browning... I may have messed up.

[gimmeagig]

I cleaned a couple of chairs the other day. The customer said they were pretty expensive. They had some bad stains on the seat and where the customer had tried to remove the stain there was a big ring. That should have told me something but unfortunately it didn't. There were no tags underneath the chairs to help me identify the fiber. It was a light beige with dark brown stripes. I wanted to be safe and not mess up so I used a fine fabric pre-spray and followed that with a wool approved low PH rinse. But as I started cleaning I could already tell that something wasn't right. After pre spraying I wiped the stained areas and there was much more on my rag than just the stain and by the time I was done extracting the fabric seemed darker that it should have been. I had the feeling that even when dry it would not be the color that it used to be. And I was right. I haven't seen the chairs yet but my customer is not happy. saying they are blotchy and brownish red now. OOOPs!
I did tell the customer beforehand that since I could not identify the fiber I would use the most gentle product on my truck and that I could not guarantee a good result.
She told me to go ahead because they were already very stained anyway , but I have a feeling what I did made it a whole lot worse. And now I suppose I own the stain. The fabric must have been all natural, maybe even some silk. The dark stripes might have bled into the beige and the beige might have browned out.
I don't know. I have not encountered anything like this before.
I feel really bad about this and if at all possible I want to find a way to undo the damage.
But before I go over there I wanted to check with you guys to find out if there is anything that could be done at this point?

 

[Mikey P]

Photos asap

 

[Desk Jockey]

So many possibilities but rather than jump to conclusions wait until you see them. Some fabrics darken when wet, it could just be they took too long to dry in the spotted areas and left water rings. I wouldn't panic just yet. Plus at this point it sounds like she is simply disappointed with the appearance not asking for replacement.

Get pictures. If possible take the chairs back home with you where you can make repeated attempts at correcting if needed. Less pressure without the homeowner standing over you and you can dry it faster using an airmover.

 

[dealtimeman]

I agree with above and like that you qualified the existing problem with the customer and explained the possible outcome/turnout as it makes dealing with the issue if it does arrive a more pleasant experience than the whole freakingout because of inadequate educating of the customer.

 

[gimmeagig]

I'm kind of dreading contacting the customer. I just want to have this go away.That is probably not going to happen. At the same time, If there is something I can do....
I told the customer to contact the manufacturer of the chairs (That name is written underneath) and find out what kind of fabric was used. Aren't manufacturers required to put these labels on their products?
I think I'll wait for her to get back to me and then have her take pictures that I can post here.

 

[Jim Pemberton]

I'd like to see pictures too, but based on your description the fabric bled, it didn't brown. The manufacturers are required to label the materials used as "stuffing" in upholstery, but not the fabric that you are cleaning.

 

[Brian H]

Heck, we'd all like to see the pictures.

Anytime we run into a piece that is as badly stained as you claim this one was we make sure to tell the customer that the piece is already ruined and any attempt we make to correct it could make it worse.

As Jim stated, the tag on upholstery tells you what is INSIDE the furniture, not what it is covered with. Don't go by the suggested cleaning tags either. They are frequently wrong. I saw a matching 3 piece living room set once that had different cleaning codes on each piece.

 

[Goomer]

Any way you can take the chairs somewhere where you can work on them in private so you have more time to correct the condition if possible, as opposed to trying to correct it under time constraints with the customer breathing down your neck while your sweating bullets and unsure of exact remedy?

 

[Spurlington]

Well ..... where are the pics and what happened?

 

[gimmeagig]

The fabric was custom ordered by the client specifically for those chairs. She did not know what the fabric was and there was no label underneath. I asked her to contact the supplier for fiber identification, so that I could figure out how to help. The customer told me she had more of this fabric so she might have decided to recover the chairs, I don't know. I have not heard from her since .

 

[Harry Myers]

Ok What I would have done was take a picture. The customer used who knows on it. Your method seemed more than safe to me. You know when I see a problem job I take pictures #1 to show what I was contending with. #2 when it comes out looking great, it is something to show your customers success.

 

[ruff]

That happens.

 

[gimmeagig]

Ok What I would have done was take a picture. The customer used who knows on it. Your method seemed more than safe to me. You know when I see a problem job I take pictures #1 to show what I was contending with. #2 when it comes out looking great, it is something to show your customers success.

I definitely learned a lesson there. I should have taken a picture and i didn't. I do have a smart phone now and I won't let that happen again.

 

[Mikey P]

Did you go back and look at them?

Are you on the hook for any damage?

 

[billyeadon]

Roxy,
Let's hope you dodged a bullet on this one. Lot of good advice above. You can download a free IICRC upholstery manual here http://www.jondon.com/media/pdf/manuals/FabricCleaningFeb2011.pdf

It may save you another bad experience.

 

[Lee Stockwell]

My brother's family runs this area's top upholstery shop. Has saved my butt several times.

 

[Brian H]

My brother's family runs this area's top upholstery shop. Has saved my butt several times.

LUCKY you!!!!!

I have used reupholstering companies several times over the years!!

I have learned that sometimes you just need to bite the bullet, get the piece recovered and move on. The longer that an issue drags out the worse it is for your reputation and worse it is for you emotionally...

 

[Desk Jockey]

I agree. You have to put yourself in their place. When something goes wrong I just want it fixed.

I think you stand a better chance of salvaging the relationship if you take care of it promptly.

 

[billyeadon]

I have always felt if you clean enough upholstery you will buy a few pieces.

 

[Desk Jockey]

I've always felt like if you buy enough upholstery, you'll quit cleaning it!

Seriously I think the "Dry " type tools spare many cleaners from over wetting issues. Now its just a matter of understanding carpet chemicals by design have properties that create huge risks for upholstery cleaning.

 

[Mikey P]

I have always felt if you clean enough upholstery you will buy a few pieces.

I furnished 3 offices at Coit with Haitian Cotton sofas and chairs while learning on their dime.



Highly recommended strategy..

 

[Brian H]

I agree. You have to put yourself in their place. When something goes wrong I just want it fixed.

I think you stand a better chance of salvaging the relationship if you take care of it promptly.

I feel I have done a good job of correcting a situation when I see that customer come back year after year!!

 

[Lee Stockwell]

Absence of factory tags should put up a RED flag. Most problems come from reupholstered pieces.

Shouldn't be a surprise that not all reupholstery work is equal. Many times inappropriate padding makes any cleaning a guaranteed disaster.

A great perk hanging around the shop is leafing thru all the fabric books and sample cleaning them. Bill says if a fabric sample dies in my care he wants to know that before using it.

 

[billyeadon]

I furnished 3 offices at Coit with Haitian Cotton sofas and chairs while learning on their dime.



Highly recommended strategy..

I remember when HC was popular and a cleaner would unknowingly clean it and of course it turned brown. Cleaner would say not his fault.
Customer would sell it in a garage sale. New customer thinks wow if i just get this cleaned I will have a very nice sofa. And the endless HC sofa would end up in a new home.

 

[Desk Jockey]

Wasted a lot of time, chemical and money cleaning HC.

Solvent, wet, solvent
HC Shampoo
HC extraction powder cleaner

All for some POS fabric that wasn't worth the effort any way.

Nasty stuff. I don't know how many HC papasan cushions we would clean and the customer would never pick up. Eventually we would just refuse to clean them.

 

[Jim Nazarian]

Without posting pictures its hard to help at this point.

When worried about browning, water rings or delicate fibers we have been using Encapuclean O2 just to limit risk while getting a decent cleaning, its versatile so its eliminated a few products from the van as well, http://www.bridgepoint.com/products.html?item_num=CC17GL++++++++++++++&wscdet_show=320000

Vacaways Peroxcellent is my favorite product http://www.vacaway.com/vaPeroxcellent/

 

[Jim Pemberton]

At the risk of disputing the thoughts of my respected veteran friends here, upholstery cleaning shouldn't be any more risky to clean than other services you render.

Here are some "What" questions that you should try to have answers for before you clean furniture:

1. What Is It? You don't need to know the difference between a brocade and a brocatelle, or a nylon from a polyester, but there are things you can do in a few seconds that will tell you a lot about the fiber family and fabric.

2. What Happened To It? The type of soil, spills, stains, etc and how long they have been there make a difference in what you'll do and how risky it will be to do it.

3. What Does Your Customer Want to Happen When You Clean It? Do they expect it to look like new? Is the texture more important to preserve, even if it means keeping a cushion turned over to hide a stain you can't remove without damaging the texture?

4. What Will Happen When You Clean It? You should know before you start what it will look like when you are done and be able to tell you customer that so that you can make sure they are ok with it. As Steven Covey says about business projects: "See The End From The Beginning"

5. What Will Happen To You if Something Goes Wrong? What is the value of the piece, any risks beyond your control, does the customer's attitude scare you?

Also, get one of the "dry tools" being discussed here. The "worst one" is better than the best "wet tool". These tools have changed upholstery cleaning in ways anyone who never used the alternative tools could ever imagine.

Upholstery cleaning isn't foolproof, make no mistake. Its just not as nightmarish as it once was.

Anyone here can PM, email me, or call me if you want to know more about what I'm saying here.

Or come to MFE and have a chat with me outside while we play with some tools and clean some crazy cushions I'm shipping down that are ones most people run from.

 

[Zee]

Without posting pictures its hard to help at this point.

When worried about browning, water rings or delicate fibers we have been using Encapuclean O2 just to limit risk while getting a decent cleaning, its versatile so its eliminated a few products from the van as well, http://www.bridgepoint.com/products.html?item_num=CC17GL &wscdet_show=320000

Vacaways Peroxcellent is my favorite product http://www.vacaway.com/vaPeroxcellent/

Funny, as I do the same exact thing...

 

[GeneMiller]

Cleaned a cotton sofa that in the seating area the upholsterer used red batting. It came straight through. Luckily that was the only area and the cushions cover it. I still work for her. I also had a couple of letters come through on some arms. Hard to see once dry but still there.

Gene

 

[Mark Saiger]

Cleaned a cotton sofa that in the seating area the upholsterer used red batting. It came straight through. Luckily that was the only area and the cushions cover it. I still work for her. I also had a couple of letters come through on some arms. Hard to see once dry but still there.

Gene

I really hate those... Especially the lettering that appears in areas you can't inspect first.

Alway cautious and really try to explain to the clients what could happen, but when it happens...that oh crap feeling...