cost difference between owning a New CDS/CLeanco/Butler vs a new Aerotech

[tracywalker]

I appreciate all the info. Shane makes some great points about the true cost of ownership, and that is what I was looking for. I just used the no money down financing to compare. The AT had better % rates so at the end of 66 months total cost of an AT is only about 20 grand more. In my opinion well worth the difference IF the AT truck and Machine continues to be free of major repairs for 5-10 more years. I hear tells of VAT machines putting guys out of business due to fuel and operating cost. I just don't see it. Lack of business maybe, but too expensive to operate? I have the man power to dual wand and see the cost of 1 VAT being cheaper than 2 CDS's. But don't get me wrong Saigers dual butler setup looks awesome.

 

[Desk Jockey]

Lack of business maybe, but too expensive to operate?

I think if you have the workload, and it sounds like you do, then a big truck could make you more productive and offset any additional costs vs the CDS.

 

[Ron Werner]

After using a Cleanco pto over the past 6mths I REALLY appreciate being able to stand up in my box truck. I might not be able to get into the tight spots that the van can, but I carry 2.5in hose and can be parked 100ft farther away and still have as good or better performance. And I really like not having to bend over, not hitting my head, and having everything crammed into the van.
You won't get half the equipment you mentioned into a van but you could fit it into the box truck.

If you were only running residential, you might go farther with the pto, if its a good one.
Being as you're competing with Cintas for commercial work, go kick their ass with a AT.

 

[ruff]

Cost is important. No doubt.
Production is even more so.
Durability (less break down) will help or be in the way of production.

I personally don't know which breaks down more frequently (Butler and the CDS are known to be low maintenance dependable machines. And who knows, the new AT may be the cats mew). However, though originally they were touted to be the best thing ever,eventually we did find out that the Vortex were a very high maintenance headache. Hopefully the AT is not.

Is street parking and being able to fit in garages an issue?
For me it was (S.F.) that's why I sold my Sprinter.

All in all: A slight increase in production (if you're in a position to fill up your schedule) will more than make up for the price difference.

Both systems will work quite nicely for the right location and business model.

 

[dealtimeman]

Dang Jim that 2100 is a deal for sure!

Goodyear g647 wholesale in 19.5 are 300 each tire so I paid over 2100 just for my tires and installation with tax. That's like they gave you the brake job and shocks for free!

 

[dealtimeman]

Why is a vortex or at high maintenance ofer?

 

[ruff]

Michael, from personal experience I know nothing. Only owned CDS's (an Apex for two years) and now also a pro 1200.

As per the new AT I have no idea. With the Vortex, I read a lot of the threads and complaints that started coming out once the euphoria was over, reality set in and denial was pushed to the side . It seems to me (reading many posts here again. The search button may be your friend unless those posts were removed due to legal issues) that they required a lot of small repairs and plenty of mechanical know how. Therefore they work well for people like you who are blessed with good mechanical skills. Otherwise- Jimmy to the rescue. Isn't that why every Vortex owner has Jim Martin on their quick dial button?

It seems that when they work they are one hell of a production machine. It also seems like they should be only for people with great mechanical skills.

Again, hopefully the new AT have solved all these issues and will have only the amazing production and none of the drawbacks. They sure look sleek and amazing.

 

[Shane Deubell]

I appreciate all the info. Shane makes some great points about the true cost of ownership, and that is what I was looking for. I just used the no money down financing to compare. The AT had better % rates so at the end of 66 months total cost of an AT is only about 20 grand more. In my opinion well worth the difference IF the AT truck and Machine continues to be free of major repairs for 5-10 more years. I hear tells of VAT machines putting guys out of business due to fuel and operating cost. I just don't see it. Lack of business maybe, but too expensive to operate? I have the man power to dual wand and see the cost of 1 VAT being cheaper than 2 CDS's. But don't get me wrong Saigers dual butler setup looks awesome.

Usually i just grab a piece of paper and create a pro/con list of the different choices based on facts. Easy for our biases to get in the way of these decisions.

Good luck either way!

 

[Cleantechsk]

$20k more to upgrade to an AT? ( man cds should consider lowering prices LOL)

the cds says 1.5 gph which is around my truck....

so doubling your truck's ability and storage + rolling billboard

= win win

the walk ups alone Tracy

 

[dealtimeman]

I've personally had three walk up this year already, two of them to find out what that awful loud noise was! Booked one job at the truck( keep in mind I am not on the truck often.)

 

[Cleantechsk]

yeah, your trucks are scary loud Michael

 

[Shane Deubell]

Are we talking 60 months or 48 months?

 

[dealtimeman]

It would be 60 months at about 2000 without a down payment. Someone can correct me if I am wrong.

 

[Cleantechsk]

two vids for you Tracy

[video=youtube;fdrJnZen8Jc]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fdrJnZen8Jc[/video]


is this guy on the board?
he needs to try the figure 8 method of pulling solution hose from the truck.

[video=youtube;Rtq-axZl7jQ]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rtq-axZl7jQ[/video]

 

[Shane Deubell]

It would be 60 months at about 2000 without a down payment. Someone can correct me if I am wrong.

Yikes!
60 months x $2k = $120k

Fook that....

 

[dealtimeman]

Yikes!
60 months x $2k = $120k

Fook that....

Now keep in mind that number is fully optioned out with the larger suspension and no money down with a five year loan.

How much would two fully optioned CDs run 135000?

 

[The Great Oz]

The main reason I could see using a box truck is that you can carry all of the tools you need, sort of making it a rolling shop/storage area/cleaning machine. If the AT folks would take a few seconds to sketch a layout that didn't take up 60% of the box, it might be a little more useful for this purpose. If your business is set up to run two men and dual wand every job, the extra cost of big truck may pay for itself in time savings.

That being said, there's no debate that the cost to purchase, to run, to maintain will be far higher with a diesel engined box truck-based PTO than a gas engined van-based PTO.

 

[tracywalker]

It would be 60 months at about 2000 without a down payment. Someone can correct me if I am wrong.

Yep. Or they do the residual deal where you can pay 10 or 20% at the end. I guess it is a gamble, but you can do around $1500 for 60 months with a 20% residual, and either pay it off or could probably sell a 5 year old AT for much more than $9000 or $18,000. I guess the big thing for me is how long will the AT go without major repairs once it is paid off?

 

[dealtimeman]

Most vortexes and aerotechs manufactured by aerotech last well over ten years without any repairs over 4000 dollars?

 

[dealtimeman]

While operational cost will be a bit higher performance is way higher.

 

[Shane Deubell]

Now keep in mind that number is fully optioned out with the larger suspension and no money down with a five year loan.

How much would two fully optioned CDs run 135000?

Welp, you're right. I am letting my personal bias seep in without realizing it, see how hard it is?

Think he is on the right path by asking these questions and going back/forth over the different options.

 

[ruff]

Most vortexes and aerotechs manufactured by aerotech last well over ten years without any repairs over 4000 dollars?

Was that a question or a statement Michael?

Most CDS, White magic, and Butlers will last well over ten years without any repairs over $500.00

 

[dealtimeman]

Statement!

Most CDs units I have heard have the same issues as the v/at and that is clutches and transmissions. A gas motor does not last anywhere near as long as a diesel, and let's not get started on suspension on these poor vans that are constantly getting overloaded almost daily.

The v/at have aluminum floors and all stainless construction which in ten years with a couple of hours of elbow grease will look new again, when most other CDs units are rusting out and the floor rotted out in the van.

I by no means am saying that CDs units are bad, I. Fact if I were to grow a fleet to do residential and I had to deal with a lot of techs, I would have a fleet of butlers or CDs units.

But to compare apples to apples as one v/at compared to 2 CDs units , I would go with v/at unit every time with confidence.

A CDs to me is like having an armored Humvee, and a v/at is like havering a M1 Abrams, yes this is a battle every day and I like to have the biggest gun with the most potential and greatest versatility along with hauling capacity.

 

[Desk Jockey]

I totally agree with you Michael, with one proviso. That being if needed you can go to two separate locations with two trucks VS one big truck at one location.

In Tracy's case of doing mostly commercial work, I think the Aerotec makes the most sense.

However if I did a different mix of work, I think I'd buy two CDS's or Butlers or Pro 1200's. I can send them to two different homes and clean, if one were to down, I 'd still have one still running, I could clean at two separate entrances at a facility when needed.

 

[dealtimeman]

That is the very question I was faced with 5-6 years ago and my answer was to get rid of the van and get another vortex.

 

[Desk Jockey]

Yes but you also do very little residential work.

 

[dealtimeman]

In fact look at mikey, he tried the van with a good slide in and after a while he just bought another big truck AT. I believe his production has increased while increasing his presence in his market.


I by no means think a big truck is for everybody, but for those that want to fit a bit more work into their day while making their work day more efficient with a truck that makes work a bit easier as access to everything is simplified while buying a truck that has a 15 year proven work and quality history to back it up.

You don't need a vortex or aerotech to clean carpet!!!!!!


But if you want to clean carpets fasters with higher psi and recover MORE or EXTRACT MORE faster while fitting more jobs in because of the efficiency.

 

[Desk Jockey]

Suck up! What, are you working on a discount for a new one?

Mike became a professional biker, he doesn't use the Vortex. He bought a new one so he could move the old one to back up status.

But I must say it was a beautiful story!

 

[dealtimeman]

I believe both of his trucks get use on the majority of time. While mine sit most of the time!


Story was and is good!

 

[Desk Jockey]

Can you tell it to me at bedtime? Thanks!