How is it possible...?

[Mikey P]

That one carpet store owner, his best salesman and his top 4 installers all have not heard of the pencil and paper trick to find the direction of the carpet nap?


Two of the installers have 20 plus years under their knees too..


Barry Costa made me a guru today.


I figured everybody in the trades knew how to do it.

One guy just uses his hands (and admits to some costly mistakes) one guy says he "can just tell" and another said he drops a pen or pencil from waist high and the direction of the bounce tells him and the last guy just shrugged.

 

[FredC]

One guy just uses his hands (and admits to some costly mistakes) one guy says he "can just tell" and another said he drops a pen or pencil from waist high and the direction of the bounce tells him and the last guy just shrugged.

Sad.......


Took Barry's RRT class...great class

also available on DVD

[h=1]Barry Costa Master Secrets of Carpet Repair:[/h] http://www.superiorcleaningsolutions.com/servlet/the-261/CARPET-CLEANING-EQUIPMENT-TRUCKMOUNT/Detail

 

[floorguy]

sooo whats the trick??

 

[FredC]

lay the paper on the carpet (non traffic area) and roll a pen back and in short strokes...the paper will move in the direction of the pile lay

 

[hogjowl]

Make sure the pen or pencil is round.

 

[carpetcleaner]

An installer that I know can really tell just by looking. He knew the pen/pencil trick, but he doesn't need it. I tested him at one house - he was correct 100% of the time just by looking at it.

 

[Mikey P]

one guy there said it would not work on a tight olefin loop tile..



it did.


the paper did move a lot slower though..

 

[The Great Oz]

One guy just uses his hands (and admits to some costly mistakes)

He doesn't know the "look at the big arrows on the back of the carpet" trick either?

 

[Joel D]

The reason is because its amateurish. Carpet will often lay the wrong way like the last 5' of the roll for instance when new. Ive had others laying all different ways throughout the roll. All most like pooling. Its just not reliable.

Like Bryan said its best to just look at the back.

But yes anything a goofy pen and paper can do any experienced installer can just do with his hand.

That sounds a bit rude but just picture mrs customer looking in at the installers of her $2000 new carpet and theyre standing there with a pencil and paper rolling on the carpet lol. Its just not professional.

 

[Mikey P]

This trick was taught primarily for doing patches where the printed arrow would not show up kn the doner piece.

I imagine it would come in handy in individually cut stairs as we'll.


Unprofessional would not be to use this trick when second guessing and then having to fix the mistake.
Every one of those installers admitted they have blown it a few times..

 

[SamIam]

I didn't know of the trick I usually look at donor piece then the squares on the back then rub it.

Problem with getting a piece out of the closet is its not always laid the same way popping it on the wrong way and you created your on pool patch

 

[Charlie Lyman]

I always go to a non traffic area and check with a paper and I use my seam roller (not the spike one, the solid one) when doing a repair. Customers that are watching find it interesting and then I can pretend that I know a lot and explain how carpet lays in a certain direction and that affects the way it looks.................

 

[Joel D]

Theres nothing wrong with a cleaner doing it Mike but for an installer who does it every day its silly.

Ive done the same mistake but its from hurrying too much and not checking.

Having done both for years cleaning is so much easier its ridiculous. So for a cleaner to mock an installer just makes me laugh.

 

[Mikey P]

Sorry if you took my comments as "mocking".

I was just surprised they didn't know this fool proof method of determining pile direction.

 

[Danny Strickland]

Jim Carfield at Bishop's Clean Care is who i did RRT through soooo many years ago. I

I did work for a guy who did carpet and VCT installs. he showed me lots of cool things when doing repair work.

 

[Desk Jockey]

Joel
Why is it a lot of installers have such attitude towards carpet cleaners?
What was the name of that guy from ICS that hates cleaners? Stephen something...one of Tony's friends. He just couldn't post a civil comment about carpet cleaners on ICS.

We get along great with installers in our town, we respect what they do and they respect what we do. They've save our butt a few times over the years, never had issue with them.

 

[Joel D]

Thats an excellent question Chavez if thats you?

It seems to go both ways pretty heavy.

It has always bugged me that Steve T made some really negative comments about installers on the forums a long time ago. Came off as arrogant to me.I dont know what happened but Im dying to know.

Its extremely hard work but they can make 45-60 hr minimum all day if theyre smart. I wonder if Steve tried to pay them 15 an hour or something and they laughed at him.

I am pretty defensive of installers but im not sure why.

Maybe because its such hard work and takes alot of skill especially doing it day in day out dealing with all types of carpet and patterns, but often thankless.

But yet i drag a wand across the carpet and the customer thinks im a hero lol

 

[Mikey P]

I'd rather pick strawberries for a living than kick in carpet.

 

[Hoody]

I had the installer guy that we work with offer me a part time position to help install carpet and tile. He offered me 8 bucks an hour and laughed right in his face. After I got done laughing he looked at me dumbfounded and I had to ask him if he was serious. He said yeah, I told him to find a kid in high school.

 

[bob vawter]

soooooooooo then ..
he sED he'd wait for ya..........?

 

[hogjowl]

Installation is just like cleaning. You can make a good living at it, but very few do so. The reasons for this are the same across both industries as well. It's because cleaners/installers typically are not able to handle the business and customer service side and very few do the mechanical side to standards. I spent several years in that end of the business and I never met a single installer that would show up on time, install properly and to standards, clean up after himself and warranty his work. Most had personal problems that got in the way and a lifestyle that prohibited him from making good life for himself and his family. I would have passed out if I'd ever found one that owned a power stretcher and knew how to butter a seam.

The similarities between our two industries are amazing.

 

[Mikey P]

although I think we as cleaners know far more about installing methods than Installers know about the science of cleaning.


I've heard so much bad advice coming from them to the home owners over the years

 

[hogjowl]

There is a carpet store here in Pigsville that is still telling people not to have their carpets cleaned. It's owned by an old time installer and his two sons. They only sell to builders because no woman would put up with them. With the building industry in the tank, I am surprised they are still in business.

 

[Desk Jockey]

We had that here also for many years. Then they bought some system that claimed no chems or water. Then aftera couple of years they bought a TM. Now they promote HWE like all the rest of us.

 

[mcatt]

That's a very handy tip. I did not know that I must admit

 

[Lee Stockwell]

Installation is just like cleaning. You can make a good living at it, but very few do so. The reasons for this are the same across both industries as well. It's because cleaners/installers typically are not able to handle the business and customer service side and very few do the mechanical side to standards. I spent several years in that end of the business and I never met a single installer that would show up on time, install properly and to standards, clean up after himself and warranty his work. Most had personal problems that got in the way and a lifestyle that prohibited him from making good life for himself and his family. I would have passed out if I'd ever found one that owned a power stretcher and knew how to butter a seam.

The similarities between our two industries are amazing.

Bingo. My oldest son, Jeremy, was a longtime installer and that was his gripe about the typical installer....and cleaner.