lifespan of a direct drive tm

[juniorc82]

I was looking at buying a hydramaster 4.2 cds used. It has 4800 hrs on it. what is the lifespan of direct drive versus slide in?

 

[hogjowl]

I am going to attempt to answer your question the best I can until someone who actually knows what they are talking about comes along.

I have never owned a direct drive unit. Always slide in's. So, my answer is based on what I have read and heard over the years.

If you are an owner/operator, and you take care of your equipment, you might can get 8 or 10 years out of a new direct drive unit before it's toast. If you run crews, you're going to be lucky with 5 years.

Having seen many cleaners rigs over the years, I can say that good cleaners who take really good care of their equipment are the exception, not the norm. And, companies who run crews never take care of their stuff. So, there is a good chance you might not want that rig, unless you like old worn out stuff.

Caveat Emptor

 

[TimP]

I've heard/read 10,000 hours and 200,000 miles on well maintained van powered PTO's. Something in that ball park. Right now I have less than 1100 on my cds and less than 20,000 miles on mine....in 2.5 years.

 

[Mike Draper]

I have a direct drive and I would say that if the van has 4800 hours on it then things are just going to go downhill from now on. Invest in a newer tm and not in repairs on that old tm.

 

[Desk Jockey]

4800 is a lot of hours, but not so much that it doesn't still have some life.

4800 on a "slide in"? Unless it was liquid cooled it would be time to slide the "slide in" right out!

4800 could be half the life even on a liquid cooled machine.

The real question is what can you afford? You could probably afford a newer slide in for the price of the older CDS.

If you can afford a newer unit, purchase the newer one and you'll avoid the problems that come with wear. (Pump repair, belt and hose and possible blower replacement, power plant overhaul)

 

[The Great Oz]

I've heard/read 10,000 hours and 200,000 miles on well maintained van powered PTO's. Something in that ball park. Right now I have less than 1100 on my cds and less than 20,000 miles on mine....in 2.5 years.

We typically run our CDS' past 6,000 hours with few issues. I know a lot of guys that have purchased used CDS' from us that have far more than 10k hours and they run fine. They had the advantage of buying trucks that were well maintained in their first life though. (One of many exceptions to Marty's rules.) I think there will be repair and replacement issues when you get past 10k hours that might make it a good idea to sell or at least purchase a newer primary unit.


Good luck!

 

[Art Kelley]

My '03 White Magic Pro1200 has about 5300 hrs on it and I wouldn't think of replacing it now. I look to putting another 15000hrs/15yrs on it as long as the van body looks good. I still have my '87 wm1200 that has over 20000 hrs and looks like a turd but sounds like Susan Boyle. All I had to do in those 20 years was replace the engine once, the driveshaft once, the blower once, the pump once, the heat exchanger once, and every drive component on the van. Nothing to it.
A well designed heavy duty D/D will last as long as you allow it to. My mechanic sends me Christmas cards.

 

[Guest]

Its just now getting broke in!!!!

 

[Sticky]

Hour meters can be stopped by pulling one wire and/or could have been replaced 5 or 10 thousand hours before. You don't want to necessarily rely on the hour meter as being accurate.

If you don't know what to look for, hook up with a local disty and have them run through it and look for any major problems.

I'd have a GM or Ford certified car dealer look at the van too.

There are too many things that can go with TM's to not have someone that is a trained professional look at it.

I wouldn't by a CDS machine with 4 or 5 thousand hours for more then 5 grand. IMO (too much could be wrong with them)

CDS beat on your van.
Make sure the drive shaft is working properly and lubed. It gets expensive when they go...
Not trying to be devils advocate just trying to give you some things to look for.

 

[bob vawter]

People who have never owned one...
don know they are DA's....!

 

[Out of Character - 0]

I've got 1 unit that has 45k miles and no real repairs. Our other is a 98 Ford E350 w/5.4 has 12-15k hours and 165,000 miles, runs as good as a used van should. In the last 5 years, 80k miles, and 8,500hrs we have had to replace $1000 worth of seals (oil leaks), 4 AC compressors, 2 clutch packs, a van water pump, 2 heat exchangers (duals), and a machine water pump, and 6 of the 8 ignition coils have failed.

I don't think GM engines have the same longevity. I toasted the engine in a 02 Safari after only 67,000 miles. I drove it REALLY hard after about a 5,000 mile break-in period but I changed the oil every 2500 miles. I always warmed it up and used good fuel/oil. I've been equally hard on Ford's vehicles without the same results after more miles. BUT all of the Fords I've abused have had either the 4.6 or the 5.4 which are good engines in my opinion.

 

[Doug Cox]

My HM CDS lasted 24 years before I sold it. I can't imagine how many tens of thousands of hours it had on it. It still had numerous years to put in. It lasts as long as you want it to.

 

[bob vawter]

My HM CDS lasted 24 years before I sold it. I can't imagine how many tens of thousands of hours it had on it. It still had numerous years to put in. It lasts as long as you want it to.

YES...what Doug sED!

 

[Jimmy L]

Didn't the HM 4.2 operate at like 2500 rpms?

 

[Doug Cox]

I ran mine at 2250 rpms.

 

[BradFenstermaker]

Keep in mind when looking at a Direct Drive, every cleaning hour is like driving 30 miles. Plus odometer.

Your question really depends on how well it was cared for. Really be picky and look it over inside and out.

Go clean with it and stand at the truck while she's working and see how it runs. Does it bog or miss? How's the heat?

Good luck, if your mechanical a used unit is a great way to start.

 

[Jimmy L]

That's unreal and dangerous.


My cleanco runs at around 1500.

 

[Larry Cobb]

About 1/3rd the life of a slide-in.

Truck is out of style in 5 years.

Larry

 

[Steve Toburen]

Keep in mind when looking at a Direct Drive, every cleaning hour is like driving 30 miles. Plus odometer.

Your question really depends on how well it was cared for. Really be picky and look it over inside and out.

Go clean with it and stand at the truck while she's working and see how it runs. Does it bog or miss? How's the heat?

Good luck, if your mechanical a used unit is a great way to start.

I agree with Brad except I'd go even higher on the miles per hour on the odometer per machine hour. Chances are with the driving miles added in the van motor has the equivalent of 200K or more on it.

Island Boy
www.StrategiesForSuccess.com

PS We ran CDS's for years and sold them at around 5,000 hours. The maintenance issues picked up around then (which with the production we expected out of our TM's and people was a real killer with down time) and frankly the machine had grossed us 500K or more. I felt the machine had "paid for itself" many times over and wanted to let someone else deal with the inevitable problems.

 

[Kevin. McCreary]

I put 12,000 hours on my old 84 CDS but that was through 2 Chevy vans.
I had a friend buy one in a box van that looked pretty and it had 4000 hours on
it. I advised him not to buy it, or at least have a good mechanic do a compression test
on it. He ignored me and the motor blew two weeks after he bought it. I will say that a
couple of Butlers I have had over the years lasted for a long time, but after about 80,00
miles and 3,500 hours they seem kind of tired. Not to say they wont go longer than that
but they just aren't as reliable as an every day work horse with out some on the job
troubles here and there. (nickel and dime stuff)

That particular machine you are looking at is also the most fuel consuming machine I have
ever seen in 20 years. It runs way too fast for the lack of power it provides.

The exhaust also gets so hot when it runs that it burns up starters every 6 months.

 

[The Great Oz]

I'd ask you to post a picture or more information, but I realize that a general BB rule is that everyone selling/using a different unit will tell you your choice is crap. And, unless it's picture perfect, you paid less than $500 for it, and the seller threw in some Starbucks coupons, they'll tell you you got screwed.

Sorry. :?

 

[bob vawter]

I finaly put some plugs and wires wit a cap and rotor...
i'm good for ANOTHER seven years on my church bus.........!

 

[Kevin. McCreary]

I'd ask you to post a picture or more information, but I realize that a general BB rule is that everyone selling/using a different unit will tell you your choice is crap. And, unless it's picture perfect, you paid less than $500 for it, and the seller threw in some Starbucks coupons, they'll tell you you got screwed.

Sorry. :?

If you use or sell Hydramasters you know exactly what I'm talking about. If the starters where not a problem
they never would of offered a starter fan and starter heat wrap kit. Also they never would of invented
the 4.7 and 4.8 that ran much slower, produced more vacuum and eliminated all of the high rpm gas
consumption and unnecessary heat under the hood. Trust me I was in charge of maintaining 7 of them.

 

[John Watson]

my shaft drive unit is 21 years old, First owner had it 6yrs, My daughter then ran it for a couple of years, (She was the one who told me that her PC Legend said it was low on oil on the dip stick but woulden't take any more cause it was over flowing at the fill cap!!!! you guess what she was doing...) Then I ran it for a couple years as a back up and catch up machine. Then Mr Destruction (My son Jay) had it for a couple years before Helen and I started running it full time. It is just an easy van to work out of. It is on its 4th and final van which had over 110,000 whin we installed it, now has over 165,000 and still has the originanal, pump, blower, & waste tank. It is on it"s 2nd heat exchanger.

 

[Louis]

I have 3200 hr on my pto. The machine runs great. The problem is all the little crap under the hood that breaks from the heat. When they say it's a dealer part $$$$. I have bought at least 3 kohlers in repairs to my van motor.

 

[hogjowl]

Is there really anybody named Helen, or is she just an imaginary friend?