Square Footage Discount

[tmiklethun]

Call me names all you want....but no hacking here and it works for us.

Perhaps I came off a bit short in my response. If it were us, the 'prequalify" would have been (under the assumption that we knew it was a property that was larger than the typical ones we get from this particular realtor). "Thanks for the opportunity. This property is a bit different then the work we have done for you in the past. I'd like to take some time to review the cost for a property like this since it's a different scope then we are both used to working with. Can we discuss this now or would you like me to send you an estimate via email?"

While I agree with you in theory, in application with Realtors it just doesn't always work this way. This particular house was one of the last minute it has to be done on this day. I didn't have the time available to send an email estimate and wait for a response and she wasn't available for a phone call at the time I started.

 

[Newman]

Hey Travis, did you charge this Realtor the same rate PSF as you have in the past for the condos?

 

[tmdry]

Did I read it right it takes you guys 1 hour to do 2 staircases?

 

[Desk Jockey]

After cleaning 2800 sq/ft I'm guessing 30-minutes a flight. 10-15 normally but my ass will be dragging after cleaning that much carpet by myself without an RE.

 

[Able 1]

Did I read it right it takes you guys 1 hour to do 2 staircases?

2 minuets a step you guy's crack me up!!! With my cut down ti wand I can do a set in 5-10mins.. For stairs I do four treads down, then go back up and do the four risers, then go back down with the nose of the stair... What else can you do to it?

 

[tmiklethun]

Hey Travis, did you charge this Realtor the same rate PSF as you have in the past for the condos?

Yes. with discount it came to about 25.5 cents a square foot and $3.00 a step.

 

[Desk Jockey]

2 minuets a step you guy's crack me up!!! With my cut down ti wand I can do a set in 5-10mins.. For stairs I do four treads down, then go back up and do the four risers, then go back down with the nose of the stair... What else can you do to it?

I prefer to prespray the steps, agitate the bullnose, clean all the treads and then extract the risers, taking time to ensure the bullnose gets vacuumed well. The extra wide tool that John Olsen sells makes stairs easier by covering more area and its used on nearly all stairs unless they are spiral or cut down then we might go back to the PC tool.

 

[Desk Jockey]

Yes. with discount it came to about 25.5 cents a square foot and $3.00 a step.

I don't think there is any problem with that rate. In fact we would be more expensive and have finished in about half the time with a (2) man crew.

If she knew your rate, its really a bit unfair of her to think it would be much different from your already discounted vacant rate.

The only thing we would have done different is asked if she need an amount and would have either given an onsite estimate or ball parked it off the numbers she gave. I just hate the "after the fact" issues and would rather be proactive in heading off a misunderstanding, especially one that comes "after the fact".

 

[Barry-QDCC]

I would hit that for $500 and it would take me just under 3 hours.. 7 f'n hours Wtf were you doing?

Well shit I guess I was doing the cleaning steps right. Are you really claiming that your production rate is 1000 sq ft an hour? Is your wand even touching the carpet or are you just splashing and dashing? You would have to be moving the wand faster then most people vacuum to get your production rate. Some of these comments are like a $50 hooker promising to make you nut quicker. Quicker isn't always better!

My process on this job was: Prespray, dwell time, agitation, rinse baseboard, vacuum edge of carpet, hot water extraction, groom. Dwell time is about 10 minutes a room, during this time I post grooming the previous room and pre-spotting the next room. I also do not rush the wand on the carpet, I am trying to clean more then just the tip.

I realize this was an empty so in this case maybe amount of time on the job doesn't really come into play, but most customers IMHO would NOT want you to take 7 hours to clean their 2800 sq/ft house. I think they'd start wondering around the 4 hours mark about "when is that carpet cleaner going to get the hell out of here?!"

 

[Shane Deubell]

Yeah after about 2.5- 3 hours people want you OUT!

 

[tmiklethun]

I realize this was an empty so in this case maybe amount of time on the job doesn't really come into play, but most customers IMHO would NOT want you to take 7 hours to clean their 2800 sq/ft house. I think they'd start wondering around the 4 hours mark about "when is that carpet cleaner going to get the hell out of here?!"

Actually I typically hear the opposite. I normally get a "Thanks for not rushing the job". Probably about half of my clients don't hang out while I am cleaning though. They are there to let me in, sign the invoice ect and then go run errands and I call them 30 minutes before I am done.

It should also be noted that this is not my standard size house. According to Service Monster my average invoice is $262.00. Those jobs would take me 2 - 2.5 hours on average to complete. They are also about 1/3 of the size of this house.

 

[Desk Jockey]

2800 sq/ft divided by lets say 6-hours is 466 sq/ft an hour. That's about what I'd expect furnished production to be. Not going around the furniture but moving all the movable contents within reason.

BUTT we are two man crews so I do think as a single operator fatigue would be a factor....it would for me. 7-hours behind a wand, heck even a Cimex and I'm toast.

With most homes we see being comprised of 70% light soiling and 30% moderate, I don't think going to fast really plays into it. As long as we focus most of our efforts on the moderate soiled areas, I think cleaning as fast as a vacuum in the less soiled areas is sufficient. We do prevacuum also!

At least I'm never seen or heard that as a complaint and we do get 6-8 quality control cards back a week. I guess if they were indifferent they might not send it back. However I'd like to think if they were unhappy they would.

 

[tmiklethun]

Thanks to all who commenting. I ended up offering as a courtesy discount and additional $80.00 off the invoice, since I did not verify the price. I also cleared up the square footage charge moving forward. She seemed thankful, but I honestly don't know if I will keep this client. If she chooses to go elsewhere I am ok with that.

During this process she sent me a copy of the previous guys invoice and it spawned another questions in my mind for the per room guys. I would like to know how many rooms you would consider this house to be. I don't do per room pricing, but I think the guys who normally cap room size at 200 sq ft. So my room count for the below rooms would be 20 rooms. This guy charges $30 buck a room, but only charged for 16 rooms. If you do per room pricing how many rooms would you consider this to be?

Living / Dining 360 sq ft
Family Room 224 sq ft
Game Room 500 sq ft
Master Bed 315 sq ft
Master Bed Sitting 150 sq ft
Master Closet 126 sq ft
Bedroom 2 168 sq ft
Bedroom 3 195 sq ft
Bedroom 4 156 sq ft
Loft 315 sq ft
Den 144 sq ft
Hall 170 sq ft
Stairs 1 16 steps
Stairs 2 16 steps with 2 landings

 

[tmiklethun]

2800 sq/ft divided by lets say 6-hours is 466 sq/ft an hour. That's about what I'd expect furnished production to be. Not going around the furniture but moving all the movable contents within reason.

BUTT we are two man crews so I do think as a single operator fatigue would be a factor....it would for me. 7-hours behind a wand, heck even a Cimex and I'm toast.

With most homes we see being comprised of 70% light soiling and 30% moderate, I don't think going to fast really plays into it. As long as we focus most of our efforts on the moderate soiled areas, I think cleaning as fast as a vacuum in the less soiled areas is sufficient. We do prevacuum also!

At least I'm never seen or heard that as a complaint and we do get 6-8 quality control cards back a week. I guess if they were indifferent they might not send it back. However I'd like to think if they were unhappy they would.

Not fatigue so much, but no doubt a two man crew would of been much faster. Some other guy prespraying in front of me and grooming behind me would easily double my production rate. My business is not consistent enough yet to hire someone though. I am curious though Doc, with a helper your production will go up but so do expenses. So besides getting more work done do you find a helper allows you to lower your prices, makes you raise your prices or keep prices consistent and just increase productivity? Thanks

 

[Desk Jockey]

I think it was probably the right thing to do. From here you decide if you really want her or not.

 

[Desk Jockey]

I am curious though Doc, with a helper your production will go up but so do expenses. So besides getting more work done do you find a helper allows you to lower your prices, makes you raise your prices or keep prices consistent and just increase productivity? Thanks

It forces you to hold firm to your price.

We normally charge .35 sq/ft and 3.50 for average steps but like you we would have give a vacant rate of .28 (2800x.28=$784.00 plus $112.00 for steps. Total $896.00

2 men x 4.5 hours = 9 man hours

$896.00/9 =$99.56 *An average that is lower than yours but they still have half a day left to go.

I think a helper is worth the expense, yes you are giving away some but if nothing else you are sparing your body. Not only does the work go faster but I think you'll enjoy your job more having someone there not just to help but also to talk to.

The key is sharing the wand, trade off on rooms or trade off on homes if they are smaller but let the fresh guy clean until he needs a break.

 

[Barry-QDCC]

Thanks to all who commenting. I ended up offering as a courtesy discount and additional $80.00 off the invoice, since I did not verify the price. I also cleared up the square footage charge moving forward. She seemed thankful, but I honestly don't know if I will keep this client. If she chooses to go elsewhere I am ok with that.

During this process she sent me a copy of the previous guys invoice and it spawned another questions in my mind for the per room guys. I would like to know how many rooms you would consider this house to be. I don't do per room pricing, but I think the guys who normally cap room size at 200 sq ft. So my room count for the below rooms would be 20 rooms. This guy charges $30 buck a room, but only charged for 16 rooms. If you do per room pricing how many rooms would you consider this to be?

Living / Dining 360 sq ft
Family Room 224 sq ft
Game Room 500 sq ft
Master Bed 315 sq ft
Master Bed Sitting 150 sq ft
Master Closet 126 sq ft
Bedroom 2 168 sq ft
Bedroom 3 195 sq ft
Bedroom 4 156 sq ft
Loft 315 sq ft
Den 144 sq ft
Hall 170 sq ft
Stairs 1 16 steps
Stairs 2 16 steps with 2 landings

Well, now that you posted that, I probably came at you harder than I should have. It's not a 2800 sq/ft house as I was figuring, it's got 2800 sq/ft of carpeting so it's like maybe a 4000- 6000 sq/ft house or something along those lines. You only have one hall of 170 sq/ft so I'm guessing there must be a significant amount of hard surfacing around there. So I apologize for not reading your original posting close enough. Totally my fault.

In our current pricing model my price for that would be $690. I price by the room. I'm a one man band and I'd anticipate about 5 hours to do, maybe 6. Really dirty, abused carpet would cost more if it was thru out the house.

This is the internet. Just like jokes don't always work so well on the net, so can other things, such as details in a situation, get mis-understood also.

Good luck!

 

[tmiklethun]

Well, now that you posted that, I probably came at you harder than I should have. It's not a 2800 sq/ft house as I was figuring, it's got 2800 sq/ft of carpeting so it's like maybe a 4000- 6000 sq/ft house or something along those lines. You only have one hall of 170 sq/ft so I'm guessing there must be a significant amount of hard surfacing around there. So I apologize for not reading your original posting close enough. Totally my fault.

In our current pricing model my price for that would be $690. I price by the room. I'm a one man band and I'd anticipate about 5 hours to do, maybe 6. Really dirty, abused carpet would cost more if it was thru out the house.

This is the internet. Just like jokes don't always work so well on the net, so can other things, such as details in a situation, get mis-understood also.

Good luck!

Thanks and no problem at all.

 

[Barry-QDCC]

Thanks and no problem at all.

I should also say since I am a one man band, whether it was a 5 or 6 or 7 or 8 hours job - that would be the only one I did that day. I'd be happy with almost $700 in my pocket as my expenses are very low. I work out of my house - no $1200 a month TM payment or anything else. All my equipment is paid for.

Maybe I'm not hungry enough want to do more jobs in a day. I like starting at 9:00am and being done by 3:00pm or so and having $600 in my pocket.

When I had my multi-van company I would have a different opinion on sales of $700 for the day!

 

[lust1kiddo]

Hey man..you did a great job. I would charge them 2500 for that .

 

[ruff]

It forces you to hold firm to your price.

We normally charge .35 sq/ft and 3.50 for average steps but like you we would have give a vacant rate of .28 (2800x.28=$784.00 plus $112.00 for steps. Total $896.00

If that's what yokel carpet cleaning charges.
Damn!
I need to raise my prices!

 

[tmdry]

I would not worry about her if all she wants is the cheapest guy, if she won't get over what the other guy charged knowing you own a business that cleans carpet, and every business has different overhead, than drop her.

Her business is to sell homes, it requires investing in advertising, paying for services in most cases, catering, gas, etc...it's overhead, and we all have different costs. It has zero to do w/ "well the other guy charges this.."

Like Richard mentioned adding a helper can cut the time in half and save your back, if you can't hire a helper, than hire him part to full time on commission only. You may not always get more jobs w/ a helper, but it'll be worth in the end if you have large homes and or several jobs a day in a hot summer day.