Discuss the Mike and Shawn ONLY thread HERE

Mikey P

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dude get ahold of yourself!!!!!! stop, are you ok man??? and where was vortex before blueline bought it?? if I remember correctly aerotech was once again building the machines, even though they had just been sued by shawn, they hated shawn over there. so if york gets the rights to vortex back, here is how it will play out, which is the same way its always played out, he will go to a manufacturer and tell them I need 5 machines built a month, sales price of each machine will be 100k, if an only if they are stupid enough to do it, (wait a minute what if they called up, aerotech, petersen, FMI or even blueline and asked what they think of yorkie) anyways lets say they do it, the pattern is set, what will happen is maybe, just maybe one machine will be sold a month, this will last for maybe a year. then said manufacturer will get pissed off, get in a legal dispute with shawn and cease making the machines, then its on to the next manufacturer, then what are the chances of the supposed next one not checking with the last 5 other companies, dude vortex is dead, its done, even with the dealer network and support of the entire established company of blueline, they even with a manufacturing plant already in place, already making slide in machines, already having management in place, so you see it costs them less money to make the machines as they already have everything in place. EVEN THEY CAN'T MAKE ANY MONEY DOING IT.

carpet cleaning fool, I am starting to think it should be carpet cleaning dumbass instead, your posts lack insight, they lack logic. mikey is trying to make you see the light. you would be best to take his advice, you are on your own with your machine, and that is just fine if you don't complain about that when the shit hits the fan. all of what I wrote up top is provided emissions and electronics even allow a vortex type unit to be installed.

its been established that york is a salesman,
if you are ok with buying a machine made by a soon to be pissed of manufacturer,
if you are ok with buying a machine from the guy in a van down by the river,
if you are ok with buying a machine from a guy who never inserts himself into technical discussions about HIS product,
if you are ok that you will have to rely on a past HOSTILE manufacturer for parts,
if you are ok about not being able to get any ideas on how to fix your machine after calling the guy ie salesman and not getting any answers on how to fix your machine,
if you are ok asking a used car salesman how to fix your car after you bought it,
if you are ok with knowing if the truck is ever totaled you have a pile a componets with no one to install them in a new truck,
if you are ok having to call jim martin and spending your sunday afternoon chasing a cluster phuck of wires while york sips pina coladas in costa rica.
if you are ok knowing any future new trucks may not exist and they may not support tapping the exhuast or electronics for a machine from the totaled truck.
if you are ok knowing shawn owns a name and one patent has little financial backing and has to depend on others to support and service and fix the machines.
if you are ok with the new manufacture never having built or designed a TM before, are you going to buy unit #1 from them
if you are ok knowing you could have 2 machines at two different locations making money at 2 different places for the same money as a new vortex
if you are ok knowing shawn has left a path of destruction and ciaos with every manufacturing company he has delt with.

if you are ok with all that, then buy a vortex, and jerk off daily to the picture of the zen fluid that mikey just posted.
 

Bob Foster

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George, they're right about this. If someone insisted you continue doing a service for a customer while it was loosing you a large amount of money, would you? Or would you look for other solutions to the situation?

I believe there will be people to take care of your truck somewhere somehow.

What we are witnessing is the natural demise of a product that's at the end of its life cycle for a whole variety of reasons.

. Very few buyers for this expensive truck due to the uncertainty in the economy and stricter borrowing requirements

. A loss of confidence and credibility from Vortex owners and potential customers in the Vortex brand. This occurred long before Blueline ever bought Vortex and even well before Blueline was acquired.

. Little to no profit for the manufacturer/distributor due to high cost of construction and support of legacy and orphaned components in a low revenue environment

. The ever stricter EPA emissions standards leave even the truck manufacturers scrambling to meet these requirements let alone a cab and chassis upfitter integrating their components into the exhaust system which is considered by the EPA to be part of the emission system. Have you any idea what it costs a manufacturer who modifies emission components to a truck to have EPA testing done on an emission system?

You will likely never see another PTO driven diesel powered truck built.
 

steve g

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so has shawn been run off from the board?? I know he was on here earlier today, he PM'd me. has shawn realized he stepped in cat shit right before he walked into the door of mikeysboard??
 
A

amazingcleansc

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steve g said:
so has shawn been run off from the board?? I know he was on here earlier today, he PM'd me. has shawn realized he stepped in cat shit right before he walked into the door of mikeysboard??

Hmm maybe it gives him extra ammo when hes suing Blueline for 1.2 mil for ruining the vortex reputation. That would make me stay and put up with the abuse.
 

steve g

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this is what carpet cleaning fool does everyday

xentherm_ad.jpg




142041fu2c5klj9.gif
 
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Sorry,

I'm sitting @ PHX Sky Harbor sippin suds and waiting on a jet airliner.

You boys are just gonna have to wait till I got time to open this here can of Whoop Ass I've been saving special for ya.

I'm just not sure if you shitheads are even worth me breaking my personal pledge to never argue with idiots and alcoholics.

The sad part is, you probably don't even realize who you are.
 

Bob Foster

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Shawn should appreciate that many of us have an opinion and concerns. What happens with manufacturers effects most of us even when we might not own or ever own a Vortex or a Sapphire Scientific product. We have every right to say what we choose, especially when it was arranged for him to have his an exclusive public debate with Mike.

It's obvious that your exclusive debate with Mike you insisted on having is nothing more than a big show for Bill Bruders.

For the sake of any future business Shawn might pull off with people around here he ought to address issues right here on this thread that were brought on this thread.
 

Ryan

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I'm not trying to get into this whole vortex thing I really dgas.

Does anyone else think its absolutely hilarious Shawn assumes that everyone that doesn't post their opinion must agree with him?



Edit:spelling
 

floorguy

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Mikey P said:
can you blame him?


No but i blame you..

as i see it he has brought up a few posts in a negative fashion, then never jumped back in to back his thoughts....

the doo daddy machine for one...
 

steve g

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floorguy said:
Mikey P said:
can you blame him?


No but i blame you..

as i see it he has brought up a few posts in a negative fashion, then never jumped back in to back his thoughts....

the doo daddy machine for one...

if you are talking about me, what do you wanna know, I can point out all kinds of stuff and name names if necessary. if you notice what shawn did to mikey was the same way he handled me, its almost like he is a politician. I first joined ICS back in 2004 we had this debate back then too, only difference is I was the only one saying it. if you back shawn into a corner, he will NOT address the accusations made instead he tries to say you are making too many accusations at one time. or you are not being specific, basically he blows a bunch of smoke without getting to the meat of the argument or claims issued. I don't think I have ever heard or seen shawn interject himself into any technical discussion or even have an answer when challenged by someone about a technical problem. which isn't that big a deal on the face of it, but becomes one as shawn portrays himself as an inventor, an innovator, a patent holder, designer of the machine etc. the reality is shawn tells whomever is the manufacturer what the machines needs to do, THEY DESIGN and make it. this is further evidenced by shawn wanting to give vortex to mikey and greenie and handle the design and manufacturer. so what that means is you are buying a machine from a salesman that will not technically support you with parts, will be sipping pina coladas in costa rica while you scramble for parts, and hope like hell the last manufacturer who is pissed off and lost a bunch of money will feel sorry enough and still have available parts for your machine. that is alot of hoping when you are putting close to 100k on the line.
 

floorguy

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ohhh no i can see he is like slime on a snakes belly...and for me seeing his slick marketing makes me go the other way almost immeditaly<SP>

i threw a jab at you :wink:

when you have poked in and taken shots at things, only to drop off the post...

kinda like stirring the bees nest only to run and let your friends deal with it

such as duanes machine...we never saw pics or anything else to prove it was "flimsy"

thats all....just a little "rub me the wrong way" thing...

and today i am in one of those moods shiteatinggrin
 

steve g

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floorguy said:
ohhh no i can see he is like slime on a snakes belly...and for me seeing his slick marketing makes me go the other way almost immeditaly<SP>

i threw a jab at you :wink:

when you have poked in and taken shots at things, only to drop off the post...

kinda like stirring the bees nest only to run and let your friends deal with it

such as duanes machine...we never saw pics or anything else to prove it was "flimsy"

thats all....just a little "rub me the wrong way" thing...

and today i am in one of those moods shiteatinggrin

no problem, I don't run off anywhere but at the same time if you look at this thread, if anything I think I have been over aggressive, today while eating lunch I thought good hell I have really roasted shawn, the strange thing is there is also a side of me that admires him just a little, I have a couple ideas on things I would like to make and sell on a mass production scale. or course not for the carpet cleaning industry. bringing a product to market is a huge risk, the item I am thinking about would only cost like 25 bucks, but I could easily see it requiring me to put everything I have ever worked for on the line to do it. there are also no guarantees. and what if someone sues you, they have some bogus patent a bunch of money and just use it like a club ala harris research, speaking of them I forgot I was up there a couple weeks ago I should have dumped out all my trash bags at their front door. :lol: the only thing that is funny is they have spend 100's of thousands of $$$$$ and plenty of people are still using glides.

honestly shawn I think would be better off doing something else, a good salesmen will never be poor.
 

floorguy

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Actually i have been rather impressed you stayed on it :) and if someone is or acts like an ass then they need to be called on it...

I have something still roasting in my oven that i cant decide/figure out how to air it, or if to at all. That I personally think is chicken shit.

but alas....as long as you dont care ifn i rib at you on certain occasions we will be ok :wink:
 

steve g

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so mikey why did shawn get canned from blueline??

and shawn I know you are reading this, why didn't you take the patent back and bunch of parts to build machines for $1 deal??? you know all blueline has to say is it wasn't commercially feasible anymore, so you could have had your patent back, it all could have taken place under the radar, a press release on fancy card stock could have been released saying, how vortex has been bought back etc and is now going back to its roots. noone would have known the real story, it was all on the down low instead you had to do this

funny-2.gif


and after blueline is done with your ass you will be like this


women%2Bwrestling.jpg
 

Mikey P

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Shawn got canned for being Shawn I would imagine, I don't know for sure but feel confident with that guess.



And Bruders offered Shawn back his patent/company and all inventory for a $1.00.


Shawn refused because he is pennyless and could not afford to handle all the warranty claims that his mentally retarded baby would generate.


But it's perfectly OK for Bill to pay out over $200K in claims since they took over that god forsaken contract.

Shawn sure picked a real winner to babysit while he tramped around in Costa Rica.
 

steve g

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Mikey P said:
Shawn got canned for being Shawn I would imagine, I don't know for sure but feel confident with that guess.



And Bruders offered Shawn back his patent/company and all inventory for a $1.00.


Shawn refused because he is pennyless and could not afford to handle all the warranty claims that his mentally retarded baby would generate.


But it's perfectly OK for Bill to pay out over $200K in claims since they took over that god forsaken contract.

Shawn sure picked a real winner to babysit while he tramped around in Costa Rica.

but wait your saying that as if shawn ever took care of the warranty issues, you know how that went when you had warranty issues or needed parts.
 

Mikey P

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In Shawn's brain every Vortex owner should be waiting on him to reinvent his baby and company.

Guys with problems should not do biz with Bill the devil but wait for him to stock his shelf with parts and find an employee who actually knows what he's talking about.

perfect example?

Shawn asked Ron Beatty to rat out Bill in writing.
Ron owns two Bluline built machines. Bill has bent over backward to make right by Ron and his truck's problems.


What do you think Shawn could do for Ron if his HX or Blower went out AGAIN next week?
 

ronbeatty

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In regards to the last post here let me clarify: I have written several post over the last weeks concerning the Vortex controversy. I have purposely not picked sides but have tried to be fair and honest about the facts. I value and respect friendship and business relationships and I want to compliment Mike and Shawn for the contributions that both have made to this industry.
Mike, you have brought to the carpet cleaning industry a extremely valuable way to solve everyday problems with equipment, chemicals, manufacturers by creating Mikey's Board.
Shawn, You created a cleaning machine that cleans like no other.
Now, to the point of my post. I have continued to do business with Sapphire Scientific because, at this time, they are the owner of the Vortex project. Bill has made reasonable accommodations for some of the problems I have had; there are still some things that are unresolved such as the blower heat exchanger design and the damage that has resulted.
Shawn did call me the other day to asked me for a statement as to my dissatisfaction with Blueline/Sapphire Scientific, which I declined because I believe they are trying to move in the right direction.
In the future, please refrain from speaking for me. I prefer to speak for myself. This will cut down on any misinterpretation or misunderstandings. Time will eventually sort all the facts out, both good and bad. I really do appreciate everyone's effort.
 

Jimbo

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Hmmm


Just a few candid observations.

1. Let's say a person bought a Vortex in 04 for say 68 k...and for the last 6 years did about 340k with it...so that is 2,040,000...and the V is worth lets say 25 k now...68 - 25=43k cost of equipment for making the 2 mill gross...so that is 2.1 % for the big tool to create a huge pile of cash...







2. Let's say it was a very good friend of yours that helped you obtain the BIG TOOL to make THE HUGE PILE OF CASH...maybe he even designed it...but now other people have become involved through the sale of the best friend's company a couple of times...and his hands are kind of tied in how much help he can offer...












3. To reward your best friend the very best way you know of for helping You have the Benefit of the BIG TOOL...to make the HUGE PILE of CASH....






















































You Kick him Right in the nuts!
 

Ken Snow

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Well said Jim, though I do think that more credit is being given to "the big truck" for making the money than it deserves. In my opinion the money has been made by a combination of all the things Mike or any business owner does to make their business succeeed, with the actual unit being a very small part of it, really just a tool. The marketing, drive, gumption, sales ability, quality of work and a host of other things are the bigger factors in my opinion.

Ken
Ps I do think he has kicked him in the nuts a lot, though it sounds like Shawn asked for it, and by my read has deflected most of the kicks and even sent some solid ones back. Problem is no one really knows reality between the he said/he said and it is probable that reality is somewhere else or in between, or simply the same in some cases with diferent perspectives of them i.e. they may both be right.
 

steve g

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Jimbo said:
Hmmm


Just a few candid observations.

1. Let's say a person bought a Vortex in 04 for say 68 k...and for the last 6 years did about 340k with it...so that is 2,040,000...and the V is worth lets say 25 k now...68 - 25=43k cost of equipment for making the 2 mill gross...so that is 2.1 % for the big tool to create a huge pile of cash...







2. Let's say it was a very good friend of yours that helped you obtain the BIG TOOL to make THE HUGE PILE OF CASH...maybe he even designed it...but now other people have become involved through the sale of the best friend's company a couple of times...and his hands are kind of tied in how much help he can offer...












3. To reward your best friend the very best way you know of for helping You have the Benefit of the BIG TOOL...to make the HUGE PILE of CASH....






















































You Kick him Right in the nuts!

your premise is that it was because of the big truck you made that much money, which I believe is false, yeah guys will disagree with me but they are the ones who spent 100k on a white elephant truckmount why would they agree with me. noone wants to admit a poor decision especially when it involves that much money. so what if half that money was spent on the unit so 34k and its still worth 10k, thats over 20 grand in my pocket, or a slightly used mustang with a blower on it. I will take the cheaper unit and the mustang with a blower.
 

Mikey P

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Said friend tied his own hands with his deals and didn't give a rats ass about how his baby was raised as long as the little tot made him money. Said also friend begged to be kicked in the nuts in hopes that the onlookers would take pity and crush the evil Goliath that just didn't want to get said friend's stink all over him.

You analogy sucks Jim.


If it were only that simple.



and the Vortex did not make my company who we are today.


My people skills and cleaning ethics did.
 

floorguy

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people skillz????? :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:




































just messin with ya hahah
 

Erik

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TIME AND CONVENIENCE!! You act like your truck :cry: is in the junk yard. ohh it wont make me any more$$$$$$
 

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