attention Mikey
- Thread starter Ron Lippold
- Start date
Shawn Forsythe
RIP
How does one define a "single pass" with a rotary? (you don't want it to be a timed event?)
Who gets to go first (with presumably a cold machine)?
Are the contestants permitted a "burn out", to prime the solutions hoses with heat?
What's the solution pressure, hose length & ID?
Who gets to go first (with presumably a cold machine)?
Are the contestants permitted a "burn out", to prime the solutions hoses with heat?
What's the solution pressure, hose length & ID?
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Art Kelley
Supportive Member
That's what I post about because the TM I use most of the time isn't very interesting to me. On those days I do use the porty I get such a kick out of it that I just have to share it here because it bugs so many people. BTY, I will cross the 10000 hour mark on my Pro1200 tomorrow on one of my jobs, and i do get a kick out of how reliable this machine has been.
View attachment 5234
Ron Lippold
RIP
W need to set a fair amount of time
rwcarpet
Supportive Member
Let Bawb hold the bet money.........
Art Kelley
Supportive Member
Ron, you do realize this will be a winnerless contest, like the rotary shootouts at the MFs.
dgardner
Moderator
It's so hard to come up with a test methodology that produces meaningful results.
Here's my crack at it:
Both sides agree on machine setup - PSI and temp. Hose run, etc the same for both. Same prespray for both, no pre-agitation. The same (agreed upon) dwell time. The prespray should NOT be high-powered nuclear stuff - use an everyday unboosted prespray intended for normal soiling - something like Redline? We want to see the tools work, not the prespray. Select carpet with significant soiling - enough that it would be difficult to completely clean in the allotted time - makes it easier to judge the level of clean.
Both sides agree on a reasonable production rate - for the sake of discussion I will use 1200 square feet per hour (because I can do the math in my head). At 1200 per hour, 10 square feet would take 30 seconds to clean.
Mark off two areas 2 ft by 5 ft (10 sq feet) - one for each tool.
Also have a "pre-test" area to get the tools warmed up.
Each tool starts out in the pre-test area and runs the tool in normal cleaning mode, this gets everything up to temp, etc. At the start signal, the tool moves to the 2X5 area and starts cleaning, using whatever stroke/method the operator wishes. At the end of the 30 seconds (or whatever time you come up with) the tool is removed from the 2X5 area.
Whatya think?
Here's my crack at it:
Both sides agree on machine setup - PSI and temp. Hose run, etc the same for both. Same prespray for both, no pre-agitation. The same (agreed upon) dwell time. The prespray should NOT be high-powered nuclear stuff - use an everyday unboosted prespray intended for normal soiling - something like Redline? We want to see the tools work, not the prespray. Select carpet with significant soiling - enough that it would be difficult to completely clean in the allotted time - makes it easier to judge the level of clean.
Both sides agree on a reasonable production rate - for the sake of discussion I will use 1200 square feet per hour (because I can do the math in my head). At 1200 per hour, 10 square feet would take 30 seconds to clean.
Mark off two areas 2 ft by 5 ft (10 sq feet) - one for each tool.
Also have a "pre-test" area to get the tools warmed up.
Each tool starts out in the pre-test area and runs the tool in normal cleaning mode, this gets everything up to temp, etc. At the start signal, the tool moves to the 2X5 area and starts cleaning, using whatever stroke/method the operator wishes. At the end of the 30 seconds (or whatever time you come up with) the tool is removed from the 2X5 area.
Whatya think?
Ron Lippold
RIP
I like something like that, we dont need to get all ron w or jim m on it. We are talking making the most and doing the best for our customers
dealtimeman
Everyday is Saturday.
Yes but what goals or end results will be judged to be the winner?
In other words are dry times a factor in determining the winner?
Appearance when dry or right after the competition while still damp?
Without agitation just don't get how the zipper will achieve the same results as an aggressive rotary beating the carpet into submission.
Don't get me wrong I love my zipper and want another but we agitate she we use ours unless it is semi clean.
WILL BE FUN FOR SURE!!!!
In other words are dry times a factor in determining the winner?
Appearance when dry or right after the competition while still damp?
Without agitation just don't get how the zipper will achieve the same results as an aggressive rotary beating the carpet into submission.
Don't get me wrong I love my zipper and want another but we agitate she we use ours unless it is semi clean.
WILL BE FUN FOR SURE!!!!
dealtimeman
Everyday is Saturday.
I would say rotaries (for us) are only maybe 10-20 percent slower than wanding but when the rotary is necessary it should and does clean more thorough. Think if all if the passes with a rotary vs the passes with a wand.
But who knows I might learn something in MIKEYSFEST vegas this year!
But who knows I might learn something in MIKEYSFEST vegas this year!
SamIam
Member
I'm coming to Vegas friday what day are you guys doing it on????
If I show up friday can I crash the event with my Pops???
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
If I show up friday can I crash the event with my Pops???
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
Cleantechsk
Member
yes I know the rx vac shoe was bent
anyway
@ 12 flow vs my 10 flow rx it was impressive( 2oz flex)
Would really like to see Ron's 30 flow vs the SS.
6 flow... thats it? Can you increase it on that tool?
[video=youtube;KA3ohgqaGRw]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KA3ohgqaGRw&list=UU7DxhmAjkiUsaLp9zyygeqA[/video]
anyway
@ 12 flow vs my 10 flow rx it was impressive( 2oz flex)
Would really like to see Ron's 30 flow vs the SS.
6 flow... thats it? Can you increase it on that tool?
[video=youtube;KA3ohgqaGRw]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KA3ohgqaGRw&list=UU7DxhmAjkiUsaLp9zyygeqA[/video]
Jim Martin
Supportive Member
What is not being taken into account is how clean it is..........
It was proven long ago that a rotary flushes and extracts better then a wand.....( the filter does not lie )..........so in order for the CRB and the wand to give the same quality cleaning as a good rotary.........It will take you more time......you are going to have to slow down the cleaning strokes and do more dry strokes...and your still not going to remove as much as a rotary.........
I am putting down the pre spray......starting at the entrance of the room and cleaning with my rotary all the way to the far end...disconnecting and then wand a few areas that the rotary could not get.....brushing it out and moving onto the next room.......your still scrubbing with a CRB.............
Correct me if I am wrong.....its not about how fast we can go.....its about making sure that we flushed out as much as we possibly can and leaving the carpets as dry as possible....
Rowdy Ron has preached high flow for years......and has made a living off of it......but he also runs machines that have the balls to back it up......so not everyone can achieve what he says he can......
Joe Appleby
Supportive Member
Art,
We're considering purchasing another 1200 this year. Can you review the repairs you've had on your's after 10,000 hrs?
Sounds like a great contest.
We're considering purchasing another 1200 this year. Can you review the repairs you've had on your's after 10,000 hrs?
Sounds like a great contest.
Lee Stockwell
FOJL
The contest should include inspection of the filters afterwards.
You work your way into a room with a rotary vs starting at the far corner? That's how I used to do it. Hose management is much easier.
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Jim Martin
Supportive Member
The hose is behind me the entire time...........it is never in my way..........
Desk Jockey
Member
Ron K
Member
- Joined
- Jan 3, 2009
- Messages
- 2,371
Nice picture who's van is that?
Mikey P
Administrator
And the you go.
I have my doubts about the rotary being superior to the wand CRB combination. I have put them side by side and UI have proven results. The rotary fills up the filter with carpet that it tears out of it not dirt. If you are talking
about a solo guy yes one can be done faster wit the rotary but if you have a helper, helper vacuums you prespray all rooms helper scrubs you wand. YOu Able to get to corners, edges, behind and under some furniture. and the drying time is not superior at least on the three rotaries that I tested. T rex, 360i, and Rx 20. A Deron claims to have 2 hrs dry time with rotaries. I can't say the same but I a'm not as experienced as him when it comes to rotaries.
I'd like to be given the chance to see the contest you got going but Not sure if I'll be there.
Desk Jockey
Member
I wouldn't buy one for faster drying but I'd buy it because its more thorough. 2-hrs? Tell him to trun his pressure up and he will get better cleaning.
I'd be interested in hearing what your thoughts of the XL or Hoss are after using them.
I'd be interested in hearing what your thoughts of the XL or Hoss are after using them.
Jim Martin
Supportive Member
if the carpet is really really worn...then you will get some busted fibers in the filter....aside from that you are extracting the deep dirt that is imbedded down it the carpet.....
never the less..you are doing it in less steps then the CRB and wand....your rotary is doing everything that the CRB and wand is all in one step.....and it is pulling way more of the imbedded dirt then a wand possibly could..........
as far as dry times.......its all in your set up and how you run.......we all get different results.....
Art Kelley
Supportive Member
Well I didn't cross the 10,000 mark today ( missed it by 1/2 hour) because I ran my porty on two jobs. But on the second to last job (more on that one later) my van started to overheat and Now I see antifreeeze coming from underneath the pro1200 so I took a quick peek and see a puddle of antifreeeeze on the floor under the machine. LOL. I've got six jobs lined up for Monday so it sounds like I have to do a repair.
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Joe Appleby
Supportive Member
Art,
That's it in 10,000 hrs? No heat exchanger, idle computer, chem pump, shaft...? Nothing?
That's it in 10,000 hrs? No heat exchanger, idle computer, chem pump, shaft...? Nothing?
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Art Kelley
Supportive Member
Everything is the same except the Cat pump got replaced at 4000 hours because I accidently drained the oil and fried it. But I haven't even changed the pump cups. The cat pump diaphragm drum blew a hole at 6000 hours and I replaced the drum but didn't put it back on the Cat pump so I no longer meter chems. FWR baby.
Joe Appleby
Supportive Member
That's amazing!
dealtimeman
Everyday is Saturday.
Agreed
dealtimeman
Everyday is Saturday.
I will say I do get noticeably more carpet fiber while using a rotary vs using a wand but it comes with the territory of using a pn aggressive extractor for a deeper more uniform clean.
