Dear Steve Toburen

[bob vawter]

Your question was never answered. If his Million Dollar business was so great why did it flop for the new owner? My personal opinion was he overmilked his base and the well ran dry. Greed is not always good.

JHC Art

Are you really going to blast him like that when you obviously didn't read his response?

Pabst Blue Ribbon?

 

[Art Kelley]

Your question was never answered. If his Million Dollar business was so great why did it flop for the new owner? My personal opinion was he overmilked his base and the well ran dry. Greed is not always good.

JHC Art

Are you really going to blast him like that when you obviously didn't read his response?

You mean this one? :"Wow, I leave you guys alone for a couple hours for some light TV watching with Sioux (HawthoRNe for her and Memphis Beat for me afterwards) and when I come to turn the computer off all heck has broken loose. (And I know my name in a headline on MB is never going to be good!)

Thanks for the support, folks, but I'm good with this one since none of it is hardly a secret. I've taught over 80 SFS seminars in the last 14 years and almost invariably the question will come up in class "What happened to your business?" so I tell 'em which means I've probably told over 2,000 carpet cleaners the same story. (Since it is the truth I don't have to remember which version I tell to who.)

Now Ryan, I'll keep it as short as possible but ya gotta admit you asked and it IS the truth. (BTW, please keep any PM private.)

Sioux and I moved to Durango,Colorado in 1976 with 3,000 bucks, a Castex Model 700 portable extractor and a Ford Pinto station wagon. After a lot of down-in-the-trenches fighting, clawing and kicking and just being too-darn-stupid/stubborn to hang it up by 1991 I had grown the company to right at $750,000.00 per year in revenue. (Which incidentally is 1.3 million in today's dollars) The company was very profitable and I took 10 to 12 weeks of vacation a year. (Ryan, if I can find my 1991 tax returns I'll send you a copy- seriously.)

But one cold morning in January of 1991 I woke up and said to Sioux, "I don't want to do this any more." I loved the cleaning industry (still do) but all those years of running an emergency services restoration company and dealing with 16 employees in a small market base of 30,000 people just took their toll. I wasn't having fun any more.

So I put the business up for sale and by November of 1991 we actually had three different people bidding on the business and yes, all three parties were well represented with CPA's, attorneys, etc. (Which I believe shows my company wasn't a business that would "inevitably" go broke.)

But, just like the movie where the guy says "show me the money" I went with the one (I'll call him "Greg") with the cash and yup- Greg paid 97% of the price in cash up front. I carried 3% of the price in a promissory note and yes, that got paid off too. Yeah, I cashed out for a very nice amount of money. (No, I'm not Warren Buffet rich however I am "financially comfortable". I work with Jon-Don and SFS on a very part time basis because I "want to", not because I "have to".)

I've told this sad part of the story to quite a few people, including several SFS classes where we had time. We closed the business sale on a Friday and I remember my first inkling that things might not go well with the new buyer was when I offered to come in over the weekend and give Greg some "orientation sessions" so we could hit the ground running on Monday. His reply? "Naah. It's been a long week for me and I want to take it easy over the weekend." Hmmmm ... (Remember, this is the guy who has put his life savings into this purchase plus a large inheritance AND is on the hook with a very large SBA loan and he wants to "relax"?)

I then took Greg out the Monday after the sale (BTW, he was an hour late coming in to the office on his "first day") to teach him how to pre-inspect carpet cleaning jobs. We were on our way to a big job climbing west out of town on Hwy 160 and he looked at me and said, "Steve, I can't tell you how grateful I am for selling me this business." I still remember my reply, "Well, I hope you still feel this way six months from now."

So to keep the long post to minimum let's fast forward over the next six months where Greg fired me from my 15 hour per week consulting contract after one month (fine with me!) and had alienated all four of my office staff (who all walked off the job after collecting their "six month stay on after the sale bonus" from me) plus had ticked off the wife of the largest realtor in town plus had let the technicians take over the running of the company because he "didn't have the time for it" plus had lost the confidence of every major adjuster that I had worked with for years AND terminated the Free Lifetime Spotter bottle program we had been running for years and instead started charging $4.95 per bottle for it plus ... well, you get the picture. (By now I literally had quit going to the grocery store because my customers would upbraid me in the aisle for having "sold them out" to this guy.)

So sure enough in the spring of 1992 Greg calls me almost exactly six months after we signed the papers and wanted to meet me for lunch. He looked me in the eye and said, "Steve, I can't do this. I am in over my head. I'll give you the business back if you will just assume the SBA loan." (Which would have meant I would have shown a whopping profit because the SBA loan was for less than 50% of the purchase price.) My reply? "No." I had cut the emotional strings six months earlier and I was done with that part of my life.

So Greg stumbled along for the next couple of years running the company slowly downhill, going through a succession of managers because he just didn't have it in him to do it himself. (Which of course added another unnecessary layer of overhead to an already struggling business.) Then I heard he sold it for less than 1/2 of what he paid me for it and it went through several more owners, slowly spiraling down by living off the good will we had built up over the 16 years I had it. Then I believe (not sure) that around 6 or 7 years ago it went completely out of business.

And that is it. Sure, I felt bad about how things played out. My customers felt betrayed (even though as I took their verbal abuse on the streets of Durango I felt like yelling at them, "Where is it written that my life is to clean your carpets forever?"), my employees suffered under some really bad management stuff (but I gave generous bonuses to all the managers who stayed on for six months plus several technicians went into business against Greg using my Value Added Service concepts and did very well) and my family suffered from my inevitable angst due to all of the above issues.

So Ryan, no long post "full of excuses" why Greg didn't make it. But for the general edification of other board members I'll give you my take on why he failed:

1. A small service business (even a good one which mine was) is a very fragile thing. All you really are selling is "experiences produced by people". Which means you better be sensitive to people. Greg proved to be one of the most emotionally clueless and obtuse people I have ever met and suffered accordingly.

2. You have to have the fire in the belly. Especially in a restoration business (40% of our gross was in fire and water damage) even the owner needs to pitch in when things get "tight and tense". Greg either couldn't or wouldn't.

3. Even the owner needs to "play by the rules". Our company was built on systems and procedures. IF Greg had just followed them (or even better just moved to Arizona after buying the company and let my managers follow our systems and procedures) the company would have prospered. But he didn't.

So would I sell the business again? Absolutely. It was the right thing to do at that point in my life. (I was 38 years old.) Would I have sold it to Greg knowing what I learned after the sale? Probably not. But he seemed so nice, very business like and professional plus he had a LOT of money which I relieved him of! Even so, with the wisdom of hindsight I think I would have gone with either one of the other two bidders, who while not having the cash reserves Greg had they both did have a solid record of running small service businesses. So it goes ...

Nostalgically and truthfully submitted,

Steve Toburen
SFS.JonDon.com

PS Now if anyone wants to know what I have been up to since I sold my carpet cleaning/restoration company you'll have to click here: http://sfs.jondon.com/about/sfs-history (You guys didn't think I was going to type this much and not stick at least ONE link in, did ya?)"

It seems we are always told the only way to run a real business is to do it Steve's way, otherwise you just have a job. Apparently Steve's business wasn't something he wanted to run, and the new owner couldn't run it either. So what is all the blood sweat and tears worth if it's just dust in the wind?

 

[bob vawter]

wow Steve....
i did the SAME THING!

 

[Art Kelley]

My reply may have been buried in Toburen's explanation of his company's failure:

It seems we are always told the only way to run a real business is to do it Steve's way, otherwise you just have a job. Apparently Steve's business wasn't something he wanted to run, and the new owner couldn't run it either. So what is all the blood sweat and tears worth if it's just dust in the wind?[/quote]

 

[XTREME1]

It seems we are always told the only way to run a real business is to do it Steve's way, otherwise you just have a job.

Is that what you got out of SFS Art?

 

[Art Kelley]

Never had the pleasure, Greg.

 

[Cameron1]

[quote="Greg Crowley":194y6jnf]If you wanted to know you could have emailed him.

[/quote:194y6jnf]
Actually, Greg, several have. And I'm fine with this. Happy to share.

The main question has been "How did the 1.3 million grossed in a 30,000 population market base break down"? And also someone asked if that number included janitorial. So here goes ...

In the spirit of full disclosure Steve......that 1.3 million is in what year dollars?

 

[Ken Snow]

Art~ I've never gotten that from Steve. What I have gotten from my 2 times at SFS as well as a total of 4 times of SFS for various managers, and all my cleaners through the VAST program were a lot of solid ideas and many common sense things packaged for our industry.

Never got anything like "do it my way or fail" and never have I heard Steve judge a man or woman for doing things their way. In fact he is continually learning and evolving himself based in part on cleaners input improving the SFS program (as all our businesses should learn from our customers). Heck Howard Partridge, one of the most expensive cleaners in the country, us a more moderate priced and Greg Cole a vey modest priced company all say the same thing~ it's good stuff, worth our time and we have all sent others to it to help them and our companies grow from the experience.

Ken

 

[Art Kelley]

Ken, I don't have one of those so-called "real businesses", just one that's called a job that I do. But I enjoy my work, am well paid, and my customers love me and are glad to refer me to their friends and families. What good is building a real business if you don't like doing it and can't wait to get out? And the person who buys it from you goes belly-up? What is the point? To brag about a certain dollar figure that is ultimately unsustainable?

 

[Dolly Llama]

here's what "I" suspect from what I've gleaned over the years

Steve got burnt out.
he found it was a whole lot easier selling "how to do it", than actually doing it




..L.T.A.

 

[Jimmy L]

.

 

[Shorty]

An allegation (also called adduction) is a claim of a fact by a party in a pleading, which the party claims to be able to prove. Allegations remain assertions without proof, until they can be proved.


Its not an allegation if its true. I don't see how this post is raking Steve's "good" name through the mud. The guy sells marketing advise to carpet cleaners.. you guys are acting like he's one of us. Grow some critical thinking skills and see through the charisma. I've been through the strategies for success site, its basically the E-Myth and some other popular marketing literature applied to carpet cleaning.

Damned if I know how I lost my other thread, but I did.

Anyhow, as much as K.R.A.F.T. will allow, here are a few observations.

Allegations, assertions, whatever, simple pedantics of words.

Steve's VERY GOOD name has been sullied by the association you made between him and the purchaser of his business.

He is one that has been in the trenches so to speak, doing what we do, he knows how we work and that most of us are possibly "marketing morons".

But he would never say that. (Except maybe about me). shiteatinggrin

You may have been through the Strategies for Success web site, great.

Maybe you should also attend an actual SFS like I did, then you may find out that each one is different with extra information added from the previous one.

The E Myth was a good book, I have the E Myth revisited.

Although I receive regular updates from SFS, I am yet to receive anything from Michael E Gerber who wrote the book.

I'm not sorry I spent several thousand dollars to teavel to Roselle for SFS, I'm sure I'll be back to attend another one again.

But the location will be in warmer climes next time. shiteatinggrin



I haven't touched on anything that has been posted after your post which is above, so all I can say is, this will be my final post on this Dear Steve thread.

Oorooo,

Shortestwun.

:roll:

 

[Brian R]

Maybe Steve just didn't like what he was doing anymore and decided to reap the benefits of his blood and sweat.
Maybe he thought he could give back some of the knowledge that he obtained over the years to help out some of the people in the same business who were wiling to listen.

If you've never done what Steve did, then you just don't know.
Judging from his class, I would say he has a hellofa grasp on how to run a carpet cleeaning company and a company in general.
You guys who don't want to take his advice can just keep doing it your way.

If you keep doin what your doin....you'll keep gettin what your gettin.

The choice is yours.

Maybe it's just easier to suck at business and heckle someone that doesn't instead of getting off your lazy ass and doin it right.

 

[Steve Toburen]

Wow, I go out to eat (the "fusion food" turned out to be mediocre Chinese but the Presidente beer was served nice and cold at 33 degrees Fahrenheit as it is supposed to be) and I come back and people are getting all snarky with each other. Sigh ... I'm really not worthy of all this attention.

Ken, I don't have one of those so-called "real businesses", just one that's called a job that I do. But I enjoy my work, am well paid, and my customers love me and are glad to refer me to their friends and families. What good is building a real business if you don't like doing it and can't wait to get out? And the person who buys it from you goes belly-up? What is the point? To brag about a certain dollar figure that is ultimately unsustainable?

Geez, Art, don't get defensive and wind up with your panties all wadded up here. It sounds like you have a great life. Wonderful! I did too. I loved my business and my life for 16 years and then one day I didn't like it as much- so I sold the company. Happens every day in America and people USUALLY get congratulated when they do so! But not on Mikeysboard!

"What is the point?" you ask. Art, it is called "options"- having the financial freedom to spend the rest of your life doing exactly what you "want to do" instead of what you "have to do". As I say in SFS- if you are not born rich you have to "burn X number of years making a living"- why not at the same time "double dip" by creating an appreciating asset out of your company? (That being said- a substantial number of our SFS members make a considered decision to "stay small" and just use what we teach them to raise their prices as owner-operators which gives them the extra money to invest for their retirement. I say great and yes- and we give the "little guys" the same exact support we give the members who get big.)

Like Ken says above, Art, I would never presume to tell someone else how to live their life or even how to run their business. Most people come to MB (and to SFS) for possible solutions to issues they are facing in their business. At SFS Violand, Yeadon and I give them the options, the tools and the ongoing support to make what they decide to do happen. Then it is up to them- as it should be.

So Art, you ask why did my business eventually flop for the new owner. Let me give you the Cliff Notes condensed version this time:

1. The new owner was one of the most emotionally clueless and obtuse people I have ever met. He antagonized and alienated virtually everyone he did business with, including my long time adjusters and up-till-the-sale loyal employees and suffered accordingly.

2. The new owner did not have the "fire in the belly". This frustrated and demoralized his employees and forced him to add more employees (more overhead) because he would not WORK in the business.

3. The new owner would not follow the written systems and procedures our company had followed for years. However, he would not write his own either. Technician anarchy followed and anarchy and chaos is never a good business model.

So, Art, why don't you ask Ken Snow how long even a great company like Hagopian's that has been around forever with incredible Critical Mass built up in its management staff could survive a new owner like the one profiled above?

Its been fun but Sioux says I don't get to stay up answering posts till 1:00 AM like I did last night. Good night and you boys play nice!

Respectfully,
Steve
SFS.JonDon.com

PS I'm flattered that so many people are interested in what happened so long ago. But once again, guys- I'm just not worthy. I'm just an middle-aged (OK, maybe I'm sliding into "old age") rug sucker who made some money and am trying to help others do the same thing. For example, here is a great free step-by-step guide to optimizing your Google Places local listing. (By the way Google Pages is also free!)

http://sfs.jondon.com/5326/resources/sp ... ep-by-step

NOTE: If anyone is too tired/intimidated/busy to go through the one time 60 second site registration process just e-mail me with the phrase "Google Places" in the subject line and I'll send you the guide without you having to download it.

 

[daniel@procarpet]

Talking about buying a business.

There is a little tackle shop that collects boat launch, sells bait etc at a lake I fish at. They are doing a crappy job running it but still making a killing. If I had 500k, I would offer that and easily make over a million a year out of this place. I would do so many things different that they are not doing. They don't even sell coffee, hot breakfasts, cold cut sandwiches etc. I may have to buy this place and forget sucking rugs.

 

[randy]

Interesting thread. The only thing that would make it more interesting would be having the buyer of the business come on here and post his view of the business he bought and why it is now out of business. That would be a bit more fair & balanced in a Fox News sort of way. One man can look at this and say Steve Toburen has been unfairly "nicked" in this thread , but at the very same time,is he not in some ways sort of doing the same thing to (Greg), the buyer of his business. Anyone know Greg's last name ? The original name of the business ? In a few hours I could probably find Greg and invite him to this thread for an INC magazine style recap of the entire transaction from sale to closure. I still have access to some really neat search toys from my days in the bail bond business. Unless Greg is in the witness protection program, an unrecorded alias, or fictional character, I can find him.

An interesting side note:

A few years ago I purchased an air duct cleaning tool from Steve Toburen's brother n law. He also owns a full service carpet cleaning / restoration business. Great guy with lots of knowledge about our industry. He actually invented the device he sells, and it's really a fine tool. I strongly recommend anyone cleaning air ducts give him a call. His web address is www.dynaprobe.com


Disclaimer: Ten years ago I went through a 5 day program put on through Micheal Gerber's business. He authored the e-myth and is a personal hero of mine. Much of SFS is based on Gerber's work and is many thousands less than what the e-myth program goes for. If marketed outside of our industry a program like SFS would be at a much higher price point. Easily $3,000 to $5,000. For example Jay Abraham's three day, 36 hour training is $5,000 and sells out (200 attendees per program) every time he does one. Having attended Jay's program I can tell you SFS would probably be a better value for the average carpet cleaner than Jay's program or the e-myth program. For that reason I have recommended it to many people over the years.

 

[Mikey P]

Randy



I know for a fact the guy's name is/was Lou Kern.


Start digging!!!

 

[dealtimeman]

i think more people need to buy vortexs or aerotechs! maybe?

 

[Brian R]

Man, I don't see what the big deal about the business still working after being sold.
Who gives a rats ass?
The whole reason for selling it is because you want out from under it. Taking your name off of it etc.

It's like giving someone money and trying to tell them what to do with it...just because you gave it to them.

No reason why a business going under should have anything to do with the previous owner. Especially after they ran it well for 16 years.

Leave to Mikey's Boarders to pick on the things that just don't matter.

 

[Hoody]

Notice Steve has posted here more times in the last 2-3 days than he has in the last 3-4 months combined ? :wink:

 

[Jimmy L]

.

 

[Doug D]

:roll: good grief. The man comes on here and explains why the business he sold goes under and some of you are still not happy! You guys need a life!! :mrgreen:

 

[Jim Bethel]

I agree with Doug.

Steve is a stand up guy and he sold his business for a profit.....isn't that we are all in business for. Well done Steve! Just because the new guy that purchased his business didn't have the same drive or customer service ethos that Steve is renowned for - he can't be blamed for that.

Similar to me selling truckmounts to cleaners for a living. We spend days with new clients teaching EVERYTHING they need to know about this business from swinging a wand, to marketing. However, if they choose not to listen to our advice and recommendations, the new client could go out and completely over wet his customers carpets and be quite rude to them to boot. Chances are that he will go bankrupt in a short period of time, even though he he was taught, nurtured and encouraged to do things professionally. If he doesn't.....is it my fault? Don't think so.

Same as Steve. He sold a successful business and gave the new owner the 'tools' to continue to run it profitably. If the new owner chooses not too, that is on his head - not Steve's.

 

[Nate The Great]

I agree with Doug.

Steve is a stand up guy and he sold his business for a profit.....isn't that we are all in business for. Well done Steve! Just because the new guy that purchased his business didn't have the same drive or customer service ethos that Steve is renowned for - he can't be blamed for that.

Similar to me selling truckmounts to cleaners for a living. We spend days with new clients teaching EVERYTHING they need to know about this business from swinging a wand, to marketing. However, if they choose not to listen to our advice and recommendations, the new client could go out and completely over wet his customers carpets and be quite rude to them to boot. Chances are that he will go bankrupt in a short period of time, even though he he was taught, nurtured and encouraged to do things professionally. If he doesn't.....is it my fault? Don't think so.

Same as Steve. He sold a successful business and gave the new owner the 'tools' to continue to run it profitably. If the new owner chooses not too, that is on his head - not Steve's.

You can dress them up, buy them crayons, send them to school and what do they do??? Eat the fkn crayons......

 

[Jim Bethel]

Excatly Nate!

 

[Doug D]

good one Nate!

 

[floorguy]

My reply may have been buried in Toburen's explanation of his company's failure:

It seems we are always told the only way to run a real business is to do it Steve's way, otherwise you just have a job. Apparently Steve's business wasn't something he wanted to run, and the new owner couldn't run it either. So what is all the blood sweat and tears worth if it's just dust in the wind?

[/quote]


and i agree with you on 90% of what you said Art

BUT (and this is flipped)

I bought a guys business just a few mths ago...(more for the machine but hey)

And his clients ALL LOVE ME, better then him...say i do a better job, etc.......so it does matter the person who buys it and how they run it

now i just gotta get in the groove to start calling on the client list.. i hate that part

 

[KevinL]

I thought they f'd the teacher.

 

[Jim Bethel]

What type of schools do they have in Illinois Kev?? :shock:

 

[harryhides]

Art~ I've never gotten that from Steve. What I have gotten from my 2 times at SFS as well as a total of 4 times of SFS for various managers, and all my cleaners through the VAST program were a lot of solid ideas and many common sense things packaged for our industry.

Never got anything like "do it my way or fail" and never have I heard Steve judge a man or woman for doing things their way. In fact he is continually learning and evolving himself based in part on cleaners input improving the SFS program (as all our businesses should learn from our customers). Heck Howard Partridge, one of the most expensive cleaners in the country, us a more moderate priced and Greg Cole a vey modest priced company all say the same thing~ it's good stuff, worth our time and we have all sent others to it to help them and our companies grow from the experience.
Ken

Ditto what Ken says and I've also sat through Steve's soap box three times.

As for a lot of what has been suggested here..............................good grief !!

Your own life is YOURS to live so get on with it.