Tan carpet melted into a white blob

[Brian H]

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The customer's house keeper noticed the spot a week or so after we cleaned for her.

14 year old builder's grade carpet belonging to a very elderly couple. He uses a walker to get around and this is in the main hallway to the master bedroom.

I thought at first that it was a blob of some type of glue or chalk, but I don't think so any more. It is very hard and does not flake at all. The more I worked at it, the more I am inclined to believe that it's melted. On a couple of the pictures you can even see the primary backing.

Any thoughts on what it could be?

 

[Brian H]

I did a bit more research after posting and discovered that her toilet bowl cleaner, The Works, looks to be the culprit! Of course it has chlorine bleach and it also has hydrochloric acid.

In 32 years of being in the business, have never seen that type of damage. Anyone else ever seen something like this?

 

[Zee]

I did a bit more research after posting and discovered that her toilet bowl cleaner, The Works, looks to be the culprit! Of course it has chlorine bleach and it also has hydrochloric acid.

In 32 years of being in the business, have never seen that type of damage. Anyone else ever seen something like this?

Test the bowl cleaner with a piece of the same exact carpet? That is what I would do to make sure it is what it is.

 

[FredC]

never seen it myself...........lots of stories about "the works" eating carpet on the web...couldn't find any images though

 

[D Rice]

I'll bet the house keeper did notice it right after she carried the bowl brush down the hallway. The WORKS toilet bowl cleaner is very thin and I'm sure it would be real easy to get sloppy with.

 

[Dolly Llama]

I did a bit more research after posting and discovered that her toilet bowl cleaner, The Works, looks to be the culprit! Of course it has chlorine bleach and it also has hydrochloric acid.

in the "ole days" we used an awful lot of hydrochloric acid for rust...never seen it melt a carpet, have you?

looks like paint to me.
from the same yo-yo that painted the base boards.
Look at the carpet next to base boards in the pic


..L.T.A.

 

[Dolly Llama]

the pic with the pen

look at the base board left of the door jamb
Looks like the painter got paint on the carpet while painting the base board

my magic 8 ball says that's paint spot on the floor
(CAUSE that's what it looks like)

Put some lacquer thinner on a towel and work that spot
I got a dollar that says you'll get some white color transfer


..L.T.A.

 

[FredC]

just had the wife pick some up...

Not sure if I have any nylon around though

 

[Jim Pemberton]

I've seen toilet bowl cleaner do the exact thing Brian.

 

[Brian H]

in the "ole days" we used an awful lot of hydrochloric acid for rust...never seen it melt a carpet, have you?

..L.T.A.

I don't know that I have ever hear of using hydrochloric acid on rust stains. Are you sure you don't mean hydrofluoric acid?

Looks like paint to me.
from the same yo-yo that painted the base boards.
Look at the carpet next to base boards in the pic

Definitely not paint!! There is no paint anywhere on the carpet, the picture is a bit unclear.

 

[KevinD]

in the "ole days" we used an awful lot of hydrochloric acid for rust...never seen it melt a carpet, have you?

looks like paint to me.
from the same yo-yo that painted the base boards.
Look at the carpet next to base boards in the pic


..L.T.A.

I believe you are thinking about hydrofluoric acid like erusticator.
Hydrochloric acid will melt and damage carpet fibers.

 

[Lee Stockwell]

Odd, usually substantially reduces the bulk of the affected fiber. Yes I've done it, as well as dissolving fiber with acetone. Each dissolve fiber, makes it go away.


One vote for Larry.

 

[Desk Jockey]

Back in our early days we had several buildings we did janitorial work for. Had an employee drip bowl cleaner on commercial carpet and it melted it all the way to the backing. Turning brown carpet to a carpetless melted yellow spot.

 

[Brian H]

I've seen toilet bowl cleaner do the exact thing Brian.

Thanks for the confirmation Jim.

Being that it was right outside her bathroom, I wondered if it might be toilet bowl cleaner. I had never experienced anything like that before though and told the home owner I would research it for her. looks like a permanent section is in the future for her.

 

[Jim Pemberton]

You see some crazy stuff doing carpet inspections. It was more common in the days where bathrooms were routinely carpeted and nylon was the fiber of choice.

 

[FredC]

Evaporated the blue nylon down to the backing almost instantly

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guess I need to dilute to actually recreate the problem..

 

[Dolly Llama]

I don't know that I have ever hear of using hydrochloric acid on rust stains. Are you sure you don't mean hydrofluoric acid?

DUH....



here's some chit I had on hand








the Lysol is kid stuff...didn't do anything but make it blue (the color it comes out of the bottle)







this stuff is a "little" hotter apparently









that's been dwelling for 10-15 min

The other areas I poured some on I wiped after a couple minutes and fibers came off



I just poured some more on an area appx the size of your spot.
I'll let it dry and see what we have


It's damn sure ruining the fiber, but doesn't look anything like your pic


..L.T.A.

 

[FredC]

It's damn sure ruining the fiber, but doesn't look anything like your pic


..L.T.A.

same...I brought the sock, towel, and brush out because I thought it might have been something dropped or used to try and get it up that melted into the fibers ...but couldn't get it to do it.

did get the melted look

 

[Jim Pemberton]

You guys could be right, I could be wrong. I just embarrassed myself a few times trying to remove "white paint" from carpet only to find it was bowl cleaner.

the stain color seems to vary with the color of the carpet, how it was dyed, any dye that might be in the bowl cleaner.

...or it could be paint and I'm in left field here.

 

[FredC]

I think its "the works"

At full strength the dye let go and the fibers melted within seconds.

more dilute solutions like would be expected to drip off the toilet brush yielded the melted look....especially when dabbed on with a shop towel.

I don't have any beige nylon to test to see if it would leave the white.........and it may have came from another source


I'll check the samples again tomorrow

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[Dolly Llama]

You guys could be right, I could be wrong. I just embarrassed myself a few times trying to remove "white paint" from carpet only to find it was bowl cleaner.

the stain color seems to vary with the color of the carpet, how it was dyed, any dye that might be in the bowl cleaner.

...or it could be paint and I'm in left field here.

any number of aggressive solvents on a towel would easily determine if cured paint or not .
You'll get color transfer on a towel pretty quick .
i know you'd know that, Jim , having spent time cleaning .

But i don't know if Brain was ever a "real" cleaner or just a sissy boy office manager with "book smArtz" .....



..L.T.A.

 

[Able 1]

Looks like paint to me.. I tested some Works cleaner(not the unclog) stuff on Nylon and nothing.. If it builders grade wouldn't it be crappy Poly? I'll do some more testing tomorrow, but in the pic it looks like paint to me..

 

[bob vawter]

ahhh Larr...Joanie's gonna kick yor azz when she gets home.......

 

[Brian H]

But i don't know if Brain was ever a "real" cleaner or just a sissy boy office manager with "book smArtz" .....



..L.T.A.

Thanks Larry!!

I think I have seen a few problem over the years with carpet. Prior to the IICRC days, I even did inspections for a few years for some big retailers in the area. I would bet that I have probably seen more odd ball stuff in my 30 plus years of being a "sissy boy office manager" then you have being a full time cleaner.

Oh and if you read my initial post, paint doesn't just show up when the house keeper is there. While there, I smelled the spot and it did have a distinct odor and it wasn't paint. A big glob of paint will peel or flake a bit, this was a solid mass that I couldn't get my pocket knife to even penetrate.

Paint also doesn't explain the loss of fibers where the backing is showing.

I do appreciate your line of reasoning, though in this case it's a dead end.

Thanks for all your help on this one. The customer wanted to blame us, but I know that even she knew since it showed up a week or so after we cleaned that it was a stretch to think we caused it.

 

[Dolly Llama]

Thanks Larry!!

your boss (who we all love and miss) knew how to take a joke

..L.T.A.

 

[Mikey P]

Larry you better show at M10F to give Hannah a huggie.

 

[SamIam]

The hard thing is to tell if its actually indented into the carpet like a melt would be, or just sitting on top of the carpet????

I would say if its indented then ya its melted down, if its globbed on top I would think its something else!


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[SamIam]

If its something from the housekeeper could she have mixed something with the toilet bowel cleaner? Everybody's a chemist!

http://chemistry.about.com/u/sty/he...-Bleach-and-The-Works-Toilet-Bowl-Cleaner.htm


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[Brian H]

your boss (who we all love and miss) knew how to take a joke

..L.T.A.

Me too, hence the smiley face!

I have learned over the years to not take anything posted on line seriously!!

Thanks again for everyone's thoughts on this subject. I am confident that it's a toilet bowl cleaner issue and that the housekeeper was responsible.

 

[Jim Pemberton]

This has been a great thread! I appreciate the amount of people who went out and tested out bowl cleaners and posted the pictures too.

There is also a great deal of information here that readers can use for helpful information on their websites or newsletters to their customers warning them of what can happen when a product like this is spilled on carpet.