Yellow Pages

[BIG WOOD]

I'm seeing a common thread here that's really the heart of the issue. It really all comes down to who your target market is. If your target market is nasty rental properties and lower income homeowners, you'll have a tough time making a decent living. This is for the simple reason that these people don't have the money to pay. They typically install the cheapest crap grades of carpet which have no life span, and indeed you'd be better off replacing it. You all know the challenges of just trying to keep it looking clean. You can't polish a dog turd and turn it into a Cadillac.

You are absolutely correct about my target market. My target market is mostly millionaires and billionaires. As I've mentioned previously, we are about 75% commercial. Our target market is law firm's and opulent office buildings in Washington, DC. These are the people that have the money to pay and are willing to pay top dollar for the best quality. In a sense they feel that they are treating themselves to a luxury by spending more money ( like driving a Tesla or Mercedes or paying top dollar for spa treatments). They have a certain standard of living and are willing to pay to maintain and preserve that. So for them it's more about image rather than just cleaning something because it looks filthy. So if these kind of people have a bleach spot on their carpet, they think nothing of paying $1,500.00 to have it repaired. These are opulent office spaces that overlook the White House. They entertain VIP guests, celebrities, and politicians in these places and can't afford to have the appearance (reputation) of their facilities compromised. I'll post a photo of a couple of bleached areas that I just fixed in a law firm that I charged $1,500.00 for. The job took me about 25 minutes to do. I had a few of my trainees with me to observe the process. I think a couple of them are here in this group and can chime in with their comments. This was in a law firm right next to the White House.

I certainly get it and understand that not everyone lives in a city. My wife is from rural Maine. A lot of the people there live in houses that are in great need of repair. It's common to see houses with peeling paint and sagging porch is because the people can't afford to keep them up. I get that. But as a business owner you should be targeting people who can afford to pay for your services.

Consider changing your target market. Market your services to people that have the money to pay for top quality.

Regarding polyester and Olefin carpets… We just about never encounter these types of carpets because high-end commercial and residential properties would never install these junk fibers. They will always have nylon and wool carpets. Some of the properties that we service even have silk carpets.

Please understand that I'm not knocking or criticizing anybody who lives in an area that's depressed. As a business owner you can only do your best to establish your business and deal with the market conditions that exist in your area. I have nothing but respect for business owners and wish each of you the best success. You will never see me get jealous or make negative comments about someone who is doing well and becoming phenomenally successful. I love seeing other people's success and enjoy helping other people to achieve that success. Do I make money doing this? Of course I do. I don't give away my services for free. But I'm making money by helping other people make money, not by training someone and abandoning them with a good luck wish. There are 219 people in The Dye Lot who will attest to this. I go out of my way to help others to ensure their success.

Anyway, happy to help anyone who would like advice on how they can develop their target market. Many of you are doing well and don't need any help. That's fine. Just making the offer to anyone who would like some help or advice.

Here are the pics of the law firm spots I mentioned earlier.

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That's exactly my point. I do target the wealthy, but when they're not in need of my services, the property managers give me steady work.

It's rule #1 of being successful. You want to be profitable, but when the profitable jobs slow down...steady work is a NECESSITY to keeping your money flowing. And sad to say, the steady work is the majority of the work in my area. I've taken all the information over the years, and I've found that most of the business advice that comes from the mouths of businesses like yours, doesn't apply to the majority of businesses in our category.

 

[Chris Howell]

That's exactly my point. I do target the wealthy, but when they're not in need of my services, the property managers give me steady work.

It's rule #1 of being successful. You want to be profitable, but when the profitable jobs slow down...steady work is a NECESSITY to keeping your money flowing. And sad to say, the steady work is the majority of the work in my area. I've taken all the information over the years, and I've found that most of the business advice that comes from the mouths of businesses like yours, doesn't apply to the majority of businesses in our category.

You nailed it. "Businesses in our category".

The type of business that one operates will [to a large degree] determine what types of customers they will typically deal with. What types of customers does a pawnshop or a bail bonds service usually get? What types of customers will a yacht dealer attract?

It's really not so much about the service that you offer, rather the way you develop your market. I'm sure you know this, but many people don't. Cleaning is a great service, and a necessary one. But the amount of money one earns from offering the services fully depends on who they are marketing to and how they go about the process of developing their market. Again, targeting low income housing and apartments is going to produce very little income. Targeting AND DEVELOPING (the element that's often not done properly) the market for high-end properties will always produce superior results and ultimately a higher income.

It sounds like you understand these principles and are employing them. Care to share how you are developing this market? Flyers? Brochures ? Mailers? Google AdWords?

 

[jcooper]

Anyway, happy to help anyone who would like advice on how they can develop their target market. Many of you are doing well and don't need any help. That's fine. Just making the offer to anyone who would like some help or advice.

Chris, I appreciate you being here(and not giving up due to the constant ball busting).


You guys do understand... He does fix things other than apartments!

I have a fellow by us that does something similar(very busy). Doesn't even have to leave the shop. Area rug repairs are huge!

 

[steve_64]

The ball busting is the weeding out process. Chris has done well here.

 

[BIG WOOD]

The ball busting is the weeding out process. Chris has done well here.

I'm not done trying to week him out.

I still feel that it's bullshit charging prices where the President of the united states lives vs. the main service in my area being freaking lawn mowers.

$40/area can add up to $200/hr on the job if you are good at selling tile and grout cleaning, carpet protector, upholstery, etc. And saying that it's not a good enough service to be in kinda pisses me off from the pretty rug coloring boy.

 

[SamIam]

Think about it. I live just outside of Washington, DC. There are NO other companies who are providing the same services that we do.

Our ColorClean process alone keeps us busy (our process that cleans and restores the carpet color in one step).

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Talk about solution dyed!

Chris not to be a dick but in your last second Situation room Xmas eve post that was from a job You did the previous year.

I know you were saying they call last minute and you might be doing it again.

You also said most of the people going in with you were people you train not employees?

How long did it take to get them all clearance?

Did the White House give you at least a few days notice for these guys to get there to help?

Obviously they're not to close by because you have no competition in your immediate area.

I just thought there's no way logistically you could pull off a last second call and get a bunch of trainees approved to get in there.

 

[Chris Howell]

You nailed it. "Businesses in our category".

The type of business that one operates will [to a large degree] determine what types of customers they will typically deal with. What types of customers does a pawnshop or a bail bonds service usually get? What types of customers will a yacht dealer attract?

It's really not so much about the service that you offer, rather the way you develop your market. I'm sure you know this, but many people don't. Cleaning is a great service, and a necessary one. But the amount of money one earns from offering the services fully depends on who they are marketing to and how they go about the process of developing their market. Again, targeting low income housing and apartments is going to produce very little income. Targeting AND DEVELOPING (the element that's often not done properly) the market for high-end properties will always produce superior results and ultimately a higher income.

It sounds like you understand these principles and are employing them. Care to share how you are developing this market? Flyers? Brochures ? Mailers? Google AdWords?

GREAT point, JCOOPER. Doing area rugs (and I'm referring to cleaning them properly in a rug plant....not cleaning them in the customer's driveway using a truck mount, or worse yet....in the customer's home) is a fantastic service to offer. It's a niche and a speciality.

There's a difference between being diversified and having a niche. A dollar store is diversified. Their shelves throughout the entire store are filled with diversified pieces of junk made in China! Simply being diversified is not enough. Because MANY of your competitors are also diversified. In fact, their diverse services are often the same as yours. But having a niche skill is different.

So what's a niche? A niche is something that's unique that no other (or at least very few) people are offering. And THAT'S what will bring business to you....because they basically have no where else to go to get the service. A niche skill will also always result in higher income. Think about this for a moment: Which doctor earns more money.....the one who does a general physical exam or the one who can operate on a rare brain disorder? Obviously the specialist is going to earn more. AND....people will come from around the country (and around the world) to see this specialist because they can't get the service anywhere else. The doctors who can only do physical exams are a dime a dozen. Large towns and cities are saturated with them. Many of them either don't make it or barely survive. The specialist's business just keeps on growing and eventually all of their business is by word-of-mouth. They no longer need to advertise or market their services. In fact, they often will get to the point where they have people on a waiting list to see them. That's where we are at.

Remember this: Once you become recognized as an expert, people will come to you.

I recommend that everyone develop a speciality. A niche. It doesn't have to be color repair. But it should be something that's not offered by every other company out there (such as what I see in the Yellow Pages).

Having a niche separates you from everyone else. And it will be what keeps you busy because people who need the service will be coming to you year-round because it's not available anywhere else.

Thanks for the feedback, JC.

Wishing you a great day!

 

[Chris Howell]

The ball busting is the weeding out process. Chris has done well here.

If you're gonna give it ya have to be willing to take it!

 

[Chris Howell]

The ball busting is the weeding out process. Chris has done well here.

Glad you're making a good living and even MORE glad that you think I'm pretty!

 

[steve_64]

Glad you're making a good living and even MORE glad that you think I'm pretty!

It's the pony tail...

 

[Chris Howell]

Talk about solution dyed!

Chris not to be a dick but in your last second Situation room Xmas eve post that was from a job You did the previous year.

I know you were saying they call last minute and you might be doing it again.

You also said most of the people going in with you were people you train not employees?

How long did it take to get them all clearance?

Did the White House give you at least a few days notice for these guys to get there to help?

Obviously they're not to close by because you have no competition in your immediate area.

I just thought there's no way logistically you could pull off a last second call and get a bunch of trainees approved to get in there.

SamIam, the White House did not call us in on New Year's Eve this year. Having said that they will often give us 24 hours notice for a project that they want done. Usually they jump at a window of opportunity when the President and/or First Family is going to be away so that we can get into the areas where they work and live. President Bush was the exception to this. He made it very clear to the Secret Service that he had no problem with us working around him. In fact, I received an invitation to join him (President George W. Bush) at a dinner in recognition for the color restoration work that I did for him on their carpets. I still have the invitation and would love to share it if anyone is interested to see it.

Regarding the security clearance from the White House.....this is all handled by the Secret Service. That was a challenge, but I got everybody their full security clearance within 24 hours. I just needed their driver's license information and proof of US citizenship. As long as they have a clean background I get get people in with me. I've been working there for many years so they know me and I know the people that handle this, so that makes it easier. Tom Monahan was among those who joined us. He's here in Mikey's Board. He can attest to the speed that the whole security screen process was handled. I also brought in Rick Thomas, a Veteran that I trained completely free of charge as my way of saying "thank you for your service to our country". It was an honor to have Rick there and to see his reaction to be in the structure that represents the great country that he served and fought for.

 

[Chris Howell]

It's the pony tail...

That's it! I ain't never cutting it off!!!

 

[Bob Savage]

Chris,

If you are successful at doing dye work, then more power to you, but you are here trying to sell carpet dyeing to other cleaners.

You are going to have a hard time doing that because it is a niche market away from what cleaners are used to doing every day.

I have had my stab at it years ago. Ever heard of Treat Your Feet, Jimmy Jiles, Steve Greenberg (Dyco). Yep, I still have 30+ large containers of acid based dyes in my shop, along with a dye machine (glorified portable with spray wand), heaters, a couple of spot dye kits, etc. Are your dyes much different from those acid based dyes of yesteryear?

Your market is basically high-end commercial, and I do not serve that market because it is downtown with limited parking and hassles. You see I am small potatoes with only a single employee doing mainly residential.

Forget apartments, I tried that years ago. I did a few whole apartment dye jobs, and they were a hassle. Dyeing them did nothing for worn traffic lanes. Red spots had to be removed, bleach areas had to be spot dyed before you go whole dye, sun fading had to be feathered in, and they weren't willing to pay for what the job was really worth.

Our procedure was to fill the machine after prep work, place dye shields, and start spraying the carpet with the hot dye bath. Our dye machine had a recirculator that kept the dye moving inside the tank so it would stay evenly mixed. We evenly sprayed the carpet. Then we rinsed with the truckmount, and raked the carpet.

It looked better, but it was still worn, used carpet.

I'll never forget the last whole room dye job we did. We followed normal procedure, and could not get the dye to take evenly. Turns out the carpet was so full of soap residue from another carpet hack, the dye would not take right. You can't dye soapy carpet.

There was no way to tell there was so much soap in the carpet ahead of time, so that fiasco was my last dye job (circa 1986).

I still offer spot dyeing, and I'm really good at it, but few people want to spend the money to have that done here.

Our market area is over 500,000, and cleaning does very well for us.

Now if you want to move these guys to the D.C. area and set them up, they just might be interested.

Best to you.

 

[SamIam]

Actually I'm sure there's a few guys going to these classes or he wouldn't be doing them.

 

[Chris Howell]

That's it! I ain't never cutting it off!!!

Thanks, Bob. I actually sent you a PM this morning. Not sure if you saw it or not. I could tell by your answer to a post that you have experience and know what you're talking about.

Yes, I certainly recognize that I'm interacting with cleaners here. And that's great! They are the ones who can most benefit from adding a niche skill to their services. Again, it doesn't have to be color repair. It's [color repair] certainly not for everyone. It's much better suited for a high-end market where people have the money to pay for the services. Trying to transform a cheap nasty apartment or residential carpet into a Cadillac ain't gonna work! But for those who have access to upscale and/or high-end properties it could be a perfect fit for them. One of the things that I should mention is that we just about never encounter filthy carpets and/or unsanitary conditions. But that's because of who our target market is. If we're contacted by someone that that has those conditions (we require residential customers to furnish photos of their carpet to us prior to going to their home) we simply refer them to another company that doesn't mind working in those conditions. Those types of customers typically are just looking for a bargain anyway. They're not interested in quality and likely wouldn't be willing to pay a premium for our services and expertise.

Regarding your question on the dyes that we use....yes, they are night and day different than the dyes of yesteryear. I've shared this before here, but will share it again for you:

 

[BIG WOOD]

Chris,

If you are successful at doing dye work, then more power to you, but you are here trying to sell carpet dyeing to other cleaners.

You are going to have a hard time doing that because it is a niche market away from what cleaners are used to doing every day.

I have had my stab at it years ago. Ever heard of Treat Your Feet, Jimmy Jiles, Steve Greenberg (Dyco). Yep, I still have 30+ large containers of acid based dyes in my shop, along with a dye machine (glorified portable with spray wand), heaters, a couple of spot dye kits, etc. Are your dyes much different from those acid based dyes of yesteryear?

You market is basically high-end commercial, and I do not serve that market because it is downtown with limited parking and hassles. You see I am small potatoes with only a single employee doing mainly residential.

Forget apartments, I tried that years ago. I did a few whole apartment dye jobs, and they were a hassle. Dyeing them did nothing for worn traffic lanes. Red spots had to be removed, bleach areas had to be spot dyed before you go whole dye, sun fading had to be feathered in, and they weren't willing to pay for what the job was really worth.

Our procedure was to fill the machine after prep work, place dye shields, and start spraying the carpet with the hot dye bath. Our dye machine had a recirculator that kept the dye moving inside the tank so it would stay evenly mixed. We evenly sprayed the carpet. Then we rinsed with the truckmount, and raked the carpet.

It looked better, but it was still worn, used carpet.

I'll never forget the last whole room dye job we did. We followed normal procedure, and could not get the dye to take evenly. Turns out the carpet was so full of soap residue from another carpet hack, the dye would not take right. You can't dye soapy carpet.

There was no way to tell there was so much soap in the carpet ahead of time, so that fiasco was my last dye job (circa 1986).

I still offer spot dyeing, and I'm really good at it, but few people want to spend the money to have that done here.

Our market area is over 500,000, and cleaning does very well for us.

Now if you want to move these guys to the D.C. area and set them up, they just might be interested.

Best to you.

 

[Chris Howell]

Actually I'm sure there's a few guys going to these classes or he wouldn't be doing them.

Yes, our classes are pretty much full everywhere that we offer them. The reason for this is because of the feedback and testimonials from those who have taken the class. The negative comments only come from those who have never gone through the training.

 

[BIG WOOD]

Thanks, Bob. I actually sent you a PM this morning. Not sure if you saw it or not. I could tell by your answer to a post that you have experience and know what you're talking about.

Yes, I certainly recognize that I'm interacting with cleaners here. And that's great! They are the ones who can most benefit from adding a niche skill to their services. Again, it doesn't have to be color repair. It's [color repair] certainly not for everyone. It's much better suited for a high-end market where people have the money to pay for the services. Trying to transform a cheap nasty apartment or residential carpet into a Cadillac ain't gonna work! But for those who have access to upscale and/or high-end properties it could be a perfect fit for them. One of the things that I should mention is that we just about never encounter filthy carpets and/or unsanitary conditions. But that's because of who our target market is. If we're contacted by someone that that has those conditions (we require residential customers to furnish photos of their carpet to us prior to going to their home) we simply refer them to another company that doesn't mind working in those conditions. Those types of customers typically are just looking for a bargain anyway. They're not interested in quality and likely wouldn't be willing to pay a premium for our services and expertise.

Regarding your question on the dyes that we use....yes, they are night and day different than the dyes of yesteryear. I've shared this before here, but will share it again for you:

I'm not disagreeing with what you're specializing in. I'm pissed that you think cleaning carpet with our "money pit truck mounts" and marketing at "$40/room" is foolish. You're taking this at the wrong angle, because from what I know about you...you live in an area where business is handed to you.

 

[Chris Howell]

I'm not disagreeing with what you're specializing in. I'm pissed that you think cleaning carpet with our "money pit truck mounts" and marketing at "$40/room" is foolish. You're taking this at the wrong angle, because from what I know about you...you live in an area where business is handed to you.

Not knocking $40 per room. Just imagine that it would be hard to make a decent living that way considering all of the associated expenses with owning/operating a truck mount business.

Sorry. Business is not handed to us. We established and developed our market to create a database of repeat customers and referrals. BIG DIFFERENCE than having something handed to you.

So I'll say it again.....if you're making a good living cleaning carpets at $40 (or whatever) per room, then that's great! I'm happy for you Not knocking anyone's business.

 

[SamIam]

SamIam, the White House did not call us in on New Year's Eve this year. Having said that they will often give us 24 hours notice for a project that they want done. Usually they jump at a window of opportunity when the President and/or First Family is going to be away so that we can get into the areas where they work and live. President Bush was the exception to this. He made it very clear to the Secret Service that he had no problem with us working around him. In fact, I received an invitation to join him (President George W. Bush) at a dinner in recognition for the color restoration work that I did for him on their carpets. I still have the invitation and would love to share it if anyone is interested to see it.

Regarding the security clearance from the White House.....this is all handled by the Secret Service. That was a challenge, but I got everybody their full security clearance within 24 hours. I just needed their driver's license information and proof of US citizenship. As long as they have a clean background I get get people in with me. I've been working there for many years so they know me and I know the people that handle this, so that makes it easier. Tom Monahan was among those who joined us. He's here in Mikey's Board. He can attest to the speed that the whole security screen process was handled. I also brought in Rick Thomas, a Veteran that I trained completely free of charge as my way of saying "thank you for your service to our country". It was an honor to have Rick there and to see his reaction to be in the structure that represents the great country that he served and fought for.

I know you did it I think Tom
Posted about it here last year!

 

[Cleanworks]

When you see advertised prices in the Yellow pages or in flyers, keep in mind that is just the foot in the door price. It will be followed by a high pressure salesman/cleaning hack who will persuade you that you also need Scotchgard/deodorizer/flame proofing and whatever else they happen to be selling that day. Professional carpet cleaners don't advertise their prices, they advertise what they can do for the customer, in my opinion

 

[steve_64]

Advertise a high price.

 

[Lee Stockwell]

Yellowed pages from disuse.

 

[Chris A]

I'm not disagreeing with what you're specializing in. I'm pissed that you think cleaning carpet with our "money pit truck mounts" and marketing at "$40/room" is foolish. You're taking this at the wrong angle, because from what I know about you...you live in an area where business is handed to you.

I doubt very seriously that anyone who is successful in this business has work "handed to them.". I have no doubt that Chris has built a nice business by hustling just like anyone else. My beef is more that many instructors come from large urban areas and are disconnected from middle America, where a nice house cost less than 200k and 100,000 a year is a nice family income. Nobody is successful by accident

 

[BIG WOOD]

I doubt very seriously that anyone who is successful in this business has work "handed to them.". I have no doubt that Chris has built a nice business by hustling just like anyone else. My beef is more that many instructors come from large urban areas and are disconnected from middle America, where a nice house cost less than 200k and 100,000 a year is a nice family income. Nobody is successful by accident

I agree

 

[Loren Egland]

I always tell people that other cleaners that charge cheap prices per room are making more money than we do even though we charge 2 or 3 times as much pricing by the square foot.

It is just a different market that is out there and the by the room pricers don't understand how it works.

No right or wrong as long as you make your money.

 

[Bob Savage]

Not knocking $40 per room. Just imagine that it would be hard to make a decent living that way considering all of the associated expenses with owning/operating a truck mount business.

Sorry. Business is not handed to us. We established and developed our market to create a database of repeat customers and referrals. BIG DIFFERENCE than having something handed to you.

So I'll say it again.....if you're making a good living cleaning carpets at $40 (or whatever) per room, then that's great! I'm happy for you Not knocking anyone's business.

We only charge $30 a room, but do have a minimum of $90 for the first room. We can still easily do $800 a day, because of our business model.

There are 2 of us and we run dual wands on just about every job. This enables us to do an amazing amount of work every day, and do it right, without adding on all kinds of things that our customers don't need or want. We deodorize for free using a pleasant fragrance, because if it looks clean, and smells clean, it is clean.

Our overhead is the BIG advantage that we have. We own all of our vans (3) and equipment, and our shop, free and clear, so our expenses are very low.

It's not how much you make, but how much you get to keep at the end of the day.

In 31 years I have purchased only 1 truckmount, and still use it daily, so I have not had a lot of expenses buying several truckmounts (that truckmount has had 3 different vans). The other truckmount (an ETM) I designed and built myself, so we alternate using it too as a backup (it is 14 years old). My original ETM was built in 1988, and lasted for 15 years before I re-designed it to be more powerful and efficient).

Now I have a question about your dyes.

I watched your video at the sink. You first had blue on the carpet sample, then it was green.

Did you add yellow to the small dye bath to get green on the second go around?

 

[Chris Howell]

Now I have a question about your dyes.
I watched your video at the sink. You first had blue on the carpet sample, then it was green.
Did you add yellow to the small dye bath to get green on the second go around?

Yes, Bob, we added yellow on the second go around to change it to green. I had explained that in the video (you might have had the volume low/off).

Here's the video again:

Here's another similar video that I made a couple of months ago for someone who was asking/questioning how strong/concentrated our dyes are. I tell everyone that since the dyes are so concentrated that one dye kit is sufficient for hundreds of color repair jobs.

 

[SamIam]

Delivered 2 months ago!

I had to bump this!

He said phone book?


Hahahahaha

 

[Desk Jockey]

The negative comments only come from those who have never gone through the training.

No Chris, even if I went I'd still make negative comments.
I'm a broken toy, I can't help it. Its whut i do!