Staining under office mats

[BIG WOOD]

The foundation has no vapor barrier underneath, making it wet. I doubt this is off gassing. So is it browning or mildew?

How would you fix this?

 

[Jim Williams]

Is it possible that was the original color of the carpet and was protected by the mats for years? That's sort of what it looks like. The only yellowing or browning I've ever seen was from rugs with latex backing.

 

[BIG WOOD]

Is it possible that was the original color of the carpet and was protected by the mats for years? That's sort of what it looks like. The only yellowing or browning I've ever seen was from rugs with latex backing.

No, the original color is the grey. This problem has happened with this company twice in two different locations with the same type of foundation. On the other location, they put the mats down very shortly after I cleaned it, trapping the moisture causing it to mildew.

But on this specific location, I haven't cleaned it in 3-4 years, but they've had water literally shooting through the vct tile in the back storage room. This foundation is soaking wet due to it not having the barriers installed.

 

[BIG WOOD]

I don't smell mildew in this room, which makes me think it's browning.

Does anyone have a plan that I can do?

 

[hogjowl]

I'd spray it down with coffee stain remover and then acid rinse.

The reason why that's what I'd do is because it sounds like something Pemberton would do.

He's my hero.

 

[BIG WOOD]

I'd spray it down with coffee stain remover and then acid rinse.

The reason why that's what I'd do is because it sounds like something Pemberton would do.

He's my hero.

Any other reasons why you'd use the coffee stain remover?

 

[Old Coastie]

If that was my office, the coffee stain would be all around the desk. Like somebody read these threads and spewed, or something.

Then crawled around trying to suck up his hard-earned, carefully hoarded java...

 

[BIG WOOD]

If that was my office, the coffee stain would be all around the desk. Like somebody read these threads and spewed, or something.

Then crawled around trying to suck up his hard-earned, carefully hoarded java...

Since I wasn't smelling mildew, I'm assuming it's just browning from the hard water in the foundation. So I was planning to spray my acid rinse 4:1 on the brown areas, let dwell, then extract like normal, and post spray with a peroxide usr. But Marty threw in that coffee stain remover and confused me.

He's good at that. Just throw in another suggestion without explanation. That's Marty for ya

 

[Cleanworks]

Coffee stain remover such glacial acetic acid coffee stain remover, which is essentially the same as browning treatment. I wouldn't rinse with anything, I would buff with a neutral pH carpet rinse using absorbent pads or bonnets.

 

[BIG WOOD]

What about some of you encap cimexers? I've got some grey pads and a few bonnets. Any suggestions?

 

[BIG WOOD]

Coffee stain remover such glacial acetic acid coffee stain remover, which is essentially the same as browning treatment. I wouldn't rinse with anything, I would buff with a neutral pH carpet rinse using absorbent pads or bonnets.

What's the difference between that and my acid rinse almost full strength? I don't have any coffee stain remover. I'll order some tonight if I need to

 

[Cleanworks]

Browning treatment or acidic coffee stain removers don't have any detergent in them. They are just acid with a mild reducing agent. You could try buffing with an acid rinse but I don't think it will be as effective. I usually spray those areas, let dwell then buff with a little neutral cleaner. The agitation helps to remove the staining without over wetting.

 

[hogjowl]

What's the difference between that and my acid rinse almost full strength? I don't have any coffee stain remover. I'll order some tonight if I need to

You don't have room in that trailer?

 

[Nate The Great]

How come no distilled water first?

I've had a residential customer with the same problem.. Hers was from the concrete slab.. You could smell the mildew after lifting up the chair pad..

I had another customer who put a chair pad over a Nain rug and the floor didn't have a moisture barrier under the bamboo flooring.. The wool fibers literally fell out of it when I rubbed my hand over it while pre-inspecting it.. Big hole showing the foundation..

 

[GeneMiller]

i see that kind of problem pretty frequently here because of the rain fall . Moisture wicks through the slab and is trapped by the plastic. You can walk around the desks and see it through the plastic. i tend to see a lot of red colored mold. After a heavy rain you can see the moisture on the pad. When dry it won't produce any odor. i clean it with a peroxide based cleaner and on commercial it works very well. After cleaning i spray a heavy dose of peroxide and Ds2 and after the job is through just vacuum the excess. In homes on nylon its hit or miss. Wool it completely destroys.

 

[Shorty]

Did you lift the carpet to determine if the backing was cellulose??

If it is, it is a good chance it is cellulosic browning, removed with Browning Remover, NOT Browning Treatment.

Browning Treatment will help prevent cellulosic browning.

Browning Remover, has a higher % of H2O2 (or maybe over there, Acetic Acid), and is effective at removing the problem.

The plastic mats exacerbate the problem.

Plastic will retain moisture UNDER the mat, keeping the carpet damp & allowing mould spores to form.

Even in cases where the carpet may be dry, in times of very high humidity due to extended rainfall, it is not uncommon for moisture to gather under the plastic & start the problem.

Many times the air con; will fix this, BUT on weekends when the a/c is not on, is when the problem can start.

This is what I've found living in the tropics, don't know where you are, so cannot qualify my findings for you.

 

[Larry Cobb]

Matt;

I would try both in separate areas:
1. Strong peroxide - about 6-7.5% H2O2
2. Strong Reducing agent - ReduceAll 2oz./gallon hot water pH 9.5

Use whichever works better.

http://www.cobbcarpet.com/zen/index...earch_in_description=1&keyword=DCPB8 or DCRA7

 

[hogjowl]

Alabama is the tropics

It's hell

 

[Old Coastie]

Alabama is the tropics

It's hell

Man do you simply not understand the concept of baiting 'em in and picking their pockets once they pass out?

 

[encapman]

Encap-HydrOx

 

[BIG WOOD]

Encap-HydrOx

I think I might try this before I attempt to HWE with the browning treatment. Where can I get some before this sunday? I live about an hour north of Jondon and TCS

 

[BIG WOOD]

You don't have room in that trailer?

Honestly, I've never had a problem that I can remember of removing coffee or urine stains. I've always used peroxide to handle it.

Will my Acid rinse, undiluted, be just as good? Or do you think I should get some Browning treatment or remover at TCS this weekend?

 

[J Scott W]

There are several types of browning treatments or browning removers. They are not all the same.
Some are based on sodium bilsulfite or sodium metabilsulfite which are reducing agents. Others are acids. Similar to your acid rinse but at different strengths and probably added surfactants to help them penetrate the fibers better. Some are peroxides or oxidizers. Be sure you know which you are using, espcially if you intend to try multiple products on the same area.

Try to determine if it is mold. If you hit mold with a rotary or Cimex or OP or even a vacuum, there will be mold spores everywhere and that can come back to be a big rpoblem for you later.

Rick's suggesting of encapsulation with peroxide is a good one. We might disagree on the specific product to sue.

Larry's suggestion of testing a few approaches and then going with the one that works makes a lot of sense, especially because you are not certain on the cause of the stain.

 

[BIG WOOD]

There are several types of browning treatments or browning removers. They are not all the same.
Some are based on sodium bilsulfite or sodium metabilsulfite which are reducing agents. Others are acids. Similar to your acid rinse but at different strengths and probably added surfactants to help them penetrate the fibers better. Some are peroxides or oxidizers. Be sure you know which you are using, espcially if you intend to try multiple products on the same area.

Try to determine if it is mold. If you hit mold with a rotary or Cimex or OP or even a vacuum, there will be mold spores everywhere and that can come back to be a big rpoblem for you later.

Rick's suggesting of encapsulation with peroxide is a good one. We might disagree on the specific product to sue.

Larry's suggestion of testing a few approaches and then going with the one that works makes a lot of sense, especially because you are not certain on the cause of the stain.

I don't want to use a chemical that would lock the stain in, so what order would you use the different treatments to help prevent that?

 

[Bruce Humphrey]

Have you tried testing a small area with your acid rinse and a white rag?

 

[J Scott W]

I don't want to use a chemical that would lock the stain in, so what order would you use the different treatments to help prevent that?

There should be any issues as long as you don't use an oxidizer and a reducer together. An acid can reduce the effectiveness of an oxidizer. Just rinse between products and you should be fine.

If you test each in a different small area, there should not be much mixing of different products. You will find out what works.
Personally, I would start with encap / O2 as that is the easiest for me to do over the size you are delaing with and the equipment I have.

 

[steve_64]

If it's mold would a moisture detector sense it? If it's wet shouldn't it be treated as mold anyway?

I would think treat it and dry it then come back and clean as normal or use a post treatment on all the carpet.

 

[BIG WOOD]

Have you tried testing a small area with your acid rinse and a white rag?

I just tested 2 spots with my usr, and didn't see much. But that was just a 5minute test. When I go this Sunday to clean it, I'll check those spots and see how it came out with that dwell time

 

[Shorty]

We might disagree on the specific product to sue. =

Crikey Scott W, you're getting as good as me.

 

[ruff]

Sue, its the American way.
Vive le USA