Thoughts on why IICRC non insurance driven classes and certs are down?

Nomad74

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And this is where the problem lays within the IICRC. I can’t tell you how many threads and posts I’ve seen over the years by members of the IICRC asking how to improve and grow. When people answer, they get offended and nothing changes. Start listening to your constituents.

Probably falling on deaf ears.
 

The Great Oz

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Ive been asked by some Board members to share my thoughts on why carpet, uph, rugs, odor, color etc, (non insurance mandatory) courses are down dramatically.
There haven't been any classes for close to two years, so I'd guess attendance would be down. Having on-line courses that have a higher attendance fee than in-person classes is a head scratcher, since the costs of those classes are comparatively tiny.

If the concern is why certifications are down, that's simple. The IICRC jumped the shark when the politics boiled over into public view and the temporary focus on getting more professional was tossed in favor of going back to being the insider's network. I'm sure there are great people involved, there always have been. I think most outsiders just don't care anymore.
 

sassyotto

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heres what we did back in the day. I took the IICRC courses. Then brought back both the knowledge and school manuals to the shop and integrated that into the monthly training meetings

Why should I pay a tech to go to a class in another city/state along with hotel and meals when I can teach them the same thing right here? Just to get a piece of paper nobody cares about?
 

Matt Wood

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The reason to update a certification for the industry that you are in, such as an IT Networking degree or medical, etc is due to the update in the technology of the field that's evolving and studying the new information is needed.

I don't see any evolving in carpet cleaning, tile and grout, VCT, or water mitigation, so there's no need for me to PAY to renew my certification.



The main reason I think IICRC is a douche

But...I still feel the need to take an Applied Structure Drying class because it's hands on just like the recent hard surface class up in North Carolina.
 

Jim Pemberton

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Ive been asked by some Board members to share my thoughts on why carpet, uph, rugs, odor, color etc, (non insurance mandatory) courses are down dramatically.

my replies have been:


-Very few Millennials are applying to jobs that involve actual work. Especially ones that involve dealing with piss, shit and selling to mother figures.

-Those that do, take two days to figure out that there are 1000's of other ways to make $16 an hour.

- A few companies have enough "culture", higher end client bases and can pay $20 + an hour to attract and keep a few hard workers around, but are most likely being trained in house (YTU, *** etc) for the first two years to prove commitment.

-Most IICRC teachers are can not keep millennials awake and involved so the reputation of the classes/cert suffer badly. Tom Cermak and Shawn B are the only two that bring a good amount of props to class from what I can see.
The IICRC needs to set up learning centers around the country, Vegas, Chicago, Dallas, East Coast that can be used by various teachers. These centers need to be homes or simulated homes that have all flooring and furnishing options installed, showers, counters, rugs, pet urine, mdf, oxy bleach stains, fume fading, delamination, corn rowing, soil filtration, spotter residue etc all waiting for the students. So far they have left this up to the schools, who have failed to pull it off, with the exception of a few Stone schools, who are not involved with the IICRC, yet...

- Provide continuing value to being a certified Techs or Firms. Firms should get access to (all) online standards as well as cheap online classes and testing for unproven new hires, Owner Op/techs should get serious discounts and BOTH should get my Consumer Info App.



What do you got?

You pretty much hit all of the nails on the head Mike. One of the reasons Lee wanted you as his representative is that most of the "insiders" are afraid to say the truth of the matter.

When people talk to me about training, there seems to be four categories of need:

1. New Business Start up: Guys getting into the business with zero prior experience. IICRC classes taught in the current fashion are nearly useless to these guys, as the outline and presentation makes some assumption that the person has pushed a wand before. Most guys end up working with distributor guidance or "You Tube University".

2. New Employee Training: Nearly the same as above. A company takes a new hire, with zero experience, or maybe a week or two holding hoses and helping to move furniture, and dumps them into a class for two days. There needs to be a way to help to train new hires that doesn't cost a ton of money when the guy might walk to make 15.00 an hour some place that doesn't put physical and mental demands upon them.

3. Current Employee Training: New hires are usually 20-30years old. They do not learn in a classroom setting. Making them sit through two days of Power Point slides, war stories, and old man's jokes is torture, not education. There needs to be a structure to teach these people how to improve their craft without punishing them for it.

4. Owner Operator Training: This is probably what they do the best, as an owner will tolerate old presentation techniques to get new ideas or be reminded of what they forgot to do. These folks are often 40-60 and more ready to accept the status quo, but they also have developed sensitive BS meters that go off when they hear outdated or impractical information, which most of the IICRC class material has within it.

I think that cleaners put up with a great deal of that for decades, but the double hit of the IICRC test correction failures a few years back when people couldn't get their results for months, then the Covid shut down and poorly delivered Zoom presentations has just put more nails in the coffin.

I like the "Hands On" place idea Mike. The IICRC made a nod toward that with the Applied Structure Drying courses, that essentially require a "house within a house". Whether the funds or interest to do that exist, its a format that has worked.
 

Andy

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The IICRC courses basically teach material construction and methodology not practical cleaning. The How, Where and Why with What you are cleaning is what is missing in their classes.
 

Desk Jockey

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This...



But..

We need to charge $1500 a person ( notice I did not say seat) to barely make it worth our while
Sounds like a great opportunity!

It didn't mention anything about certification. Is this not a certified course?

If not, this is an example of why I partially believe there is a decline in certification. Excellent opportunity for advanced training without the hoops of certification.
 

Tom Forsythe

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Social media has downgraded attention spans and also allows education one bit at a time. Essential questions can be quickly answered with information available on line through forums, websites, videos, blogs, e-mail, customer service reps, etc. A good local company brand along with recommendations from friends is more important than a certification unknown to consumers.
 

Jim Pemberton

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This...



But..

We need to charge $1500 a person ( notice I did not say seat) to barely make it worth our while

The Applied Structural Drying Class is around 1200.00, so there is a precedent here.

So its time to rethink this and instead of saying: "We can't afford to do the kind of training people need for 175.00" they need to say: "This is what you need, and this is why its worth 1500.00 (or more)"

Then make it worth it.

Any complaints at the 1500.00 price for what you deliver Mike?

Let me pick on "my kind" for a bit too:

Distributors and company stores are often the places that sponsor the classes. To be fair, most of those people work hard and break even or lose money on the class. But they rarely have a facility that can allow for the type of hands on training needed. That's why I teach my hands on (non certification type to be clear) class at rug cleaning plants.

I don't have the complete answer Mike, but it surely needs to be to a training system for each subject that teaches things that stick, and that are useful, and then figuring out what the trainer need to get and just market it and earn it.
 

Jim Pemberton

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I think you can make a "lowly" carpet cleaning class worth 1500.00:

What's it worth to know how to keep out of trouble?

How to talk to people like a sane human being (You know, Mikey's "minty fresh breath" routine)

To understand not just low moisture, but OP versus CRB?

All the stains and stinks that you can get out, and that you can't, and why?

How to work in a real world environment and not demolish the place or look like an idiot tripping over things?

Preventing all the damage that gets done to driveways, hard surface floors, furnishings, walls and on from stupid things you don't know how not to do until you do them

How to talk at an intelligent level about cleaning products, carpets, and soil without sounding like a half a** chemist.

You guys can keep the list going, but you can't learn this for 200.00 through a Zoom Meeting or "Death by Powerpoint"

There just has to be the will to do it, and mostly the decision not to try to do it at a supply house and not to have it taught by someone who isn't nearly qualified.
 

Jim Pemberton

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I found myself unwillingly skip reading Jim’s post. I had to force myself to read it.
I’d have the same difficulty sitting through an IICRC class.

You're right Marty

It was a rant, and when I write rants they end up just being verbose sermons.

Let me improve it:

A class that would teach you what to do when you clean carpet in the real world is worth a lot more money than one that tries to teach you to be a half a**ed chemist and textile expert, and doesn't do that well either.
 

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