Optimizing Suction

[Joseph225]

Equipment:

Sapphire 570
Mytee Airhog filter
2" suction hose
Just put Cool Cuffs on the suction hose last night

So when I cap the suction off directly at the machine, I get 14 in/Hg. There's approximately an 8-foot section running to my filter, and when I cap it off at the filter, it will start at about 12 in/Hg, and slowly run up to about 13.5 in/Hg. When I've got a couple of sections of hose on, it will sit somewhere around 12, 12.5. I replaced all my Mytee Cuff Lynx (they're 8 years old) last night with the Cool Cuffs, hoping for a little improvement, but no joy.

What else can I do to optimize the suction, here?

 

[Mikey P]

1. Dont worry about it

Or...

2. Use a Devastator filter instead, set your lift with 100 ft of hose and your wand on some carpet.

 

[Joseph225]

Never even considered setting it with the wand on the carpet. I'd figured you were just supposed to cap at the machine, for that.

 

[Mikey P]

Never even considered setting it with the wand on the carpet. I'd figured you were just supposed to cap at the machine, for that.

It's the blower and motor can safely run at 14 in of lift than why not set it as you always use it, with 100 ft hose attached?

 

[Joseph225]

No, it makes perfect sense, now that I think about it that way. Thanks.

 

[Joseph225]

It's the blower and motor can safely run at 14 in of lift than why not set it as you always use it, with 100 ft hose attached?

This made sense, initially, but after talking to a few people, a part of me wonders why you'd even say this. This (in/HG vs. CFM, and the relationship between the two) is a remarkably complex issue, and your suggestion feels like a good recipe for destroying a TM pretty quickly.


So, my current understanding of the situation is that you set the in/Hg with it capped off directly at the machine. 14 in/Hg is the upper limit for the SS570 that the people at Sapphire are willing to "allow". My problems seem to be twofold at this point, mainly with restrictions causing issues, and reducing airflow. I'm using 2" hose all the way to the wand, and a Mytee Air Hog filter.
While on the phone with Scott Harlib at Legend Brands, yesterday, we did a bit of benchmarking. He said that normally, with no hose attached to the machine, your in/Hg should be somewhere in the vicinity of 3. When you add a single section of 50' hose to the equation, it should go up to 5, maybe 6. After doing a little checking, it was determined that the filters located in the waste tank right before the blower were pretty dirty. I'd put a mesh filter bag over them some time back, and forgotten about them. Turns out a bunch of stuff made it through the mesh bag that was caught by the stainless steel mesh. A good cleaning later with the Hydroforce and a wire brush, and you could see light through them.
At this point, my lift with one section of hose went from 10.5 down to 9, still WAY too much, and we were unable to find a reason, so I got off the phone and started checking every section of hose I have. Turns out that several years ago I'd purchased two more sections of hose from Jon-Don, and it was different (stiffer and less flexible) than the stuff that came with my machine from Interlink/Aramsco. The stiffer sections had less restriction when hooked up to the machine, coming in around 7, 7.5 instead of the 9 with the soft hose. That's still higher than what Scott thought it should be, but I wonder how much of that is due to my Kunkle valve being cranked up to 14 in/Hg.
I then switched up the way the hose went on, using those two stiffer sections to clean, yesterday. I have to admit, I'm a little surprised at the difference in airflow, and water extraction. My wand is a Devastator with the hole glides, and it was legitimately SCREAMING when I'd lift it off of the carpet, it had so much air flowing. I'm VERY pleased with the difference.
That being said, I still have questions. What's the best/stiffest suction hose? I've looked up the Devastator Filter, and will be getting in touch with Thomas about it. Are there any other factors I should be thinking about?

 

[Joseph225]

So, my current understanding of the situation is that you set the in/Hg with it capped off directly at the machine. 14 in/Hg is the upper limit for the SS570 that the people at Sapphire are willing to "allow". My problems seem to be twofold at this point, mainly with restrictions causing issues, and reducing airflow. I'm using 2" hose all the way to the wand, and a Mytee Air Hog filter.
While on the phone with Scott Harlib at Legend Brands, yesterday, we did a bit of benchmarking. He said that normally, with no hose attached to the machine, your in/Hg should be somewhere in the vicinity of 3. When you add a single section of 50' hose to the equation, it should go up to 5, maybe 6. After doing a little checking, it was determined that the filters located in the waste tank right before the blower were pretty dirty. I'd put a mesh filter bag over them some time back, and forgotten about them. Turns out a bunch of stuff made it through the mesh bag that was caught by the stainless steel mesh. A good cleaning later with the Hydroforce and a wire brush, and you could see light through them.
At this point, my lift with one section of hose went from 10.5 down to 9, still WAY too much, and we were unable to find a reason, so I got off the phone and started checking every section of hose I have. Turns out that several years ago I'd purchased two more sections of hose from Jon-Don, and it was different (stiffer and less flexible) than the stuff that came with my machine from Interlink/Aramsco. The stiffer sections had less restriction when hooked up to the machine, coming in around 7, 7.5 instead of the 9 with the soft hose. That's still higher than what Scott thought it should be, but I wonder how much of that is due to my Kunkle valve being cranked up to 14 in/Hg.
I then switched up the way the hose went on, using those two stiffer sections to clean, yesterday. I have to admit, I'm a little surprised at the difference in airflow, and water extraction. My wand is a Devastator with the hole glides, and it was legitimately SCREAMING when I'd lift it off of the carpet, it had so much air flowing. I'm VERY pleased with the difference.
That being said, I still have questions. What's the best/stiffest suction hose? I've looked up the Devastator Filter, and will be getting in touch with Thomas about it. Are there any other factors I should be thinking about?

 

[Mikey P]

your suggestion feels like a good recipe for destroying a TM pretty quickly.

how would running my TM at 13-14" of lift when the wand is on the carpet, 100 ft out destroy the machine?


now if some idiot were to completely block off the vac port at the inlet and let it run at 3100 rpms for too long, well maybe....

 

[Mikey P]

oh, damn, I didnt know that was you Mr Rogers..



Dude your website blows, hire @Hoody

 

[Mikey P]

call Olson, he has the best vac hose

 

[Joseph225]

how would running my TM at 13-14" of lift when the wand is on the carpet, 100 ft out destroy the machine?


now if some idiot were to completely block off the vac port at the inlet and let it run at 3100 rpms for too long, well maybe....

Am I misunderstanding something, or are you not supposed to cap it off at the port, at the end of the job, spray WD-40 into the blower lube port, and let it run for two minutes? If I've got it set for 14 in/Hg on the carpet, when I cap it off at the machine, there's no telling what that's gonna go up to.

Are you telling me you really run your machine this way? I can never tell with you, man. I think you like to screw with people too much, and it's hard to take you seriously.

 

[Mikey P]

Am I misunderstanding something, or are you not supposed to cap it off at the port, at the end of the job, spray WD-40 into the blower lube port, and let it run for two minutes? If I've got it set for 14 in/Hg on the carpet, when I cap it off at the machine, there's no telling what that's gonna go up to.

Are you telling me you really run your machine this way? I can never tell with you, man. I think you like to screw with people too much, and it's hard to take you seriously.

I'll cover my inlet with my hand or a 6# jug lid about 50% and spray WD right into the vac relief mechanism. I dont use the port on the face of the unit as I dont feel most of the lube ever makes it to the blower via that path.

I may screw with you/people about meaningless stuff like politics and religion but never your business livelihood.

 

[Mikey P]

and no, dont let any truckmount run for any length of time completely blocked off....jeepers.


Run it totally unrestricted at the end of your route to let moisture evaporate out of your blower and HX


and just lube it with WD on the last day of your work week, too much of that shit will gum up the blower and HX


If you're taking more than 3 days off crack your waste tank lid and open your drain port too..

 

[Cleanworks]

So, my current understanding of the situation is that you set the in/Hg with it capped off directly at the machine. 14 in/Hg is the upper limit for the SS570 that the people at Sapphire are willing to "allow". My problems seem to be twofold at this point, mainly with restrictions causing issues, and reducing airflow. I'm using 2" hose all the way to the wand, and a Mytee Air Hog filter.
While on the phone with Scott Harlib at Legend Brands, yesterday, we did a bit of benchmarking. He said that normally, with no hose attached to the machine, your in/Hg should be somewhere in the vicinity of 3. When you add a single section of 50' hose to the equation, it should go up to 5, maybe 6. After doing a little checking, it was determined that the filters located in the waste tank right before the blower were pretty dirty. I'd put a mesh filter bag over them some time back, and forgotten about them. Turns out a bunch of stuff made it through the mesh bag that was caught by the stainless steel mesh. A good cleaning later with the Hydroforce and a wire brush, and you could see light through them.
At this point, my lift with one section of hose went from 10.5 down to 9, still WAY too much, and we were unable to find a reason, so I got off the phone and started checking every section of hose I have. Turns out that several years ago I'd purchased two more sections of hose from Jon-Don, and it was different (stiffer and less flexible) than the stuff that came with my machine from Interlink/Aramsco. The stiffer sections had less restriction when hooked up to the machine, coming in around 7, 7.5 instead of the 9 with the soft hose. That's still higher than what Scott thought it should be, but I wonder how much of that is due to my Kunkle valve being cranked up to 14 in/Hg.
I then switched up the way the hose went on, using those two stiffer sections to clean, yesterday. I have to admit, I'm a little surprised at the difference in airflow, and water extraction. My wand is a Devastator with the hole glides, and it was legitimately SCREAMING when I'd lift it off of the carpet, it had so much air flowing. I'm VERY pleased with the difference.
That being said, I still have questions. What's the best/stiffest suction hose? I've looked up the Devastator Filter, and will be getting in touch with Thomas about it. Are there any other factors I should be thinking about?

I'm not sure the stiffness of the hose has anything to do with it, unless it's collapsing. You may have debris built up inside the hose. Periodically, I run a line jet through my vac hose, hooked up to a powerwasher. You would be amazed at the gunk that comes out.

 

[scotty747]

I have one 20 ft section of hose that kills vac flow more than adding another 50 of my regular hose.

 

[Mikey P]

I have one 20 ft section of hose that kills vac flow more than adding another 50 of my regular hose.

remove the rodent.

 

[BIG WOOD]

14hg being too much??? No way

 

[Joseph225]

I'm not sure the stiffness of the hose has anything to do with it, unless it's collapsing. You may have debris built up inside the hose. Periodically, I run a line jet through my vac hose, hooked up to a powerwasher. You would be amazed at the gunk that comes out.

I did this, the other day. Got in touch with a friend that does power washing, and was like "What the hell is a line jet?". We met up on Sunday, and that thing was cool as hell...it would shoot through 50 feet of hose in about two seconds.

 

[Joseph225]

Follow up:

After discussion here, and with Scott Harlib at Legend Brands, my dry times have improved, MASSIVELY. I'm really surprised at the difference some of this has made.

Does anyone run 2.5" hose, in any fashion, on their machines? I've been trying to visualize if running from the 2.5" port to my filter would improve airflow, at all. It seems like it MIGHT...but there's still gonna be 2" hose in the equation, so I don't know...

 

[Cleanworks]

Follow up:

After discussion here, and with Scott Harlib at Legend Brands, my dry times have improved, MASSIVELY. I'm really surprised at the difference some of this has made.

Does anyone run 2.5" hose, in any fashion, on their machines? I've been trying to visualize if running from the 2.5" port to my filter would improve airflow, at all. It seems like it MIGHT...but there's still gonna be 2" hose in the equation, so I don't know...

Many people are running a 50 ft length from the truck to their filter. It has the effect of moving the blower closer as you don't have as much suction or airflow loss. Alternatively, you can run 4 to the door. If you have 2-2 inch outlets on your waste tank, you run 25-50 ft to either your filter or to a y connection. It has the same effect. Great on long hose runs, you may not notice much difference under 150 feet. You have to judge if the additional work is worth it.

 

[Lee Stockwell]

Overthunk

 

[Joseph225]

Many people are running a 50 ft length from the truck to their filter. It has the effect of moving the blower closer as you don't have as much suction or airflow loss. Alternatively, you can run 4 to the door. If you have 2-2 inch outlets on your waste tank, you run 25-50 ft to either your filter or to a y connection. It has the same effect. Great on long hose runs, you may not notice much difference under 150 feet. You have to judge if the additional work is worth it.

I've done 2 hose runs to a y connector before, it was usually only on one job that I needed it, because of the amount of hose necessary. Thanks for the breakdown.