Ok, 2nd question for the Juice whores..

[Mike Pailliotet]

My Olefin PS thread got me thinking about just how many veritys of cleaing agents I should have on my truck.
I clean both residential and commercial carpet. I use HWE, OP and Cimex type VLM machines.
I also clean all fabric types as well as tile, stone and grout.




I would like Shawn, Olson, Pemberton, Warrington and Yeadon to virtually fill my empty shelves with every thing I need and nothing I don't to be completely covered in my role as a professional cleaner.


Go!

 

[Jay D]

FREE, RIGHT!!

 

[Mike Pailliotet]

Nothing is free Jay.

 

[J Scott W]

How many cars does someone need to get around?

Maybe the world get by with just one model, but what is best for carrying the kids to school or hauling sheets of plywood or ebing comfortable on a cross country trip would be different.

Even whn you define what your are going to use it for, someone can say I prefer Ford while the next guy likes Chevy or any of a dozen other brands. Someone likes the bright red paint job that catches peoples eye while other prefer to blend in with all the dark metalic cars on the road.

Same things about presprays or breakfast ceral or bars of bath soap. There are many steps between the absolute minimum to do the job and all the variations - even variations in personal preferences - that might make someone chose product A over product B.

For my List I would have the following presprays

Zone Perfect for most residential jobs
Traffic Slam for residential olefin and some commercial olefin
Flex for the nasty jobs, commercial or residential, restuarants, trashed apartments and so forth
Hydrobreak for gentle care of wool rugs

Rinse Agent - EndZone

Spotters StainZONE, Red Zone, Citrus Solv Those three can cover over 90% of the common stains

Protector Maxim Advanced for Carpet

OP, Cimex, VLM, Encap Encapuguard Green DS


Pet odor control - PetZone with Hydrocide


Upholstery Fabric
For cleaning the ever popular microfiber and most synthetics Avenge HD Fabric Prespray
For natural fibers, delicate fibers, etc. Fabric Shampoo


Tile, grout, stone main cleaner - Spinergy StonePerfect
Tile, Grout & Stone acid cleaner when needed Spinergy Resuscitate
Sealer Spinergy SolidRock

Glad to have acess to many other products IF I NEEDED THEM. The above is what I would keep in my truck.

Got any shelf space left?

 

[Mike Pailliotet]

now that's what I call a Company Man..

 

[sweendogg]

I actually expected Warrington and hopefully Yeadon to stick to their company products and and glad Scott did. Its nice to know they back their products. This should be a topic for all IICRC classes. even if you have to hold this session after the test so its not officially sancitioned by them. Getting good product suggestions and when to use them is like pulling teeth out of some instructors and others, its like getting free candy in a parade!!

At some point it would be great to see a thread as to why companies like Jon Don and Bridgepoint.. (jon don being the worst at this) carry so many different private label/self made products if as Scott suggests you only need the four presprays and the one rinse.. why so many extraction detergents? And jon Don why so many cheaper presprays if Grand Slam would be your go to.. ( I'm predicting this from Yeadon obviously.) Or why so many detergents/shampoos? I think it would be informative to see a list of manufacturers products and then have a bit of info as to why they were introduced and when would be an ideal situation to use them. I know I'm picking on Jon Don a little only because their catalog is next to my desk but who uses a shampoo with a pH of 13 (champion).. over a made for Prespray.. and are you leaving that behind as a stand alone Jimmy Hate method or is it supposed to be coupled with extraction? And why have 8 different presprays? Its not just Jon Don, Chemspec has 8 detergents, 6 presprays, and it seems every manufacturing company is similar. Why have 8 if you only need 4..

Just questions that pass my mind exploding on a post! :mrgreen:

 

[hogjowl]

90% of what you do could be handled with Judson's O2 and their booster.

 

[Jim Pemberton]

Mikey called me a whore

Ask me nicer and I might answer......

 

[Mike Pailliotet]

OK Bitch, what should I use?

 

[Jim Pemberton]

Castrol Superclean
Hydrogen Peroxide
STP
Fels Naptha
Ammonia
Vinegar

That's all you get till I get a mea culpa for your continual mental cruelty

 

[Bob Foster]

Castrol Superclean
Hydrogen Peroxide
STP
Fels Naptha
Ammonia
Vinegar

That's all you get till I get a mea culpa for your continual mental cruelty

Terje on Jim's computer...

 

[Lyman]

Wow, I have all those on the truck.

 

[sweendogg]

Castrol Superclean
Hydrogen Peroxide
STP
Fels Naptha
Ammonia
Vinegar

That's all you get till I get a mea culpa for your continual mental cruelty

You forgot MSG!

 

[Jim Pemberton]

While I await Mikey's sincere apology, I'll try to answer David's question that is also a constant frustration for me as a supply store owner: Duplicate products.

When I was shipping products for our supply business after school in the mid 70's, we had one traffic lane cleaner, two detergents for carpet (liquid and powder), two deodorizers (perfume one and liquid oxidizer......yes way back then), a soil retardant, an antistatic spray, browning treatment, upholstery shampoo, dry cleaning solvent, a few spotters, and that was about it for the entire supply business.

Over time, manufacturers introduce new products that SHOULD replace their old ones, but the long time users of those products resist changing, so you have an "old" product and a "new product". About the only thing that kills an "old" product anymore is lack of available raw ingredients; although some manufacturers change the formula and not the name and label. Then there is a "newer" product to replace the last "new product", but those users won't change using the first new product, so now you have three products.

Of course then there are new products for new problems: Olefin cleaners, Haitian Cotton Cleaners (dying out as I type this) Red Dye Removers, safer "wet side" upholstery products, enzyme deodorizers, "Green Products" etc.
Now remember, this is all within one brand.

Add to the fact that very few distributors are "single brand" companies, but strive to carry the most popular "name brands" for their customers, and sometimes a few cutting edge brands that are not well known, but represent new technology not otherwise available.

This all adds up to high inventory costs, difficult training for sales people,and confusion in the marketplace.

Few things make me as happy as when a manufacturer tells me they've discontinued a product.

 

[Mike Pailliotet]

the apology line starts being Fred.



Bring rations.

 

[sweendogg]

While I await Mikey's sincere apology, I'll try to answer David's question that is also a constant frustration for me as a supply store owner: Duplicate products.

When I was shipping products for our supply business after school in the mid 70's, we had one traffic lane cleaner, two detergents for carpet (liquid and powder), two deodorizers (perfume one and liquid oxidizer......yes way back then), a soil retardant, an antistatic spray, browning treatment, upholstery shampoo, dry cleaning solvent, a few spotters, and that was about it for the entire supply business.

Over time, manufacturers introduce new products that SHOULD replace their old ones, but the long time users of those products resist changing, so you have an "old" product and a "new product". About the only thing that kills an "old" product anymore is lack of available raw ingredients; although some manufacturers change the formula and not the name and label. Then there is a "newer" product to replace the last "new product", but those users won't change using the first new product, so now you have three products.

Of course then there are new products for new problems: Olefin cleaners, Haitian Cotton Cleaners (dying out as I type this) Red Dye Removers, safer "wet side" upholstery products, enzyme deodorizers, "Green Products" etc.
Now remember, this is all within one brand.

Add to the fact that very few distributors are "single brand" companies, but strive to carry the most popular "name brands" for their customers, and sometimes a few cutting edge brands that are not well known, but represent new technology not otherwise available.

This all adds up to high inventory costs, difficult training for sales people,and confusion in the marketplace.

Few things make me as happy as when a manufacturer tells me they've discontinued a product.

So it sounds like the frustration to have umpteen products is a shared opinion amonst distributers and cleaners alike.

 

[Jim Pemberton]

Mike, should you decide to make the appropriate acts of contrition, I'll need to know if you want to know what I'd recommend an experienced owner operator to put on their truck, or a system for employees not under the constant scrutiny of the owner on the job.

 

[Mike Pailliotet]

Please do both Jim.

Can't be that different can they?

 

[Jim Pemberton]

Owner ops are more likely to be able to use single products for multiple uses. Employees usually need products labled for the purpose they are to be used for.

OK, first I could be very happy with Scott's list. Its remarkably spare considering the breadth of the BP line.

I'll list what I'd use based on what I know about products as a "sort of owner op", with some other variables:


1. I like to base most of my cleaning around a single prespray that I feel rinses well with clear, soft water. I find Zone Perfecct to be one of the most "complete" products I've used because it has solvents and a fairly sophisticated surfactant system to remove the widest range of soils and spots. I tend to use Soap Free a bit more, as it has no odor, and while it lacks the surfactant system, it works well with the high heat and soft water system I prefer to rinse with. Both products can be boosted with Citrus Solv or equivalent products, or any of the non chlorine bleach additives, such as Boost All.

2. If my market included a lot of commercial olefin carpet, I'd consider Traffic Slam or Olefin Preclean, but would probably use Renovate at an ounce or two per gallon of water, and boost it with Boost All or equivalent. That said, the surfactant system in all of three products rinse better with an acid rinse or acid rinse detergent. My favorite is End Zone, but most of the "fiber rinses" would work as well.

There are stronger presprays, but I'd avoid cleaning "grease traps" myself.

More later.

 

[Jim Pemberton]

I don't use many water based spotters, as such spots usually come out with the above mentioned products.

I like to have a volatile solvent (BP All Solv my favorite), a gel solvent (Prosolv Gel, but I wish it were more consistent and had a longer shelf life), and an ink/non volatile product that I don't use often, but like having around when I need it (BP PIG or OINK)

Stain Magic seems to work better for me than Stain Zone, or I could do the ammonia/hydrogen peroxide thing too. I like the security of the MSDS and labeled directions, having been in a pretty nasty and nearly VERY expensive chemical product liability suit once.

I've used Red Zone, Red One, and Red Relief with nearly the same results. I think inconsistencies in the carpet and pre-existing residues are more to blame for variable results in such products than the products' formulations.

Any other "spot removers" (Protein, Tannin, Neutral, etc) would be more for wool carpet, area rugs, and upholstery. I'm still a fan of a very "old" product, Perky Spotter.

To be continued........

 

[Jeremy]

Castrol Superclean
Hydrogen Peroxide
STP
Fels Naptha
Ammonia
Vinegar

That's all you get till I get a mea culpa for your continual mental cruelty

You forgot MSG!

& Vodka...

 

[harryhides]

Jim you forgot Pert shampoo and Procyon......

And for wool, may I recommend Orvus and product used by animals lovers to wash their show, goats, horses, dogs and chickens.

 

[Lee Stockwell]

WD-40, not STP.

 

[gary mackay]

I thought you had a question?

 

[Desk Jockey]

Mikey called me a whore

Ask me nicer and I might answer......

 

[Lee Stockwell]

Call him a lawyer.....same difference, just vertical.

 

[Jim Pemberton]

Call me a lawyer and I'm leaving for good.

Don't give Mikey such evil ideas Lee.

 

[ruff]

Jim you forgot Pert shampoo and Procyon......

And for wool, may I recommend Orvus and product used by animals lovers to wash their show, goats, horses, dogs and chickens.

Tony,
Do you use Orvus?
If yes, how do you apply? Prespray or in line?
What do you rinse it with?
Any issues with residue. Can you run it through the machine as far as corrosion, build up in equipment etc?

Do you find it better than the "WoolSafe" products in the market?
Thanks,
Ofer

 

[Desk Jockey]

We use to use Orvus in our commercial washer.

 

[John Olson]

MaxPac or Ultra Pac work nearly the same smell different
Extreme Clean and Power Strike. Exteme smells better but Power Strike rocks on really trashed.
Energy. With Energy you turn any of the above into a olefin cleaner.
All fiber deep clean. With this you really don't need to change your rinse emulsifier.
OSR
Odorcide
Steam Way's upholstery pre-spray.
Prochem fine fabric pre-spray and fine fabric shampoo
CTI's SM,RR, and Stain One,ink out and pro solv/power gel,urine stain remover
Steam Way 301
Steam Way 501
Prochem tile and grout and restoration
sure seal
Prochem axiom pre-spray/ rinse just incase
I'm sure I'm missing something but I'm posting while eating apple jacks with my son.