Thoughts on why IICRC non insurance driven classes and certs are down?

[hogjowl]

Tell him to stop the long posts

 

[Desk Jockey]

I personally don't see how the IICRC can ever become relevant again.

I don't necessarily think it was an accumulation of their wrongs that's done them in (although they certainly have many), as it is the easy of gaining education from other sources.

The question is do you need certification from them when the vast majority of your clients don't recognize who they are.

This is despite decades of the IICRC attempting to built awareness with consumers. I don't blame them, it's a monumental task. However if over the last 40 years they couldn't do it, there is little hope that the results will change.

Why does that matter? Because that's where the true value of certification lies. With clients recognizing what certification is, it just becomes lip service with no value

You can attend equal or better training through associations, distributors, manufacturers without hindrance and requirements of a certify body.

It was a good run but I believe its days are numbered for carpet cleaners. Water damage, mold remediation may be different, but time will tell.

 

[Mikey P]

You can attend equal or better training through associations, distributors, manufacturers without hindrance and requirements of a certify body.

Can you?

 

[Desk Jockey]

Can you?

Personally? I no longer have the need.

Or are you asking if there are better options for others?

Unless things have changed in the last couple years there were many classes that are not IICRC certified classes available. COVID may have changed that, I don't actually know.

 

[hogjowl]

All you have to do is go to Saiger’s youtube
And put in earplugs

 

[Desk Jockey]

All you have to do is go to Saiger’s youtube
And put in earplugs

Or those brothers you guys are always talking about.

 

[hogjowl]

Dan still let’s you do videos?

 

[Mikey P]

Personally? I no longer have the need.

Or are you asking if there are better options for others?

Unless things have changed in the last couple years there were many classes that are not IICRC certified classes available. COVID may have changed that, I don't actually know.

Very few great in person, options

 

[Hack Attack]

Very few great in person, options

having sat through several instructors I'd say the insurance courses I've attended were actually run by the real deal and relevant, cleaning courses not so much

The cleaning courses I attended were after 20 yrs out of the industry as a refresher, I'd of been better off buying a manual.
Heard several of my classmates ask when they were going to learn how to clean? Complete newbs who got nothing out of it

 

[Nomad74]

I hear there is a new online course with Cobra Commander.

 

[FB7777]

I hear there is a new online course with Cobra Commander.

It’s called ‘Snake Oil ‘

 

[Mikey P]

It’s called ‘Snake Oil ‘

Even Marty will get that

 

[Dolly Llama]

Even Marty will get that

dayum... that's major self-esteem hit
('cause I didn't "get it")






..L.T.A.

 

[Mikey P]

160 IICRC instructors here for the annual meeting.. impressive but unfortunately the same number is the median age of them all..

 

[FB7777]

You guys gonna finish Early each day so these fossils can hit the early bird special Buffett?


oh wait, I forgot that everyone is traveling and eating on The idiots that pay for classes

 

[Mikey P]

You guys gonna finish Early each day so these fossils can hit the early bird special Buffett?


oh wait, I forgot that everyone is traveling and eating on The idiots that pay for classes

The new life forms are showing some promise, and brought a sack lunch.

 

[Lee Stockwell]

About fn time...

View attachment 110825

*expect
should be "expert"

 

[Cleanworks]

I always enjoyed the classes. It's good to be up on new information regarding carpets, backings, chemistry, etc. It's fun to network with other cleaners and see what other people are doing. That's about all you get out of it. I've never had a customer ask if I was certified, unless they thought I just escaped from the loony bin. Never received a referral from the IICRC. In fact, never received any communication from them at all. The classes are for experienced cleaners only. Newbies are lost from the get go. Most instructors teach and review to the test, making it easy for everyone to achieve near perfect scores. I appreciate work they may have done with carpet mills, etc.

 

[Dolly Llama]

It's good to be up on new information regarding carpets, backings, chemistry

you get more info here.
prime example;
What Mike (and Saiger?) is doing with porcelain tile is nothing short of great. fo-reel

cutting edge chit, Man.

..L.T.A.

 

[FB19087]

*expect
should be "expert"

the more you look the worse it gets

 

[Mikey P]

the more you look the worse it gets

Rough draft, but the motion was passed

 

[High Functioning Stoner]

what about them?
I'd expect they'll do same as the youngest generation here now do.
Guy's like Damon, Trip, Matt, Chris A and other O/Ops currently growing past their capacity now

Why won't the next gen be the same?

Or are you predicting there won't be enough carpet, uph, rug and "normal" hard floors to clean, that they'll need to offer more services like stainless appliance restoration and caulking sinks to thrive like the Gen X'ers I mentioned above?

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for education. "knowledge is power"
and anyone considering selling a service need be educated before so.

Lemmie ask, I "presume" you're a natural stone guy and not a Steveo
Is that your primary biz focus or do you clean more carpet, rugs and upl?


lastly, do you have anything to sell us?
(classes, products, etc)
not that there's anything wrong with that (fo-reel)

just curious if the "need" you're suggesting is predicated on zeal, personal biz experience or sales to CC'ers

Thanks
shut up Marty


..L.T.A.

Great points and questions…..Yes, I believe that carpet has a limited future.
Yes, I’m a stone guy who has also cleaned a lot of carpet.

Yes, I’m also a stone instructor and work closely with Mikey P.
In fact we wrote a manual together and have a “Advanced stone care & repair “ class we teach together as well.
The genesis behind the manual / class was the fact that there was no one teaching diversification / niche services and the fact that carpet id dying a slow death as far as total sq ft per home.

I have always believed that doing more diverse services for your customers cements a stronger relationship with your customer as people really like a “one stop” shopping.

 

[hogjowl]

Middle America will have a carpet market as far as I can see into the future.

 

[Desk Jockey]

Middle America will have a carpet market as far as I can see into the future.

Most new homes in this area only have bedrooms carpeted. The other rooms are wood floors, tile or LVT. Area rugs are used for spot comfort and warmth.

 

[Greg Miller]

Ive been asked by some Board members to share my thoughts on why carpet, uph, rugs, odor, color etc, (non insurance mandatory) courses are down dramatically.

my replies have been:


-Very few Millennials are applying to jobs that involve actual work. Especially ones that involve dealing with piss, shit and selling to mother figures.

-Those that do, take two days to figure out that there are 1000's of other ways to make $16 an hour.

- A few companies have enough "culture", higher end client bases and can pay $20 + an hour to attract and keep a few hard workers around, but are most likely being trained in house (YTU, *** etc) for the first two years to prove commitment.

-Most IICRC teachers are can not keep millennials awake and involved so the reputation of the classes/cert suffer badly. Tom Cermak and Shawn B are the only two that bring a good amount of props to class from what I can see.
The IICRC needs to set up learning centers around the country, Vegas, Chicago, Dallas, East Coast that can be used by various teachers. These centers need to be homes or simulated homes that have all flooring and furnishing options installed, showers, counters, rugs, pet urine, mdf, oxy bleach stains, fume fading, delamination, corn rowing, soil filtration, spotter residue etc all waiting for the students. So far they have left this up to the schools, who have failed to pull it off, with the exception of a few Stone schools, who are not involved with the IICRC, yet...

- Provide continuing value to being a certified Techs or Firms. Firms should get access to (all) online standards as well as cheap online classes and testing for unproven new hires, Owner Op/techs should get serious discounts and BOTH should get my Consumer Info App.



What do you got?

I first got certified in the early 80's while I was just starting in the business, back when it was IICUC. Bill Miller was sending tech's as fast as courses were available. in fact back then A1 Carpet Care and Miller's Carpet Care were the revenue engine (at least in southern california) that drove the growth of the now IICRC. Rodney Poulson (sp), one of the brothers that owned A1 was a share holder in the IICUC.
I have held many different categories including inspector. I hold zero certs now because there is really no need. And the reason I feel there is no need is the same now as then - value from a marketing standpoint.
40 years in the business and there is little if any more customer awareness now then there was 40 years ago. I was just thinking about this the other day, the consumer that is making a purchase or having something cleaned is just not INFLUENCED by the IICRC, Salespeople (for the most part) at the big box retailers are not even aware it exists. IICRC training will get technicians some nice big words to use but these same technicians will learn way more just being on a truck for a few weeks.
just my 2 cents...

 

[hogjowl]

Most new homes in this area only have bedrooms carpeted. The other rooms are wood floors, tile or LVT. Area rugs are used for spot comfort and warmth.

And, those of us who aren’t still in the 80’s, we can clean all those surfaces.

 

[Tom Forsythe]

It is hard to do hands on training on a road trip. Hands on training needs to have a definite location where enough material can be on hand to handle, touch and clean. We did a leather class about 20 years which had a lot of hands but you can readily ship scores of different leather swatches. We always encouraged leather furniture to be brought in for class but it rarely happened. You are seeing flood houses, classes at rug plants, Jim's upholstery class, special events like Mikey does, etc. The logistics involved will probably make these classes the exception rather than the rule. As much as cleaners ask for hands on the ultimate question is will they PAY for the class, the travel, lodging and food for themselves, let alone for techs?

 

[Mikey P]

It is hard to do hands on training on a road trip. Hands on training needs to have a definite location where enough material can be on hand to handle, touch and clean. We did a leather class about 20 years which had a lot of hands but you can readily ship scores of different leather swatches. We always encouraged leather furniture to be brought in for class but it rarely happened. You are seeing flood houses, classes at rug plants, Jim's upholstery class, special events like Mikey does, etc. The logistics involved will probably make these classes the exception rather than the rule. As much as cleaners ask for hands on the ultimate question is will they PAY for the class, the travel, lodging and food for themselves, let alone for techs?

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[Jim Pemberton]

As much as cleaners ask for hands on the ultimate question is will they PAY for the class, the travel, lodging and food for themselves, let alone for techs?

OK Marty, sorry for another long post.

Scroll on by....


IMO, those that need the bare minimum should be able to take an online course. We already have a great deal of "training" going on through "YouTube University".

What the IICRC could do is guide the creation of useful online training that had credible information (not that the IICRC has a consistent reputation in delivering accurate, credible information...but that's another story for another time.)

Part of the problem, as I see it, is that classroom lecture oriented trainers are not necessarily good on line instructors (myself included).

Video production is a different animal, and a professional narrator can read a script better than some "classroom instructors" (myself included)

That's the challenge that the IICRC has: Find the organizations that have the resources to produce such useful information.

.....and still have hands on training available for those who want and will pay for what its worth.

 

[hogjowl]

Thank you