What Would MB Do?

[thecleaningdude]

Hello Gentlemen,

Wanting/Strongly considering going full throttle with a TM setup (VLM now ). Working with all cash of $25K, or financing up to $40K complete. T&G is the primary (among many) driving force. Would still want to haul VLM equipment at the same time, though MPG is a concern as I drive a lot.

What would you consider and why?

This is an approximate budget, but I've got to stick to it as closely as possible.

Thanks in advance!

 

[hogjowl]

I'm assuming you already have a van?

Stay away from propane burners if you want to have room for your vlm equipment and the eventual rotary extractor and tile tools. In fact, it's going to be a stretch trying to fit all of that into any slide in equipped, standard length, van. A heat exchange unit is what I would recommend, but talk to your local distributor about which brand to purchase. There are some that are easier to work on than others and there's one that seems to have one common thread concerning it (from my own research), which is lack of factory support.

Unless you plan to work on it yourself, which can be difficult on the big name brand units, you're going to want to get the local mechanic's input on your decision.

Space inside the van is a huge consideration for anyone, but for you, with the vlm equipment you're wanting to carry, it's especially valuable. So, you're looking for sub mount tanks and compact design ... but be sure to ask about ease of getting parts and factory support when discussing this with your distributor. You don't want to be down for an extra day or two waiting on parts.

 

[Mike Draper]

@ mr. Hog. You forgot to advise him against a waste tank because that takes up more space than a propane burner. Just get a pump out.

 

[Desk Jockey]

Hold on to as much cash as you can. Use just enough to get the financing so you have cash reserves. Tile would generally mean high heat and pressures over 1200 psi. Although good mechanical action will allow you to use your tm primary as a rinse tool on most projects.

If that money is just for the TM I'd look for a liquid cooled unit. If it is for both the TM and the truck then a slide in with a big propane or kero burner.

Its a buyers market, I'd weigh low hour used vs new. If making a payment it might be worth brand new. If paying outright it might be better to check on good used or repo equipment.

Good luck!

 

[John Olson]

If cost and MPG is a driving factor a Rage or 370 in a ford transit would have you in the 25-40k range a blazer or legend in a 1/2 ton would work too but those are going away the 1/2 ton so those might end up being a hard to find van pretty soon too. All of them would be great machines in very fuel efficient vehicles for running around Vegas. You don't need the biggest baddest machine to start with unless commercial is a driving factor for you. Make sure to go run all of these machines in Vegas and ask lots of questions.

 

[Desk Jockey]

Here is a deal, the Champ doesn't have the best rep but damn look at what you get for your money!!!
20HP 4M blower
http://kansascity.craigslist.org/bfs/4581800214.html


Here is one in your own town!

http://used.jondon.com/view-classif...sh-water-tank-more/nevada/las-vegas/slide-in/

 

[hogjowl]

@ mr. Hog. You forgot to advise him against a waste tank because that takes up more space than a propane burner. Just get a pump out.

I didn't forget it. I specifically didn't give him that advice. Waste tanks are gold. Pump outs are nice. Gold is forever. Pump outs break. My pump out on my Vortex went out on me and the one on my current rig is out of the unit being repaired. I like to be able to clean when the pump out is not working properly. And, there are times when there is no convenient place to pump to.

You'll notice that I also said nothing about doing away with the fresh water tank.

 

[renegade_cowboy]

If I was in your position this is what I would do.. I would buy a gently used TM/Van in the $10-$15 mark (yes there are a ton out there) and use the rest of the cash to improve other aspects of your brand.

You say you drive a lot.. thats not a good thing because you aren't making money.. so with the extra cashola you can reduce your service area and start focusing on more localized cleaning.. saving you time and money.

Propane heat is one of the best heat sources.. but you also have to deal with a secondary fuel source which is just one more thing to deal with. I use to run propane.. but I would rather use my heat exchange units out of convenience.

That being said.. I have two 3ht 600 psi propane heaters for sale.. one is brand new, never been used and the other is gently used.. $1800 for both..

 

[Russ T.]

I wish I would have had this place when I was starting out, great advice guys!

 

[Mike Draper]

@ hog. I specifically didn't say anything about lots of stuff because I'm smart as well.

 

[hogjowl]

@ hog. I specifically didn't say anything about lots of stuff because I'm smart as well.

If that were true, you wouldn't be hanging out here with us.

 

[Desk Jockey]

 

[Mikey P]

View attachment 5446

Saw this at the interlink in Vegas today..

Sweet 870 set up

 

[The Great Oz]

Here is a deal, the Champ doesn't have the best rep but damn look at what you get for your money!!!

Rico, you made me snort Coke (Zero, the Guinness of diet colas) out my nose.

A truly classic quote.

 

[BLewis]

Box is to high, get the low rider version

 

[JS41035]

View attachment 5446

Saw this at the interlink in Vegas today..

Sweet 870 set up

Any more pics of that setup?

 

[Desk Jockey]

Rico, you made me snort Coke (Zero, the Guinness of diet colas) out my nose.

A truly classic quote.

its still got to be worth 9-10k doesn't?

 

[hogjowl]

Pics satan we need pics!

 

[thecleaningdude]

Thanks for the feedback everybody, much appreciated!

 

[thecleaningdude]

Great info, thanks.

Yeah, if I had my druthers I wouldn't travel much at all. However, the problem with this city is that it's a big island surrounded by desert. Average to better than average areas are juxtapose to run down neighborhoods, the elite are on the outskirts and everything else is in the middle. It would be a challenge to target a specific community out here, though probably not impossible.

Regardless, it would take time and in the meantime I'd have to continue to drive until that happens. It's also worth noting that I happen to live in a 'challenged' community so I almost always end up driving no matter what.

If I was in your position this is what I would do.. I would buy a gently used TM/Van in the $10-$15 mark (yes there are a ton out there) and use the rest of the cash to improve other aspects of your brand.

You say you drive a lot.. thats not a good thing because you aren't making money.. so with the extra cashola you can reduce your service area and start focusing on more localized cleaning.. saving you time and money.

Propane heat is one of the best heat sources.. but you also have to deal with a secondary fuel source which is just one more thing to deal with. I use to run propane.. but I would rather use my heat exchange units out of convenience.

That being said.. I have two 3ht 600 psi propane heaters for sale.. one is brand new, never been used and the other is gently used.. $1800 for both..

 

[jcooper]

What would you consider and why?

If it's your first tm, I would NOT get a used one(unless very low hours). These things(tm) can have issues frequently(even the new ones).

I would get a new, low to mid level(16-20k) tm and finance the van. Your disty charges more to fix a tm than your local ford guy.



You gotta have some deductions or tax mans going to get you.

 

[thecleaningdude]

Hi John,

I've seen the Transit and 370 in the flesh. Efficient for sure, but not much room for anything. I would't be able to fit a folded Orbot in it let alone a Cimex or even a 175. You're right though, it would definitely save fuel costs. The E150 is nice.

I thought the SS 370 has a 45 blower? This isn't enough for large size commercial? Though I would still mostly likely encap/padcap commercial I'd want the option.

Thanks!

John Olson" data-source="post: 4310254" class="bbCodeBlock bbCodeBlock--expandable bbCodeBlock--quote js-expandWatch">

If cost and MPG is a driving factor a Rage or 370 in a ford transit would have you in the 25-40k range a blazer or legend in a 1/2 ton would work too but those are going away the 1/2 ton so those might end up being a hard to find van pretty soon too. All of them would be great machines in very fuel efficient vehicles for running around Vegas. You don't need the biggest baddest machine to start with unless commercial is a driving factor for you. Make sure to go run all of these machines in Vegas and ask lots of questions.

 

[thecleaningdude]

Thanks for the wise words.

I have a feeling that over time I would end up carrying less and less VLM gear. Still, I've built a semi sound business on padding so I it'll never go away. I'm also not at all adverse to the method. But I need to get faster, broaden my reach (tile and grout, etc.) and appease the masses.

It's also pretty much a lock that I'm the least mechanically inclined poster on this board. Local support is a must.

I'm assuming you already have a van?

Stay away from propane burners if you want to have room for your vlm equipment and the eventual rotary extractor and tile tools. In fact, it's going to be a stretch trying to fit all of that into any slide in equipped, standard length, van. A heat exchange unit is what I would recommend, but talk to your local distributor about which brand to purchase. There are some that are easier to work on than others and there's one that seems to have one common thread concerning it (from my own research), which is lack of factory support.

Unless you plan to work on it yourself, which can be difficult on the big name brand units, you're going to want to get the local mechanic's input on your decision.

Space inside the van is a huge consideration for anyone, but for you, with the vlm equipment you're wanting to carry, it's especially valuable. So, you're looking for sub mount tanks and compact design ... but be sure to ask about ease of getting parts and factory support when discussing this with your distributor. You don't want to be down for an extra day or two waiting on parts.

 

[jcooper]

I thought the SS 370 has a 45 blower? This isn't enough for large size commercial?

Damon, truthfully working with any tm will blow your mind, It's nuts. I used to think my porty did a good job, then we got a tm. I was dumb

A 370 will do whatever you want, lots of nice units around that price range.

 

[Mikey P]

Pics satan we need pics!

They said no pics...


The 870 now has a huge 6 series blower

 

[ruff]

A few more things to consider:

• Is theft an issue. If so, you may need to work out of a locked vehicle which will mean a PTO (not a slide in.) Unless you find a special slide in, in a boxed truck installed with that in mind.
• Is noise an issue? Slide ins make more noise. Particularly not good if you work nights.
• It is nice to have a van that consumes less gas. However, from what you're describing, you'll load it with equipment to capacity. Therefore, you may potentially need a bigger stronger motor.
• Are you good mechanically? Slide in will need more care. There's a good reason why all large companies have PTOs
• If you're really good mechanically and have the time, you may be able to fix an older machine and save a bundle. However, I can guarantee you that your time would likely be better spent, with far better long term results financially, if you'd spend it on marketing/promoting your services.
• Do you need a real fire breather (some slide ins), or will regular good old high heat be sufficient?
• Working in Vegas heat you may want to add a performance radiator if you choose a PTO, as the engine will be working hours in park.
• Do you have easy access to dumping the dirty water? Not sure what's the regulations are in Vegas. In S.F. we do.Therefore no need for large recovery tank. If you don't, you'll need a good size recovery tank, depending on your style of cleaning (high flow means a lot of water in recovery tank.)

Get the most durable and in best shape machine you can get- dealing with constant break down is a real downer for a business.

And as Russ said, don't forget that having a great van with not many clients is a sure way to the poor house. Your budget should have plenty for all facets of marketing and promoting your business.

 

[Nate The Great]

They said no pics...


The 870 now has a huge 6 series blower

Didn't Nick N. say no pics as well, but you snapped a few anyways...

Feel free to PM me the pics, thanks!!

 

[thecleaningdude]

Awesome feedback, thanks.

And to answer what was a continuous theme in your post - I am a terrible mechanic.

A few more things to consider:

• Is theft an issue. If so, you may need to work out of a locked vehicle which will mean a PTO (not a slide in.) Unless you find a special slide in, in a boxed truck installed with that in mind.
• Is noise an issue? Slide ins make more noise. Particularly not good if you work nights.
• It is nice to have a van that consumes less gas. However, from what you're describing, you'll load it with equipment to capacity. Therefore, you may potentially need a bigger stronger motor.
• Are you good mechanically? Slide in will need more care. There's a good reason why all large companies have PTOs
• If you're really good mechanically and have the time, you may be able to fix an older machine and save a bundle. However, I can guarantee you that your time would likely be better spent, with far better long term results financially, if you'd spend it on marketing/promoting your services.
• Do you need a real fire breather (some slide ins), or will regular good old high heat be sufficient?
• Working in Vegas heat you may want to add a performance radiator if you choose a PTO, as the engine will be working hours in park.
• Do you have easy access to dumping the dirty water? Not sure what's the regulations are in Vegas. In S.F. we do.Therefore no need for large recovery tank. If you don't, you'll need a good size recovery tank, depending on your style of cleaning (high flow means a lot of water in recovery tank.)

Get the most durable and in best shape machine you can get- dealing with constant break down is a real downer for a business.

And as Russ said, don't forget that having a great van with not many clients is a sure way to the poor house. Your budget should have plenty for all facets of marketing and promoting your business.