TM builders...answer this please

[Brian R]

I'm a mechanical retard....But I have a good heart. shiteatinggrin


WHy is it impossible (or just not done) to run a PTO type setup off a small vehicle like a ford transit etc?

Why does it have to be a V-8 or similar (or does it?) ? Can't someone come up with a small set up like that for resi jobs...nothing too Vortexy or anything.


Why?

I don't want to put weight in the vehicle
I don't want to run a porty OR cords from my vehicle
I don't want a HUGE amount of power or payments

Simple is as simple does.


I'm sure there is a good reason besides money.....and I'd like to hear it.

Les? Mytee? Vawter?......anyone?

Humor me for a minute will ya?


Thanks
!gotcha!

 

[Brian R]

The reason for asking is because most of the TMs out their run on lawn mower engines anyway.

So it just seemed logical to me.

 

[joe harper]

........................................................GVW......................................... !gotcha!

 

[Larry Cobb]

Brian;

Many years ago we built a "Eco" PTO truckmount on a Toyota diesel pickup with a transmission PTO.

It had very good durability and economy.

After demoing the finished product, sales were less than we expected.

Perception was that the final package seemed expensive (about $26K at the time).

This is generally what keeps PTO builders from using smaller trucks.

Larry

 

[The Great Oz]

I'd also like to have a vehicle that would fit in parking garages, and the space freed up with a CDS would be even more important in a small vehicle, so I'd be interested as well. There are some pretty small slide-ins seen in everything from a Transit Connect to the tongue of a trailer though, so they may keep manufacturers from bothering with a PTO.

 

[Duane Oxley]

Brian:

On the surface of it, there's no reason it can't be done. But, if I'm not mistaken, most of the smaller trucks these days have engines turned sideways (transaxles), which would be seriously problematic to connect to with a drive shaft. Also, the engines are "stuffed" into the engine compartment, making things even more difficult.

If it was a true PTO, with a power- take- off provided by the truck manufacturer off of the drive train, I could see potential there, but otherwise, it would be a nightmare to do.

I also see decreased market appeal based upon the reduced cargo area as well.

Duane

 

[joe harper]

Brian:

On the surface of it, there's no reason it can't be done. But, if I'm not mistaken, most of the smaller trucks these days have engines turned sideways (transaxles), which would be seriously problematic to connect to with a drive shaft. Also, the engines are "stuffed" into the engine compartment, making things even more difficult.

If it was a true PTO, with a power- take- off provided by the truck manufacturer off of the drive train, I could see potential there, but otherwise, it would be a nightmare to do.

I also see decreased market appeal based upon the reduced cargo area as well.

Duane

OuCH...! "I never considered the engine configuration...!" NighTmArE... :shock:

I doubt ANY manufacturer would allow the UNIT...without WARRANTY restrictions... :?:

BTW The MAXIMUN PAYLOAD of the Ford transit is "1000 lbs".... :idea:
Even with NO .."freShY tAnK".. you would MAX-OUT..the GVW...

What would be REALLY cool is...IF...you could SCAVENGE battery power from a HYBRId :idea:
To operate a "mInI-BanE"system....with a 50 gal Waste-Tank...with a FULL TIME apo... !gotcha!

 

[Nate The Great]

I have a hydramaster hydra-van that was in a full sized dodge, but was also told they fit in the Chevy Astro vans too... problem was, the pulley is 1:1 ratio.. You'd have to rev the van motor to 3,000 rpms to get the suck needed... Atleast that was what I was told...

 

[roro]

Brian
http://www.transport.com.sg/cnpadmin/ph ... item/7.jpg
Vans like this are the most common vehicles used by carpet cleaners here and I think quite high in Oz also. Mostly they run conventional slide-in but they have been fitted with Hydramaster's CDS units.

roro

 

[Art Kelley]

I used to see Steam Genie PTOs in Astro vans in the eighties; Modernistic used some along with the Econolines in their fleet. They seemed to work fine, better mpgs, tighter turn radius. The limitations on available space along with the fact that full sized vans were cheaper and gas being under $2/gallon provided no savings so they weren't popular. Bawb might remember those days...

 

[bob vawter]

I used to see Steam Genie PTOs in Astro vans in the eighties; Modernistic used some along with the Econolines in their fleet. They seemed to work fine, better mpgs, tighter turn radius. The limitations on available space along with the fact that full sized vans were cheaper and gas being under $2/gallon provided no savings so they weren't popular. Bawb might remember those days...

yes Art...but you can't tell these peeple nuthing....
they are not human...!

 

[Brian R]

Brian
http://www.transport.com.sg/cnpadmin/ph ... item/7.jpg
Vans like this are the most common vehicles used by carpet cleaners here and I think quite high in Oz also. Mostly they run conventional slide-in but they have been fitted with Hydramaster's CDS units.

roro

I would like to see one in person. Photos are always difficult to get the "feel"


IMO, the Chevy Astro was the perfect size, shape, look van for carpet cleaning. That's all we ran with Chem Dry. Not the best on fuel but that can be fixed.
If that van could have a PTO or an ETM that ran off the engine........it would be a pretty good thing.

But again...for carpet and tile cleaning only. No WD or crazy box truck set ups....just daily residential stuff.

 

[Bob Foster]

Go electric

 

[Ron K]

Go electric

Maybe a Nissan SPLEAF !

 

[bob vawter]

I have a hydramaster hydra-van that was in a full sized dodge, but was also told they fit in the Chevy Astro vans too... problem was, the pulley is 1:1 ratio.. You'd have to rev the van motor to 3,000 rpms to get the suck needed... Atleast that was what I was told...

you was lied to son......!

 

[roro]

I would like to see one in person. Photos are always difficult to get the "feel"
[/quote]
Here's a PDF of typical lay-out.
http://www.cleaningsystems.co.nz/Parts- ... fault.aspx
Jim Bethel from Oz also posts a lot on this board of their fit-outs which are done to a high standard.

From a HiAce we would expect to get 600 Kms (about 300+ miles) before any major repair work and about 550 km ( about 330 miles) out of a tank of diesel.

roro

 

[idreadnought]

There were lots of hydramasters put into astro vans. But the gas you save is minimal and the reduced space is a huge drawback for most people. They are still available from time to time though if you are really interested. A guy in my town owns one.

As far as a truckmount in a vehicle smaller? 50 gallons of waste water weighs 400 pounds and then the machine has to weigh a few hundred. You are really putting too much weight for what they are designed for.

I liked Larry Cobbs idea of a small toyota box truck. I' m not sure what the fuel economy is but I'm sure running the machine would be less than most pto units

 

[lance]

I would think that getting the prototype set up and functional, and making sure all the small print for the van and equipment you are going to use is taken care of, the cost would make the risk of a small pto out of reach except for a large company that is already making TMs.

Duane can make a small 36 machine that probably fits into almost anything. And it will be dependable and work just like he says it will. Use a pump-out with a small waste tank and you have the power to clean furniture, tile, and carpets even 250 feet from the vehicle.

If you want a low priced pto then buy a used butler or hydramaster. Use the savings that you got from not buy new to keep the van in excellent shape and running condition. Used equipment is where it's at.