Quick question about rinse in a greasy restaurant

[gimmeagig]

Hi guys,
I'm doing a greasy restaurant tonight, pretty old olefin carpets through out. The prespray I'm using is esteem Attack with a little citrus added.It's 11 Ph. Last time I did it I rinsed with Esteem Fibre Rinse which is 2 Ph.
I have some Prochem Liquid Slurry in my shop and I'm thinking about trying to rinse with that tonight.
My concern is that the Liquid Slurry has a Ph of 9.5. Am I running the risk of rapid resoling if I use that?
Usually the fibre rinse gives me good results even though it doesn't seem to have any actual cleaning power. I don't do restaurants very often so I haven't arrived at a permanent solution for that.
What do you think.....is Attack followed by Slurry OK?

 

[jcooper]

Pro chems site calls it "concentrated extraction carpet cleaner".

Am I running the risk of rapid resoling if I use that?

'
Doubt it.

 

[Jimmy L]

I don't think PH has anything to do with resoil.

A very good NON -FOAMING emulsifier to use would be Kleenrite's PCX powder.

To me dry slurry foams up too much in the vac hose.

That and you're using a spiked citrus solve prespray and you should expect more foam.

Foam kills vacuum

 

[gimmeagig]

I have Liquid Slurry, does that foam also? I checked out the PCX and it looks interesting. So if I understand it right, emulsification is mainly for the rinse cycle?
Like I said, the prespray I use is Attack and at Ph11 I was thinking I needed to follow it with a neutralizing rinse like Esteem Fibre Rise at Ph2. The PCX you are suggesting is Ph 9 just like Liquid Slurry. So am I wrong about having to neutralize the PH ? What am I missing?

 

[Royal Man]

I just encap them with a fiber pad. It rips the grease right off with out having to slog it down with a bunch of chemicals.

 

[gimmeagig]

I don't have a scrub machine yet. Just me and Wanda.

 

[jcooper]

So am I wrong about having to neutralize the PH ? What am I missing?

It's a restaurant, not a cotton sofa. You are not going to hurt anything using an emulsifier. This is the perfect place for your slurry stuff.

If anything you could: pre spray with your 11ph, clean with your 10 and mist(lightly) on your 2ph after. I wouldn't(not needed), but you could.

I use soapfree on just about everything, it's ph is 10. A restaurant is the last place I'd worry about ph.

 

[gimmeagig]

Thanks for the heads up Jerry. I'm still new at this and the info I get here on Mikey's is so helpful, don't know what I would do if you guys weren't here to help...
Getting pretty good at the residential and have lots of happy customers,but there's a lot to learn for me still. I've done this restaurant twice now. The first time I used Chemeister Grease Eraser and Action Extraction (turned out great but I had to do some areas twice with extra strength GE and extra citrus in the prespray), second time it did it with Esteem Attack and Esteem Fibre Rise. Most areas cleaned up really well but I also had to do a few areas twice. Those areas didn't clean up as well as with the Grease Eraser but OK enough for the owner to be satisfied.Overall, with Attack it was less effort and tonight I'll do the Attack with Liquid Slurry. I'm hoping I'll notice an improvement over the previous times.
So it's 7:30 now, I'm going to take a nap for an hour and then I'll get ready for an All-nighter with Wanda.......Wish me luck!

 

[Dolly Llama]

Like I said, the prespray I use is Attack and at Ph11 I was thinking I needed to follow it with a neutralizing rinse.

welp, you're thinking wrong .
neutralizing Ph has NOTHING to do with resoil rates .
Only morons and nincompoops think that .
They simply repeat it over and over cause they have no clue of chemistry or what actually causes resoil .

don't listen to them, they're just mindless drones regurgitating tripe

So am I wrong about having to neutralize the PH ?

yes


..L.T.A.

 

[gimmeagig]

welp, you're thinking wrong .
neutralizing Ph has NOTHING to do with resoil rates .
Only morons and nincompoops think that .
They simply repeat it over and over cause they have no clue of chemistry or what actually causes resoil .



don't listen to them, they're just mindless drones regurgitating tripe




yes


..L.T.A.

Well I add that to the list of things this nincompoop has no clue about. I forgot who told me, either my supplier or the people at tech support for Esteem when I first started using their products. It just kind of made sense to me, you clean on the alkaline side then you rinse on the Acid side and the carpet goes to neutral. But I hear and read so many different things over time it all gets confusing after a while. That's why I'm asking you guys... Anyway, Larry, would you mind helping me understand why that isn't so?
I'm off to my job now and I won't worry about Ph for tonight

 

[mirf]

Use the slurry. It won't cause a problem and you can see the results for yourself.

 

[Dolly Llama]

Anyway, Larry, would you mind helping me understand why that isn't so?

you're not a nincompoop, Gig, ....guys that SHOULD know better are , as they chant the same ole mantra

what causes rapid resoil is gooey/sticky residue left on carpet..nothing more, nothing less .
Ph has nothing to do with that...in fact, some of the acid rinses leave their own gooey/sticky residue


..L.T.A.

 

[Mikey P]

I don't think PH has anything to do with resoil.

A very good NON -FOAMING emulsifier to use would be Kleenrite's PCX powder.

To me dry slurry foams up too much in the vac hose.

That and you're using a spiked citrus solve prespray and you should expect more foam.

Foam kills vacuum

What is it with you and foam Ladwigs?

 

[Jimmy L]

FOAM occupies space in a vacuum hose.

Limiting airflow and causes DRAG.

Better to test out products that have LOW FOAM qaulities and use them.

Little to no foam in the vac hose means faster airflow and thus faster DRY TIMES.

You find that out byt either using a POS portable or having to extract multiple areas where the customer has used RESOLVE.

BOOM! All airflow stops!

FOAM is BAD!

 

[Mikey P]

I don't think PH has anything to do with resoil.

A very good NON -FOAMING emulsifier to use would be Kleenrite's PCX powder.

To me dry slurry foams up too much in the vac hose.

That and you're using a spiked citrus solve prespray and you should expect more foam.

Foam kills vacuum

What is it with you and foam Ladwigs?

 

[gimmeagig]

OK, it's finished and the combination of the Attack and the Liquid Slurry was great.As a final step I did mist over the whole place with my 2Ph Fibre rinse just in case. The slurry did not foam up in any noticeable way, no problems with vacuum. I think I'm going to use up the 2 jugs that I have and then possibly look for what might be better. But this time it was quite a bit easier than the previous times so I'm happy.
Thanks for your help!
here are a few pics





done!

 

[Jimmy L]

Looks good but next time forget that extra step of spraying an acid rinse product on it.

Doesn't do a damn thing for it and might even leave a residue.

 

[mirf]

Looks good. Nice Job.

 

[Dolly Llama]

OK, it's finished and the combination of the Attack and the Liquid Slurry was great.As a final step I did mist over the whole place with my 2Ph Fibre rinse just in case

alright , now you're being a dOlt .
stop spraying additional gUnk on carpets just because "someone said so",
Have them tell you exactly why/how ph alone makes a differences regarding resoil on synthetic

til they can do that, their blowing smoke or simply regurgitating the same tired myth


..L.T.A.

 

[FLYERMAN]

I agree spraying acid neutralizers on the carpet after is at best a waste of money and can in fact leave a residue of its' own. There now you've heard it from more than one pro.

BTW Esteams rinse called CBS is quite amazing in its own right. Give it a try.

 

[juniorc82]

you really need to get a 175 and post bonnett if your that worried about re soiling. If your worried about re soiling you mind find it interesting that by a hosing it down with additional moisture after cleaning you are probly at greater risk for wickbacks than if you cleaned it and left it alone. I have found this true especialy on sugary drink stains from my expeiriences cleaning retail in shopping malls. A post bonnett would provide additional aggitation which would help the cleaning process as well as leave the carpet considerabley drier which reduces the chance of stains popping back up. You might search through the threads but I believe it has been the opinion on here that some emulsifiers have the ability to remove residue regardless of ph.

 

[gimmeagig]

OK I won't spray on extra stuff any more. I promise I actually have never done that before. Someone here mentioned it so i gave it a try.I did go very light on it, just a light mist but I get it, it's not a good idea.
Yes, a 175 would be nice to have for jobs like that. At this point 90% of what I do is residential. but I keep my eye open for one of those machines. I suppose it's a "Must Have" for carpet cleaners.
So this job made me wonder about the properties of different rinses now. So far I have not really experimented with rinse much. Now I'm learning that the PH thing is not so critical and that a rinse can have real additional cleaning power. I suppose I need to pick a better rinse now.
Would the CBS be useable for most jobs or just on severely trashed carpets?
I know, I keep coming back to the Ph, CBS is 9.7 and the Attack is 11. Are there any possible drawbacks if I started using that on my residential jobs? I'm still kind of confused by this because at the IICRC classes they were talking about 7 being the state that carpets should be left at.
I am getting very good results with Attack,better than with Chemeister Grease Eraser. I don't love Fibre Rinse. I think I liked the Chemeister action extraction rinse better. It actually seems to have a bit of cleaning power like the Liquid Slurry does.The website claims that it does not harm the machine because it's buffered at 5.5 Ph. I'm not a chemist and I don't know if it is just advertizing hype. Esteem Fibre Rinse has a very unappealing scent.Kind of harsh almost like chlorine so I would actually really like to get away from that particular product.
There are so many different chemicals on the market , it's hard to find the perfect product just from reading the ads.I do think the Attack is hard to beat.
Anyway I learned a few things from you guys and now I have new questions, isn't that the way it always goes.

 

[ruff]

Looks good but next time forget that extra step of spraying an acid rinse product on it.

Doesn't do a damn thing for it and might even leave a residue.

That's absolutely not true. It helps the supplier greatly!

 

[gimmeagig]

That's absolutely not true. It helps the supplier greatly!

IgotitIgotitIgotit...........I did it only one time on a suggestion that was made here.I'll never do it again

 

[ruff]

We know you got it.
We are just getting a good ride out of an old and hotly debated subject.

Just ignore us, we don't clean carpet any more, as we're too busy posting.

 

[Dolly Llama]

I'm still kind of confused by this because at the IICRC classes they were talking about 7 being the state that carpets should be left at.

Ask them why.
if they tell you resoil concerns , ask them how Ph alone effects resoil rates .
You won't get a good answer, cause there are none

as far as using hi-PH presprays on res, if it's in good shape, use something 10 and under that's approved for stain resist.
(so there are no warranty issues to come pointing back to you)

if it's trashed, it doesn't matter, cause they've already voided their warranty due to lack of proper
/regular maintenance and you need to get it cleaned/restored


what causes rapid resoil is sticky/gummy residue left on the carpet...nothing more, nothing less.
it has nothing to do with Ph


..L.T.A.

 

[Jimmy L]

And remember that who ever teaches those "Classes" are just paid...... WHORES....... to push product for that distributer while they are there.

 

[FLYERMAN]

I tried the CBS and loved it. You should/would be fine using it on resi jobs. I might not extract a natural fiber sofa with it but carpet would be fine all except wool/silk stuff like rugs.

 

[SamIam]

Looks good but next time forget that extra step of spraying an acid rinse product on it.

Doesn't do a damn thing for it and might even leave a residue.

Or over wet it more then leave a residue. I have heard some rinse's leave it sticky.


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[gimmeagig]

Or over wet it more then leave a residue. I have heard some rinse's leave it sticky.


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The Esteem Fibre Rinse definitely does not leave a sticky residue, that's the part I do like about it. But it has a really ugly scent and no emulsifiers so really no added cleaning power. The Attack is so good that usually that added power is not needed but still, like I just learned on the restaurant, it's nice to have on some jobs.
So PH doesn't matter, I need to extract to the point that there is no sticky residue, I got that. But if a rinse itself leaves a sticky residue then I can rinse all I want and the results would be the same, right?
So I'm looking for a good rinse that has emulsifiers and extra cleaning power but still doesn't leave the carpets sticky. Oh yeah it would be nice if it did have an appealing scent too. Am I asking for too much here?
At this point I think I'll try the Esteem CBS. It comes in powder or liquid form.I don't know if one is better than the other. I'm leaning towards the liquid just because I'm worried about gunking up my old CDS machine.