Contracts.. The Rest of the story...

[Dolly Llama]

All I see is a dispute on the amount cleaned in which NEITHER party knows.

Me too.

It seems to me that the only way to make headway on this type of dispute

there is no way to make anymore headway on this Yaps


Warren billed for the whole job .
Ron estimated his crew cleaned a minimum of 60%.
Warren paid that.
It's not a number "picked out of thin air"

It all comes down to THE simple fact, the amount each crew cleaned is unknown .

I know hindsight is 20-20...
But if someone was paying me by the SF, "I'd" damn sure know how many sf I cleaned .
ESPECIALLY if i drove 3000 miles for 13 cents a ft


Due to the lack of a correct figure of SF cleaned, which is what the dispute really hinges on, we can go no further

It's a hung jury

case dismissed

Judge Judy


..L.T.A.

 

[Bjorn]

6]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r2fZ2ZiIrqw6]

 

[Goldenboy]

Warren anybody on this board except for me would give you hand jobs for the rest of your life if you HOOKED them up with a job where they kud make 45 grand in 16 days. Its too bad you picked the Biggest JackAss on the planet for this job. Just to let you know 99.9 percent of the guys on this board are behind you. So dont even think about not hangin here anymore. The Sad part about this whole thread is the creep has to have someone type his threads cuz they can not ReaD oR WriTe.

Golden Boy

 

[randy]

Bottom line after all is said and done, Ron should be paid what was originally agreed.

The problem, Counselor , is that neither party knows how much was cleaned .

The Plaintiff estimates 60 to 80%.
The Defendant paid 60% as well as lived up to the rest of the agreement to pay lodging and chem costs

I have yet to see exactly what part of the deal was reneged on.
All I see is a dispute on the amount cleaned in which NEITHER party knows


If there are no further arguments , I'll take a short recess and give my ruling

Judge EatToe


..L.T.A.

That I find hard to imagine. Almost as much as doing a large job without a written contract. Sounds like lots of cleaners do this sort of loosey goose agreements. Very bad idea. A confirmation email is not a written contract by the way. That can be faked easily and a judge will ignore it. Sounds like this industry needs a contract template, (note to self).

Hope this thread drives home one point:Operate like a real business with WRITTEN contracts.

 

[Ken Snow]

Warren anybody on this board except for me would give you hand jobs for the rest of your life if you HOOKED them up with a job where they kud make 45 grand in 16 days. Its too bad you picked the Biggest JackAss on the planet for this job. Just to let you know 99.9 percent of the guys on this board are behind you. So dont even think about not hangin here anymore. The Sad part about this whole thread is the creep has to have someone type his threads cuz they can not ReaD oR WriTe.

Golden Boy

Waldo- I am not included in that anyboy for sure. No hand jobs from me and that would be a decent 1 day for us (total company) but not one to write home about.

 

[Steve Manier]

It's called "The Big Truck Syndrome"... Once you buy one you feel superior and that you are entitled and deserve more $$$.

 

[Art Kelley]

Warren anybody on this board except for me would give you hand jobs for the rest of your life if you HOOKED them up with a job where they kud make 45 grand in 16 days. Its too bad you picked the Biggest JackAss on the planet for this job. Just to let you know 99.9 percent of the guys on this board are behind you. So dont even think about not hangin here anymore. The Sad part about this whole thread is the creep has to have someone type his threads cuz they can not ReaD oR WriTe.

Golden Boy

Waldo- I am not included in that anyboy for sure. No hand jobs from me and that would be a decent 1 day for us (total company) but not one to write home about.

Things are getting a little weird here. No hand jobs here either but 45K in the winter for a couple of weeks work, Warren could spoon with my Corgy for a month.
http://youtu.be/VLbQW8J22so

 

[davegillfishing]

forgive my ignorance but why didnt they cimex this job? go but 5 machines and run all
5 like you stole them and make some serious money..leave your truck at home with your
lead guy and double dip..make money while your gone making money? just wondering

 

[Hoody]

It was a mill claim dave, HWE was required.

 

[randy]

Warren anybody on this board except for me would give you hand jobs for the rest of your life if you HOOKED them up with a job where they kud make 45 grand in 16 days. Its too bad you picked the Biggest JackAss on the planet for this job. Just to let you know 99.9 percent of the guys on this board are behind you. So dont even think about not hangin here anymore. The Sad part about this whole thread is the creep has to have someone type his threads cuz they can not ReaD oR WriTe.

Golden Boy

Waldo- I am not included in that anyboy for sure. No hand jobs from me and that would be a decent 1 day for us (total company) but not one to write home about.

Well at least one good thing came out of this, we don't have to worry about Ken anymore. Swishy pants or not, he has been validated with a hand count.

 

[FB7777]

598,000 total sq ft X .13 per sq ft = $77,740

Ron got paid nearly 58% of the total amount $45,000


All in all, I doubt either side lost money on this deal.


With a job of that scope, a lot of things could have gone wrong. Everyone got home , no major mechanical issues and everybody got paid ( just not what they arbitrarily believe they deserve.)

"between 60-80% of the carpet " is a pretty huge chunk Ron... on this job thats 120,000 sq feet.

If you really did 80 % then you did over $15 grand of work for free :shock:


Contract or not, it sounds like this payment deal was destined to go bad, because neither party was real deligent on ironing the payment details until the machines were turned off

 

[joe harper]

598,000 total sq ft X .13 per sq ft = $77,740

Ron got paid nearly 58% of the total amount $45,000


All in all, I doubt either side lost money on this deal.


With a job of that scope, a lot of things could have gone wrong. Everyone got home , no major mechanical issues and everybody got paid ( just not what they arbitrarily believe they deserve.)

"between 60-80% of the carpet " is a pretty huge chunk Ron... on this job that's 120,000 sq feet.

If you really did 80 % then you did over $15 grand of work for free :shock:


Contract or not, it sounds like this payment deal was destined to go bad, because neither party was real diligent on ironing the payment details until the machines were turned off

BouT time you got off your arse & CHIMED in..... :mrgreen:

The # was 580,000 sf...Ron was paid exactly 60%.... :!:
It is almost impossible that "Ron" didn't clean 80% of the job... :idea:

Ron was dual wanding.....Warren was single wanding...2 wands on the ground ....compared
to 1 wand...EASILY would have cleaned 2/3 of the job.... :!:

80% of the job would have been 60k..."You sir are correct....!"

After expenses ...There is NO WAY Warren could have made more money than RON.... :!:

UNLESS......Warren said their was fabric protection applied to the JOB... !gotcha!

Warren probability ...KEEPS all of that revenue... :idea: :idea: :idea:

If ..Ron has NOT seen a final INVOICE...??? Warren may have made a profit "above the .13
cents a sf."

Lot's of way Warren could have added to HIS bottom line profit.... !gotcha!

ALL in ALL...Warren is entitled to any profits over the ".13cent" cleaning agreement...
Warren was the contractor of Ron's services...!!!!!!!! "and AGREED to .13sf"

If Ron ...cleaned 80%...which ..I think he DID...he is ENTITLED to $15K...more for his service.

HOWEVER ...If RON did NOT submit a FINAL bill for that amount..."60K"
The "45k"...can be considered...PAYMENT IN FULL...!!!! that hurts

ps... REMEMBER....Warren was NOT the CONTRACTOR of RECORD... :shock:
He was a SUB.. :!: "Soooo the the C.O.R. took their cut "right off the TOP".. :roll:

pss..This job should have been 50/50.."SPLIT THE BABY"..Shared equally expense & profit.!
Even if Ron cleans more Sf...It could have been considered a FINDERS FEE.... :idea:
WHEN ALL IS SAID & DONE....Both of these MBers....Pull off a HUGE contract without a
hitch...BRAVO..!!! SO both of you gentlemen should be PROUD...!!!! STFU...and consider
the partnership a success... 8) "Chalk the job up as a LEARNING EXPERIANCE."... :mrgreen:

 

[Brian R]

50/50 sounds about right. shiteatinggrin

 

[joe harper]

50/50 sounds about right. shiteatinggrin

"What took you so long...!!!!"

I threw you a soft-ball....right over the middle of the plate.... :mrgreen:



sp "IT sounds sooooomuch better when "I" say it..."

 

[Brian R]

I've been out and I've also been working. I can't keep you entertained all by myself. Cut me some slack.

 

[steve g]

this reminds me of the last job I ever did for rainbow international when I worked there as a tech. that job was 171,000 sq ft the biggest cleaning job I have worked on to date. this was in 1996, me and another tech were assigned to do the job. only problem was he was pretty slow and we got paid commission at rainbow. the rules were if we had to estimate the job our commission was 30% only problem was the franchise changed owners right before the job and a crook took over the place as owner. so we get all done and I had probably done 2/3's of the job myself in about 3 weeks time. but I had to split the entire job with the other guy and I only got paid 25% because the new owner ripped us off. so I got 12.5% of the job instead of 15%. it was the last job I ever did for them.

 

[Art Kelley]

this reminds me of the last job I ever did for rainbow international when I worked there as a tech. that job was 171,000 sq ft the biggest cleaning job I have worked on to date. this was in 1996, me and another tech were assigned to do the job. only problem was he was pretty slow and we got paid commission at rainbow. the rules were if we had to estimate the job our commission was 30% only problem was the franchise changed owners right before the job and a crook took over the place as owner. so we get all done and I had probably done 2/3's of the job myself in about 3 weeks time. but I had to split the entire job with the other guy and I only got paid 25% because the new owner ripped us off. so I got 12.5% of the job instead of 15%. it was the last job I ever did for them.

LOL. You got cornholed. Twice. At least you can laugh about it now. That slo-mo tech probably still laughs about it.

 

[Burtz]

I wonder what ron paid his helpers 100 big ones a day maybe?

 

[Giorgio]

Thank you

 

[Lee Stockwell]

I don't think we've heard from either side EXACTLY what the agreement was when the job STARTED. I guess it was never in writing either.

Lessons for all of us.

 

[Giorgio]

Thank you

 

[Ron Lippold]

just to clarify. We drove to ft knox to clean the carpet for .13 cents a foot. The deal was verbal between warren and myself. They were to pay chem and hotel.


The total price for the job was way way way more than .13 a sq ft......

 

[dealtimeman]

just to clarify. We drove to ft knox to clean the carpet for .13 cents a foot. The deal was verbal between warren and myself. They were to pay chem and hotel.


The total price for the job was way way way more than .13 a sq ft......

what was charged total per sqft including protector?