delete this post Delete this post View IP address of poster
I would like to comment on Larry's post.
I once got several emails from his competitors asking me to stop calling butyl cellusolve poison, they insisted that i call it 'toxic". When I pointed out various things on their MSDS they went in a tirade how no one reads the MSDS. If the customers did there would be fewer accidents.
Larry do you put a copy of the MSDS of a product in each case of product?
what do you see that upsets you with MSDS in the marketplace?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Larry Cobb
Supporting Member


Joined: 07 Oct 2006
Posts: 647
Location: TX
Real Name in full :: Larry Cobb
Cleaning equip brands you use.: Cleaning Chems, Truckmounts
Equip Brands you make, or promote.: Dynachem, Century 400, Unsmoke, Chemspec, DriEaz, Mytee
City, Country: Dallas, USA
Business Name:: Cobb Carpet Supply
Years In Business:: 30+
PostPosted: 09 Aug 2007 05:38 pm Post subject: Reply with quote Edit/Delete this post Delete this post View IP address of poster
Lee;

We have used more Enzymes in spotters and powder cleaners in the last year.

You mentioned Enzymes that you sometimes use, and you also mentioned irritation.

Do you think that more effective Enzymes have a place in future cleaning technology?

Larry Cobb
_________________
~~ Supplier Sept. Sale- PowerMax, Impregnator ~~~ Cobb Carpet Web Site ~~ Phone 800-634-2622

Check out the new ProCaps Cylindrical Brush Machines
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Rex Tyus
Supporting Member


Joined: 07 Oct 2006
Posts: 977
Location: Florida, Marianna
Real Name in full :: Rex Tyus
Cleaning equip brands you use.: Cleanco Q56
Equip Brands you make, or promote.: None
City, Country: Marianna, U.S.A.
Business Name:: Rug Rex
Years In Business:: Since 1999
PostPosted: 09 Aug 2007 05:38 pm Post subject: Reply with quote Edit/Delete this post Delete this post View IP address of poster
Any idea why the IICRC doesn't require passing health and safety in order to be a certified firm?
_________________
Blot! Don't rub!


Rex Tyus
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
harryhides
Sergeant At Arms


Joined: 07 Oct 2006
Posts: 2241
Location: MB, Canada
Real Name in full :: Tony Wheelwright
Cleaning equip brands you use.: Genesis 59, HM's, Mastermatics + Cimex/OP's
Equip Brands you make, or promote.: none
City, Country: Winnipeg, Canada
Business Name:: Leatherwright
Years In Business:: 32
PostPosted: 09 Aug 2007 05:39 pm Post subject: Reply with quote Edit/Delete this post Delete this post View IP address of poster
4) What is your definition of a green cleaner?

A green cleaning solution is one that is safe to use around
humans and animals, safe for the water and environment, and has no
hazardous by-products in its manufacturing process.
I don't buy this argument of using a product that has hazardous
ingredients and calling it green. Just because its safer than most
products doesn't make it green.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website Yahoo Messenger
harryhides
Sergeant At Arms


Joined: 07 Oct 2006
Posts: 2241
Location: MB, Canada
Real Name in full :: Tony Wheelwright
Cleaning equip brands you use.: Genesis 59, HM's, Mastermatics + Cimex/OP's
Equip Brands you make, or promote.: none
City, Country: Winnipeg, Canada
Business Name:: Leatherwright
Years In Business:: 32
PostPosted: 09 Aug 2007 05:41 pm Post subject: Reply with quote Edit/Delete this post Delete this post View IP address of poster
2) what does a 'c' notation next to the TLV or STEL mean on an MSDS?

There are various terminologies used to inform users about the
PEL's (permissable exposure limits) of chemicals. The most common in the
USA is TLV (threshold limit value) established by the ACGIH. The TLV of
a chemical is the maximum amount of a chemical you can be exposed to
over a 40 hour week and 8 hour day. Usually in industry if you come
close to reaching even 50% of the TLV of a chemical, air monitoring will
be performed to be certain that the PEL is never reached. There is also
a STEL for more dangerous products. This is the maximum exposure limit
for a chemical in any 15 minute interval. Obviously if we use a chemical
with an STEL we are using a very dangerous product and we may want
to consider using a less dangerous product. When you see the 'c' notation
next to TLV or STEL that means there is a ceiling exposure value for
that chemical. That is the maximum amount of the chemical you can be
exposed to at any given time. Gluteraldhyde is one of these chemicals.
Thats why you don't see this stuff anymore. Its just too dangerous for
the worker and the client to be exposed to.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website Yahoo Messenger
Larry Cobb
Supporting Member


Joined: 07 Oct 2006
Posts: 647
Location: TX
Real Name in full :: Larry Cobb
Cleaning equip brands you use.: Cleaning Chems, Truckmounts
Equip Brands you make, or promote.: Dynachem, Century 400, Unsmoke, Chemspec, DriEaz, Mytee
City, Country: Dallas, USA
Business Name:: Cobb Carpet Supply
Years In Business:: 30+
PostPosted: 09 Aug 2007 05:43 pm Post subject: Reply with quote Edit/Delete this post Delete this post View IP address of poster
Lee;

We print an MSDS with CAS #'s on every Product Data sheet that we have.

Even the ones that don't require an MSDS (we do have several).

We send them out with initial orders of a product and anytime a buyer requests them.

Larry Cobb
_________________
~~ Supplier Sept. Sale- PowerMax, Impregnator ~~~ Cobb Carpet Web Site ~~ Phone 800-634-2622

Check out the new ProCaps Cylindrical Brush Machines
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
leesenter
Supporting Member


Joined: 07 Oct 2006
Posts: 79
Location: Ontario, Toronto
Real Name in full :: lees senter
Cleaning equip brands you use.: Ontario
Equip Brands you make, or promote.: canada
City, Country: Toronto
Business Name:: freshandclean
Years In Business:: .
PostPosted: 09 Aug 2007 05:44 pm Post subject: Reply with quote Edit/Delete this post Delete this post View IP address of poster
harryhides wrote:
As far as I know some of the most dangerous chems that we often use are

Solvents

Biocides

HydroFloruric acid

Formic acid ( for fiber ID )

How would you rate them as to potential danger to those of us who use them?


Solvents -- many people have gotten cancer and shingles. Must be used with ultimate care. I remember stories from an IICRC instructor about him walking down the street with a customer trying to snap him out of a daze from solvents. So many odorless solvents out there making us feel falsely secure using them.
Biocides -- Some of the stuff on the market is unbelieveably potent. Most of these biocides must be thoroughly rinsed out of the carpet, however, they are not even safe to put down a sanitary sewer. People are using it for deo!!! Unbelievable!

Hyodro flouric acid -- scars people. Imagine somebody getting that in their eye, they are instantly blinded. It is just not worth having in the truck. Ask Larry, I believe you DOT paperwork for this in gallon size or larger.

Formic acid -- Tell a scientist that you're using this product, and he will tell you that you're crazy. I don't know that much about it...
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
harryhides
Sergeant At Arms


Joined: 07 Oct 2006
Posts: 2241
Location: MB, Canada
Real Name in full :: Tony Wheelwright
Cleaning equip brands you use.: Genesis 59, HM's, Mastermatics + Cimex/OP's
Equip Brands you make, or promote.: none
City, Country: Winnipeg, Canada
Business Name:: Leatherwright
Years In Business:: 32
PostPosted: 09 Aug 2007 05:46 pm Post subject: Reply with quote Edit/Delete this post Delete this post View IP address of poster
14) what are the most common hazards on a fire remediation?

Fire memediation can hold a gazillion hazards. A thorough hazard
assessment should be performed at any job before starting. Checklists
are a great way to be thorough on a hazard assessment.
The latest research by various workmen's compensation boards has
identified 900 carcinogens created by a fire damage. Fireman getting
cancer from exposure to charred ruins is a major issue these days. Geez
these guys are wearing SCBAs on the job. Workman's comp is writing
restoration people up in Ontario and BC for not wearing appropriate
respirators on cleanups. An N95 just doesn't cut it. Hold an N95 up in
the air at a fire job and then attach a vac hose to it for a few
minutes. The stuff that is filtered out in a few short minutes will make
you realize just how hazardous this job is.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website Yahoo Messenger
leesenter
Supporting Member


Joined: 07 Oct 2006
Posts: 79
Location: Ontario, Toronto
Real Name in full :: lees senter
Cleaning equip brands you use.: Ontario
Equip Brands you make, or promote.: canada
City, Country: Toronto
Business Name:: freshandclean
Years In Business:: .
PostPosted: 09 Aug 2007 05:47 pm Post subject: Reply with quote Edit/Delete this post Delete this post View IP address of poster
Albert Lazo wrote:
Hello Lee, good topic. What do you think about the safety of some of the so called soapless products. DFC 105 is one and you seem to favor it but have you tried/tested others.

Also, are there any ingredients that are not listed in an msds sheet that you feel should be listed?.

Albert


I only know about Canada, and our ingredient disclosure list is quite exentsive. I am not sure about the United States, but it Canada, a hazardous ingredient must be listed when in a concentration of 1% or more. However, any carcinogenic ingredient must be listed in concentrations of .1% or more. I think this is the new way of looking at hazardous ingredients and should be expanded to include mutagens and teratogens.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
harryhides
Sergeant At Arms


Joined: 07 Oct 2006
Posts: 2241
Location: MB, Canada
Real Name in full :: Tony Wheelwright
Cleaning equip brands you use.: Genesis 59, HM's, Mastermatics + Cimex/OP's
Equip Brands you make, or promote.: none
City, Country: Winnipeg, Canada
Business Name:: Leatherwright
Years In Business:: 32
PostPosted: 09 Aug 2007 05:47 pm Post subject: Reply with quote Edit/Delete this post Delete this post View IP address of poster
13) what electrical hazards are the most common on a water damage?

After teaching HST you realize how many people are killed by
touching the breaker panel while on a wet floor. The fire department
pulls the meter when the panel gets wet or even close to wet, why don't
we??
The most important factor to consider is how well you are insulated.
Rubber gloves and boots do absolutely no good if you are wet from head
to toe.
Breakers and fuses are not to be touched if there is any water near the
box.
If you have equipment wired in, energy must be locked out, tagging out
is a thing of the past.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website Yahoo Messenger
Albert Lazo
Supporting Member


Joined: 08 Oct 2006
Posts: 597
Location: CA, San Jose
Real Name in full :: Albert Lazo
Cleaning equip brands you use.: California
Equip Brands you make, or promote.: USA
City, Country: San Jose
Business Name:: Crystal Chem-Dry
Years In Business:: 2.5
PostPosted: 09 Aug 2007 05:48 pm Post subject: Reply with quote Edit/Delete this post Delete this post View IP address of poster
Lee, what do you recommend for odor removal (pet, urine, smoke ect..).

BTW, you type pretty damn fast for 2 fingers, shall we enter you in a contest Laughing

Albert
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
leesenter
Supporting Member


Joined: 07 Oct 2006
Posts: 79
Location: Ontario, Toronto
Real Name in full :: lees senter
Cleaning equip brands you use.: Ontario
Equip Brands you make, or promote.: canada
City, Country: Toronto
Business Name:: freshandclean
Years In Business:: .
PostPosted: 09 Aug 2007 05:49 pm Post subject: Reply with quote Edit/Delete this post Delete this post View IP address of poster
Larry Cobb wrote:
Lee;

We have used more Enzymes in spotters and powder cleaners in the last year.

You mentioned Enzymes that you sometimes use, and you also mentioned irritation.

Do you think that more effective Enzymes have a place in future cleaning technology?

Larry Cobb


The latest big push of new green products seems to be coming from Rochester Midland. Their new products, they claim to have good spores and bacteria that create enzymic actions and that can stay dormant in the carpet or surface. Truly amazing stuff on sewage jobs. I believe enzymes are part of a dynamite technology. However, they are known to be a mucus membrane irratant, so extensive use of these products may cause chronic problems. Handled with care and respect, I think they are great.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
harryhides
Sergeant At Arms


Joined: 07 Oct 2006
Posts: 2241
Location: MB, Canada
Real Name in full :: Tony Wheelwright
Cleaning equip brands you use.: Genesis 59, HM's, Mastermatics + Cimex/OP's
Equip Brands you make, or promote.: none
City, Country: Winnipeg, Canada
Business Name:: Leatherwright
Years In Business:: 32
PostPosted: 09 Aug 2007 05:50 pm Post subject: Reply with quote Edit/Delete this post Delete this post View IP address of poster
11) How do you remediate a crawlspace safely?

Most crawlspaces are confined spaces. Confined spaces have
varying regulations according to where you live. However at minimum in
our business a hazard assessment must be performed, air sampling is
required esp. for hydrogen sulfide, rescue procedures have to be
developed and REHEARSED, and rescue people must be appropriately
trained. I know most won't buy this but very often its easier to remove
part of the floor and work from the top down.


12) How do you identify and control asbestos and lead in a water damage?

Its odd how insignificant most remediators view asbestos. In
Ontario the laws have been tightened up considerably. You can't even cut
old drywall without testing the mud for asbestos. Due diligence would
direct you to test any potential ACM (asbestos containing material) in
buildings built prior to 1990. Insulation, adhesives, plaster, tiles,
ceiling tiles should all be tested prior to making the material friable.
Paint used on walls prior to the 1970s and especially the 50s and 60s
can contain as much as 50% lead. Permanent brain damage can occur from over exposure to lead.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website Yahoo Messenger website Yahoo Messenger
 

Latest posts

Back
Top Bottom