Dennis Bruder's advice to Carpet Cleaner nerds..

[Mikey P]

If you don't know Dennis' history in this industry, watch this video

He and were discussing super wands and super sprays the other day and something he said incited this here thread..

"Mike, all you guys should do what you do best, CLEAN CARPET.

Let us big guys worry about the tools and juice."


This got me thinking of all the gummy shark inventors I've known over the years and how many of them have had a TRULY successful transition between carpet cleaner to product engineer and then/manufacturer/distributor.

On my left hand I can count: (in no particular order)
1.Keith Studebaker
2.Cliff Monson
3. Joe Bristor
4. Hanks Bro's
5. Jeff Hruby
6. John Guerkink
7. Steve Smith


Still on the fence:
1. Erik/Zipper
2. Tom Conway
3. Saiger
4.Rob Allen
5. Grout Brush dude
6.




and IMO failures, and by that I don't mean out of business but has either abandoned ship or not growing and watching the ship sail away into the sunset
1. Greenglides...sniff
2. Shawn York
3. Maker Co
4. Sticky Tape
5. Sal Muscerela, Yellow cuffs, Penguin sprayer
6. Lift Buddy guy
7. Pulsation Trigger guy
8.


Flash in the Pans one offs..
1. DuckGard
2 Sticky Tape


I want to add John Labarbra as he was a cleaner, but I'm not sure he ever actually invented anything

Rick Gelinas, did he invent the polymer?

I'm leaving out all the garage truckmount guys like Duane and Nick as they never really invented anything.

----------------------


Getting back to Dennis' advice, there is far more money to be made cleaning carpet at $100 to $150 an hour than sitting up all night assembling gummy sharks in your garage and spending an hour on the phone with a carpet cleaner for each sale.


and another 2 hours when the goober puts it together it backwards or mixed it so strong the cat died and the brown out refuses to go away.














Please add to the list, I'm sure I forgot many ...Inventors..


@Jim Martin where should I add you?

 

[hogjowl]

And to think ... Taco calls ME a dick.

 

[Mikey P]

the truth hurts..

 

[ruff]

Different skill set between inventor/tinkerer and business know how like marketing, manufacturing etc.

Many of those mentioned though, I would assume just love doing it and many improvements in this industry came from them. So I, for one, am grateful.

The big guys have better lawyers though.

 

[dgardner]

Where would we be today if we had left things in the hands of one of the big guys - Harris Research?

 

[Mikey P]

Very grateful as well,


I certainly did my part to help many of them.

 

[Mikey P]

Where would we be today if we had left things in the hands of one of the big guys - Harris Research?

I was saddened when Lisa did not run with the bulls after winning her law suit.


Very anticlimactic..

 

[steve_64]

I like cleaning carpets. I like being an end user and not an inventor or innovator.

I like mindless production especially when it pays good. It gives me time for daydreaming.

I appreciate the guys who give us tools to make our jobs better but I have no aspiration to be anything else.

 

[Jim Pemberton]

Jim Roden, founder of Prochem
Cliff Zlotnik, founder of Unsmoke
Paul Richardson, founder of White Magic

I feel like an Academy Award winner trying to remember everyone that I should thank....

I'll add more when they come to mind.

 

[Zee]

"Mike, all you guys should do what you do best, CLEAN CARPET.

Let us big guys worry about the tools and juice."

There are some issues with that.

Those thinking of themselves as the "big guys" certainly come off that way sometimes and us lowly little carpet cleaners don't necessarily appreciate that...which is why you'll always have "little guys" trying to invent something to better themselves.
The other thing is the "big guys" not always understanding their own products and how they should work. Often designed by people that never clean carpets or do any actual work, therefore not understanding the issues with their own products.

 

[billyeadon]

Well this may not be politically correct but here goes: Large companies have got all the expertise, R&D, and money. But their main purpose is to create products that sell. A cleaner/restorer makes a product that helps them do their job easier without thinking about can I sell this product.

The classic example of this (who Mike forgot) is Kurt Bolden and the Extreme Extractor (HydroX).

To balance this out you have to look at when the inventor is smart enough to sell off their prototype to a larger company (think of the Studebaker fan becoming the much more durable AirPath.)

So I guess in the best situation the individual creates the product and sells it off to the larger firm the refines and improves.

But if you look at the last 2 decades I would say the small guys have been much more creative.

 

[Mikey P]

I got odds on Tom Conway to be one of the few who transition successfully.

 

[FB7777]

I got odds on Tom Conway to be one of the few who transition successfully.

Perhaps

His price points and knock offs are going to be his biggest headwind


I'd add Jack Mesheau of Butler to Pembertons list

 

[Mikey P]

Dennis and I just had a quick discussion. His life is slammed packed right now so him adding to this conversation wont happen until after the holidays.

The other thing is the "big guys" not always understanding their own products and how they should work. Often designed by people that never clean carpets or do any actual work, therefore not understanding the issues with their own products.

Sapphire's support of Keith Studebaker is....Legendary...


as well as their support of forums and tradeshows where most of all this cool new stuff grows out of.

 

[billyeadon]

Perhaps

His price points and knock offs are going to be his biggest headwind


I'd add Jack Mesheau of Butler to Pembertons list

Jack was not just a good technical guy but a brilliant marketer.

 

[Mikey P]

I can tell you this, in most cases with the backyard inventors, if they could have stayed busy cleaning 40 hours a week all year long....

Most of them would have never bothered.

 

[Bob Pruitt]

That brick of a swivel wand that came out recently shows that the innovation generally comes at the user level not a committee. Tom Conway wand as example. Innovation comes from the big boys only when their back is against the wall as the new Hydramaster CDS truck mounts demonstrate.

 

[BIG WOOD]

Me,




Lol

 

[Jim Martin]

all due respect but 99% of the " big guys " have no real clue as to what it is like in the trenches out there and the number of variables that we all face..and the things that can help us..
Toms wand.... Erik's zipper.....the Hoss...Vortex...Green glides...those are just a few things that have changed this industry...and if it wasn't for those carpet cleaners...we would not have them..
some of the absolute best things that have ever came out of this industry was from carpet cleaners..we know what we need...
IMO..we dont need to rely on the big guys...they need to listen more to what the carpet cleaners needs and wants are..the ones who listen and produce what we need are the ones who are going to be ahead...

 

[Cleanworks]

If people would just listen to me, I wouldn't have to build my own machines. I think that's what starts inventors off.

 

[Mikey P]

all due respect but 99% of the " big guys " have no real clue as to what it is like in the trenches out there and the number of variables that we all face..and the things that can help us..
Toms wand.... Erik's zipper.....the Hoss...Vortex...Green glides...those are just a few things that have changed this industry...and if it wasn't for those carpet cleaners...we would not have them..
some of the absolute best things that have ever came out of this industry was from carpet cleaners..we know what we need...
IMO..we dont need to rely on the big guys...they need to listen more to what the carpet cleaners needs and wants are..the ones who listen and produce what we need are the ones who are going to be ahead...

And yet 90% of the carpet cleaners out there dont know what any of that stuff is.

Hagopian
DA Burns
Stanley
Coit..
And all but two OO cleaners in both of my locations..

But the benefits trickle down eventually, if legit.

 

[Jim Martin]

And yet 90% of the carpet cleaners out there dont know what any of that stuff is.

Hagopian
DA Burns
Stanley
Coit..
And all but two OO cleaners in both of my locations..

But the benefits trickle down eventually, if legit.

and thats there fault...if your going to get into any industry..you better get involved and know what is going on...
by the time the trickle down effect hits them...we have already moved on to bigger and better things...

and the ones that are involved and have made the 7 day a week 24 hour a day commitment...they only listen to other cleaners...people they can trust..

the O/O that survive...rely on them selfs or other cleaners that they trust.....we know what we need...and we are able to figure out how to get it...

there is way way more to this industry then juice and machines...

 

[FB7777]

And yet 90% of the carpet cleaners out there dont know what any of that stuff is.

Hagopian
DA Burns
Stanley
Coit..
And all but two OO cleaners in both of my locations..

But the benefits trickle down eventually, if legit.

Beat me to it

The one per centers may believe themselves to be artisans of the suck mop

99 % of clients don't give a shit

Ergo mega expensive tools are pretty, but the human body isn't supposed to die on the end of a scrub wand

 

[Bob Pruitt]

I do think the trickle down effect happens faster as does obsolescence due to internet/Facebook. Big guys also have the muscle to just copy Innovators as is rampant in this Industry. Sometimes this make the new thing better and or cheaper but most often it's inferior to the original.

 

[ruff]

One thing that was not taken into account was the likes of this very board.
We talk to each other. Much to the dismay of some of the "big guys". Things have changed and they'd better listen to survive. The less they listen, the faster they will go the CleanFax way.

That said, every tinkerer/inventor out there is definitely at a production know how, efficiency and a monetary disadvantage.
On the other hand I guarantee you that had the big guys been involved at producing the Zipper, it would not have been anywhere as well made.

 

[Cleanworks]

One thing that was not taken into account was the likes of this very board.
We talk to each other. Much to the dismay of some of the "big guys". Things have changed and they'd better listen to survive. The less they listen, the faster they will go the CleanFax way.

That said, every tinkerer/inventor out there is definitely at a production know how, efficiency and a monetary disadvantage.
On the other hand I guarantee you that had the big guys been involved at producing the Zipper, it would not have been anywhere as well made.

It would have looked like the Bonzer.

 

[Jim Martin]

One thing that was not taken into account was the likes of this very board.
We talk to each other. Much to the dismay of some of the "big guys". Things have changed and they'd better listen to survive. The less they listen, the faster they will go the CleanFax way.

That said, every tinkerer/inventor out there is definitely at a production know how, efficiency and a monetary disadvantage.
On the other hand I guarantee you that had the big guys been involved at producing the Zipper, it would not have been anywhere as well made.

the number of cleaners that dont even know or realize the boards or all of the face book pages even exist is huge..
then take into account the things that people actually even talk about..how many things in the last 10 years has even came into this industry that were worth mentioning..the zipper..Toms wand..glides..all game changers..
and all came from a carpet cleaner...so what has the "big guys "come up with besides machines and pre spray..
and your 100% correct..toms wand...the zipper...not one manufacture that would of came up with it would of had the time and quality that was put into them..

 

[Cleanworks]

Same thing with portable machines. The big guys put out a lot of crap. Either under powered, or overpowered. When you try to do a little maintenance, you are overwhelmed with the task of disassembling half the bloody thing just to clean a water filter. Yet they hype the thing to the point of, if you believed them, you would never buy a truckmount. Until you try one of course. Then on other machines, they will tell you something equally as stupid as 7,000 sqft per hour.

 

[Jim Martin]

Same thing with portable machines. The big guys put out a lot of crap. Either under powered, or overpowered. When you try to do a little maintenance, you are overwhelmed with the task of disassembling half the bloody thing just to clean a water filter. Yet they hype the thing to the point of, if you believed them, you would never buy a truckmount. Until you try one of course. Then on other machines, they will tell you something equally as stupid as 7,000 sqft per hour.

someone posted this on one of the face book pages..skip down to the paragraph that says. The customer thinks they should have their carpets dry in 2
hours..pretty interesting..

http://www.chemeistersusa.com/Truck-mount-lie-1.html

 

[ruff]

Jim, it would have been much shorter to say that you just agree with me

Regarding your first point. Just check how many more members and people who are not members, yet view this board compared to just a couple of years ago and you'll see that things are changing.

This ain't our mama's old MB no mo.

Take Mike's transformation for example: From a chest thumping, testosterone infused vortex owner, he is now considered a saintly, wise grandma type.
And you claim things don't change