Who can screw up a carpet more?

[Mikey P]

A ignorant lazy tech with a truckmount and wand/RE

Or a ignorant lazy tech with a 175/OP?

List how many ways that both can cause damage and youll see one list will be much longer than tne other.

 

[Kenny Hayes]

The former of course.

 

[BIG WOOD]

Idiot tech with a tm and wand.

 

[AlienAgent]

I think either method can produce equally damaging results, just in different ways.

HWE- carpet left to wet. Mold, mildew, bacteria.
VLM- tip bloom and other friction related damage.

Which one would be easier to fix when a complaint comes in? What percentage of screw ups are so bad replacement comes up?

 

[Mikey P]

HWE- carpet left to wet. Mold, mildew, bacteria

Hot water extraction can cause just as much texture damage through worn or misaligned jets rotary extractors with their Jets too close or into the pile, aggressive brush heads etc

Not to mention Marty's favorite cornrowing that happens from CRBing but that can be either method

 

[sassyotto]

so scaring people about one method will make the other look better? Sounds familiar

 

[Hack Attack]

2 different tools, it's like arguing a hammer vs a saw.
Pick the right tool

 

[Mikey P]

so scaring people about one method will make the other look better? Sounds familiar

Im a 2%r and have mastered all methods.


Sounds like you're scared to do the same.

 

[FredC]

IDK. I do know that some major manufacturers have warranty language that explicitly warns against 175s. Assuming this is based on damage claims and not politics, which will no doubt be claimed, I'd have to say the 175 guy.

Commercial Carpet Warranties and Rotary Cleaning: Commercial Cash Flow, May 2016

Commercial carpet warranties are alive and well — and they don’t speak kindly of a certain cleaning method you might be using: Rotaries.

cleanfax.com

 

[Jim Pemberton]

Or a ignorant lazy tech with a 175/OP?

I've heard and seen it all it seems in over a half a century being around ignorant, lazy techs (and owners).

I would agree that due to ovewetting you can get more complaints with HWE, but actual damage to the carpet goes to the scrubbers.

1. A new brush that hasn't been broken in and damages the carpet/rug.

2. Idiot that uses the drive block itself to try to scrub the carpet, and rips it to shreds.

3. Tech that doesn't lubricate the pad or brush enough and damages the carpet

The above things leave permanent damage.

I have seen permanent damage from jet streaks to be very clear, but not as much as the above three.

Nearly all wetting related issues are eventually correctable.

The way that I would agree with you Mike would be that is is easier to teach a new technician to successfully VLM a carpet than to HWE it, and during the learning curve, you are less likely to get complaints about the work.

My father's carpet in his house, and our rental properties, are maintained by VLM. We use HWE between move out and move ins.

We have the VLM work done by our handymen. I do the HWE.

 

[Mikey P]

I've heard and seen it all it seems in over a half a century being around ignorant, lazy techs (and owners).

I would agree that due to ovewetting you can get more complaints with HWE, but actual damage to the carpet goes to the scrubbers.

1. A new brush that hasn't been broken in and damages the carpet/rug.

2. Idiot that uses the drive block itself to try to scrub the carpet, and rips it to shreds.

3. Tech that doesn't lubricate the pad or brush enough and damages the carpet

The above things leave permanent damage.

I have seen permanent damage from jet streaks to be very clear, but not as much as the above three.

Nearly all wetting related issues are eventually correctable.

The way that I would agree with you Mike would be that is is easier to teach a new technician to successfully VLM a carpet than to HWE it, and during the learning curve, you are less likely to get complaints about the work.

My father's carpet in his house, and our rental properties, are maintained by VLM. We use HWE between move out and move ins.

We have the VLM work done by our handymen. I do the HWE.

I like your examples Jim.

Lots of recent incidents prompted this discussion, not the least of which are the Mills firm and unwavering stance on NO 175/OP.

 

[Jim Pemberton]

I like your examples Jim.

Lots of recent incidents prompted this discussion, not the least of which are the Mills firm and unwavering stance on NO 175/OP.

When I served my preview to hell as a carpet inspector, I came to understand that most cleaning related complaints that the mills receive are those done by in house maintenance staff, or outside large janitorial concerns.

The three things I listed above are extremely common when people who are barely able to put one foot in front of another are entrusted with carpet care in a commecial/institutional setting.

 

[Numero Uno]

Both ,neither are situations any one wants...Bad Employees doing anything =Bad...

 

[AlienAgent]

When I served my preview to hell as a carpet inspector, I came to understand that most cleaning related complaints that the mills receive are those done by in house maintenance staff, or outside large janitorial concerns.

The three things I listed above are extremely common when people who are barely able to put one foot in front of another are entrusted with carpet care in a commecial/institutional setting.

Can I get that statement in writing, from you acting in the capacity of a professional and credentialed carpet inspector, to show to the property managers I deal with when they try to tell me how the in house staff or fly by night Jani company handles that? Lol

After the morons destroy a $65,000 floor is too late to make the sale.

 

[SamIam]

so scaring people about one method will make the other look better? Sounds familiar

Shut up, this isn't a Chemlie tactic!

Orrrr

 

[SamIam]

Im a 2%r and have mastered all methods.


Sounds like you're scared to do the same.

Honestly maybe if your training employees, a low moisture method may save you a few headaches.

But, if a guy can't clean with a wand RE how is he ever gonna clean with a brush and pad???

And guys like me which are mostly on here, do we as O/O really need another method except in rare cases when a truck mount won't reach.

And how many master Low Moisture Cleaning?

Vacuum vacuum vacuum pre spray agitate, extract, vacuum vacuum vacuum


Oops expert spotting Fels and Sally's.

The 2% main go to.

 

[Cleanworks]

Honestly maybe if your training employees, a low moisture method may save you a few headaches.

But, if a guy can't clean with a wand RE how is he ever gonna clean with a brush and pad???

And guys like me which are mostly on here, do we as O/O really need another method except in rare cases when a truck mount won't reach.

And how many master Low Moisture Cleaning?

Vacuum vacuum vacuum pre spray agitate, extract, vacuum vacuum vacuum


Oops expert spotting Fels and Sally's.

The 2% main go to.

I am converting most of my commercial cleaning to vlm. Much more efficient, looks good, smells good. Makes me more money per hour. Less spotting, no wicking.

 

[Jim Pemberton]

Can I get that statement in writing, from you acting in the capacity of a professional and credentialed carpet inspector, to show to the property managers I deal with when they try to tell me how the in house staff or fly by night Jani company handles that? Lol

After the morons destroy a $65,000 floor is too late to make the sale.

I'm just making sure that you meant that in jest

If not, you can DM me about my consulting services.

Trust me, I'm not soliciting, just trying not to be discourteous if you really wanted something like that.

 

[FredC]

I'm not soliciting,

Buy a banner!!!

 

[Jim Pemberton]

Buy a banner!!!

Understood

Post deleted

 

[FredC]

It was a joke Jim...

I undeleted

 

[Mr Brightside]

my tech dropping a buffer down the stairs through a wall has convinced me

 

[AlienAgent]

I'm just making sure that you meant that in jest

If not, you can DM me about my consulting services.

Trust me, I'm not soliciting, just trying not to be discourteous if you really wanted something like that.

I was just joking, I doubt if any amount of reasoning could get through to these people.

We have a local bowling alley that just replaced all 10k+ ft2 of its glow under black light carpet. The reason? They had staff cleaning it with a Rug Doctor and Purple Power degreaser.

 

[Jim Pemberton]

I was just joking, I doubt if any amount of reasoning could get through to these people.

We have a local bowling alley that just replaced all 10k+ ft2 of its glow under black light carpet. The reason? They had staff cleaning it with a Rug Doctor and Purple Power degreaser.

I wish I could say I was surprised...

 

[Kenny Hayes]

Hey now, not all janitors are bad Unless they’re 19!!!

 

[Restore-Dry]

Both can damage significantly in various ways!