What is B&S

[Larry B]

With recent posts on here calling people B&S companies what is your opinion of what B&S really is?

Lets leave the basics out of this. We all know a company that offers a price of X over the phone then gets their and tells the customer they have to pay Y to clean is B&S.


Is upselling protector B&S?

Is telling people upfront the charges B&S?

A customer tells you no stains and you get their and the carpet is covered in pet stains. Is it B&S to charge more?

Is everything a company owner does to secure his customers B&S?

If a company offers better prices than you is it B&S?

On the same note for SQ FT pricing. If you quote a price for 300 sq ft and only clean 250 sqft do you change the price when done? Do you charge the price you quoted and the customer agrees too?

Is all out of the box advertising done by a company make them a HACK and a B&S company?


ALSO is all the trash talking in the open forum good for mikeysboard ? Its not just CC companies that stumble on this site it shows in searches for carpet cleaning. Do you really want a customer to see you trash talking every other company in the public forums of this board?

Its one thing to voice your opinion (or type) about a company offering $25 house cleaning and charging $500 when he gets their.

 

[Farenheit251]

16 years ago I was interested in the business and applied at a place advertising make $600-$1000 a week-truck or van required. $5.95 a room. The guy showed me a presentation book complete w/ giant dust mites and explained how to get the ticket near $800 and then negotiate down. To me that is bait and switch. I declined the job.

A few months later I met my future wife and neighbor. She was a single mom w/ 2 little guys and this guy had ripped her off for $273 for dry cleaning. Fast forward 12 years and I am at the office and this loser calls and is asking for a job. Seems he was down and out and couldn't even afford a vehicle,but he could show me how to make alot of money. That was a good day.

 

[Guest]

It is exactly as it implies,give an unbelievable price to get the job,then upcharge for everything you should have done in the 1st place but at a higher ticket then the guy who is up front.(Of course there are exceptions like red stains,pet ect.)

 

[Ken Snow]

Why would any of those things be bait and switch?

 

[Larry B]

Why would any of those things be bait and switch?

Thats what I am wanting to know. Every time something is posted on here that others dont do its called B&S.

So what is B&S other than whats posted first?

 

[hogjowl]

Bait and switch is no different than price haggling. Some people accept it for what it is and learn to deal with it, and others don't.

The simple truth is ... it's business and you have to live with it.

It is only illegal when the person practicing it has no intention of delivering of the underpriced loss leader.

Personally, I don't have one ounce of problem with it, and would probably be practicing a form of it if I were trying to keep a bunch of employees busy.

 

[harryhides]

There's an element in the general public that believe every "deal" no matter how absurd is for real.
Same crowd that bought a home knowing they could not afford the mortgage payments.

We all have customers that engage in "bait and switch" - "Um no carpet looks pretty good, I just want it "freshened up" - then you get there and it's a rat hole and they expect the price to be the same as quoted based on the lies they told.

 

[Art Kelley]

Why would any of those things be bait and switch?

Ken, Larry was just asking a rethorical question not meant to be answered. He was just scolding the posters here. Of course the examples he cited were not bait and switch although I would argue the one about a carpet full of pet stains doesn't require an additional charge. Odor removal perhaps, but not stains.
The one guy being called on for bait and switch was Greg Crowley who advertised on his website one price but usually had to upsell the job if the carpets were dirty, that is, if he felt it required mechanical preconditioning. To me, that is bait and switch, but not to the extreme of other companies that advertise 6.95 a room and upsell to $500.
It isn't bait and switch to sell additional services, but I think it is if your're upselling to something the customer already thought he was getting.

 

[Brian R]

My Definition of Bait and switch is really easy.

Give a price that no company can survive on over the phone or through an ad and then either upsale out of it or do a crappy job because the customer wouldn't have it.

$9.95 a room? Not in this area. Maybe somewhere that the price of living isn't too high but then you would have someone offering $2.00 rooms.

Good pricing will involve at least being honest in advertising and phone estimating.
Tell the customer that you need to see it before the price is firm, maybe give a ballpark. Then let them know that you have fair pricing, gaurantee work, The price you give them gets the carpet "Clean" not just wet, and they are under no obligation to let us do the work once we have given them a price in writing at the property.

Anyone else do this?

 

[renegade_cowboy]

[quote="Ken Snow":9d7usuvx]Why would any of those things be bait and switch?

Ken, Larry was just asking a rethorical question not meant to be answered. He was just scolding the posters here. Of course the examples he cited were not bait and switch although I would argue the one about a carpet full of pet stains doesn't require an additional charge. Order removal perhaps, but not stains.
The one guy being called on for bait and switch was Greg Crowley who advertised on his website one price but usually had to upsell the job if the carpets were dirty, that is, if he felt it required mechanical preconditioning. To me, that is bait and switch, but not to the extreme of other companies that advertise 6.95 a room and upsell to $500.
It isn't bait and switch to sell additional services, but I think it is if your're upselling to something the customer already thought he was getting.[/quote:9d7usuvx]


Greg stated that with "every" customer he felt that it had to be prescrubbed or the carpet was not clean. He said to the customer "it wont come clean unless you hav me prescrub" after he got there, not telling them on the phone about the extra charge. He also said that "if it looked like the customer wouldnt pay then he'd do it for free". Then after some attacks he then said "I tell customers sometimes".
Those were *his* words and majority mentioned that it was a *form* of B&S, not to the 5.95 a room guys. But if you advertise a price and get there and tell the customer it wont come clean unless.. that is B&S. You baited them for one price and basically made it sound like they had to buy the prescrub or the cleaning will be less than desired.

Some think that tatic is ok and some dont.

 

[XTREME1]

I have never said the things green one is saying I said. I always tell them on the phone with very few exceptions

first off I have no prices on my website Art.
And Art so prescrubbing with a 175 is soo common that a customer should expect that?
secondly I offer a full scrub with a 175 if they don't want that service that is fine. I don't charge for spots, stains even if I have to use a water claw. My steps are as follows
1. Vac
2. Prepsray
3. rake prespray in and treat spots
4. Rinse and extract (240 degrees coming from my apex) rinsed with a high end all fiber rinse
5. Groom

I tell the people on the phone that i prefer to prescrub because I feel it is a mucher deeper clean and It is $7 a room because it takes me twice as long. If they don't choose the prescrub I rotovac and and then wand.
I don't advertise lower prices and spring it on them it is an option I offer.

tell me how that is bait and swith price for 4 rooms on coupon is $99.95 with prescub $127.95

 

[Larry B]

[quote="Ken Snow":2dgaam17]Why would any of those things be bait and switch?

Ken, Larry was just asking a rethorical question not meant to be answered. He was just scolding the posters here. Of course the examples he cited were not bait and switch although I would argue the one about a carpet full of pet stains doesn't require an additional charge. Odor removal perhaps, but not stains.
The one guy being called on for bait and switch was Greg Crowley who advertised on his website one price but usually had to upsell the job if the carpets were dirty, that is, if he felt it required mechanical preconditioning. To me, that is bait and switch, but not to the extreme of other companies that advertise 6.95 a room and upsell to $500.
It isn't bait and switch to sell additional services, but I think it is if your're upselling to something the customer already thought he was getting.[/quote:2dgaam17]

I did want an answer to this question. Its not just what went on with Greg but everytime pricing or some other companies web site is posted on here people start ripping into what they advertise.

We all know the 6.95 a room and 100. a house has some B&S going on. I am wanting to know what others also think is B&S. If you look at the thread Mikey posted about "free carpet cleaning" there is an endless amount of people on here that will call anything B&S. Along with the kid from NE that posted the guy was stealing customers and had no business plan.

So to get it out in the open. WHAT DO YOU ALL THINK IS B&S?

 

[XTREME1]

http://www.25dollarsaroom.com

and this is the website for the other truck
my truck website is

http://www.xtremecarpetcare.us

neither site is finished

 

[Larry B]

http://www.25dollarsaroom.com

Thats some dirty carpet..

Greg this had nothing to do with you directly. My questions are more for the people doing the ripping than people doing the work.

As far as your prescrub a see both of your sides in that one but again this has nothing to do with your marketing plan.

 

[Brian R]

Affordable and Quality have no business being in the same ad.

Not that Quality work isn't affordable...It's just my opinion.

Stick with Quality and implement Value.

 

[XTREME1]

I know larry the truck running off that website doesn't have a 175 on it. It has the Rotovac 360 and original rotovac

here is the thread greenone is misquoting
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=19726&hilit=prescrub

Thanks Brian that website is going to be reworked I through it up one day and have not gotten to it.

 

[renegade_cowboy]

I know larry the truck running off that website doesn't have a 175 on it. It has the Rotovac 360 and original rotovac

here is the thread greenone is misquoting
http://mikeysboard.com/forum/viewtopic. ... t=prescrub

Thanks Brian that website is going to be reworked I through it up one day and have not gotten to it.

Greg it was the other thread that started the thread you posted. Your hot seat. The quotes are there.

 

[XTREME1]

you full of BS. I never said what your saying I said. Your twisting words, again. Now go get a life

 

[Brian R]

I need to get my website reworked as well.

Image is everything and Websites are a big part of that.

I'm afraid to invest too much right now in that. Most is going towards other advertising...but it all comes back to the website...does it seem like I am trying to convince myself...probably am.

 

[Eric Valentine]

Try going in at $39.95, keep saying that it is $39.95, then demo a rotary scrub. Quote 2 rooms at almost $250.00, then "discount" the whole thing to $119.00. Then finish the job in 35 minutes total with 3 guys and a porty. Use All laundy detergent to clean with, and leave it so slick, you might as well be walking on a wet, greasy tile floor.

I had to redo that job for the person I am subcontracting for. He did it himself, and the powdered laundry detergent that was impacted at the base of the carpet wicked up and left a layer of white powder on top. He charged for a rotary scrub, "sanitizer", and "Dupont Teflon Scotchguard", and only splash-and-dashed it with the laundry water in the porty.

I flushed it with DFC 105 in the rinse, and took almost 45 minutes, and LOTS of dry strokes. Turned out great.

 

[Greenie]

I don't care what market you are in, if you scrub and spot, and groom for $25 a room, you are out of your mind, that is worth $50 in any market, it's a business, not a job, get your head straight.

 

[hogjowl]

supply and demand

 

[Eric Valentine]

I quoted $50 to her neighbor for 1 room and a hall (maybe 100 square feet cleanable in her tiny apartment)

 

[captaincarpet]

Greg:

I like that "Dries In Minutes not hours"

great idea...lol

 

[renegade_cowboy]

Greg:

I like that "Dries In Minutes not hours"

great idea...lol

Dries in 1,440 minutes.

Its does sound better, minutes vs hours.

 

[XTREME1]

Greg:

I like that "Dries In Minutes not hours"

great idea...lol

Greenone not everyone is a hack like you. I use a big machine, glided wand, and airpath

That was on my truck long before I knew about mikeys board. I got it from a sealcoating company. I own a couple of the urls but chose not to use them. Plus zinsser primers has been using that tagline for about 100 years. There is nothing new. Everyone must have stole the Xtreme Carpet Cleaning Idea from me, oops I forgot I didn't come up with that I bought it

 

[Curtis Pennington]

http://www.25dollarsaroom.com

and this is the website for the other truck
my truck website is

http://www.xtremecarpetcare.us

neither site is finished

My Fresno state alumni I like your packages very similar to mine but I post pad not pre- scrub. Dont let these cod sacks get you pissed these keyboard cowturds charge higher than you,clean better than you and you suck unless they cleaned it.
It cracks me up when some of these clowns will bash your price,wand technique,chemicals and exception being if you own a PTO and come on here and whine....and forget to turn it on...sorry, got off subject.

 

[Larry B]

exception being if you own a PTO and come on here and whine....and forget to turn it on...sorry, got off subject.

That just pops up all over the place

 

[Ron Werner]

http://gethappy.ca/unethical_cleaners.htm
This is my take on B&S, it comes down to ethics. If you have to ask if its ethical, it probably isn't.

I posted my thoughts on dual price cleaning on the other post.

 

[Ron Werner]

Oh, btw I really hate the pictures of the RV against a Wand. It is SO misleading. The only ones that are fooled are the public.
They run the RV over the carpet, and its like a RX20, it swirls the soil, hiding a lot of it.
If the carpet was properly prepped, both would clean.