How different are rinses really?

[gimmeagig]

A while ago I switched to Chemeister's products. Grease Eraser and Action Extraction. Very happy with it. But I'm a little confused about the rinses that are out there.
Last week I ran out Action Extraction and for several jobs I used Prochem's All Fiber Deep Clean rinse which I still have a few gallons of.
Because every job is different I really could not tell if there is a difference. I think I prefer the Action Extraction, which is (I guess) more of an acid rinse. The carpet's seem to feel softer compared to the All Fiber Deep Clean which seems to leave kind of a slick film on the fibers, which I don't like.
But as far as how clean the carpet turns out, I'm not sure I can tell if one is better than the other.
Same with Liquid Slurry (I still have a couple of gallons left of that too). It's marketed to be for really dirty jobs, but again, in the past I did not really notice much of a difference compared to the All Fiber.
Other carpet cleaners and also custommer service at Chemeister and Jon Don told me that the biggest bang always comes from the pre spray. So is the whole rinse thing more hype that substance?
At this point, if I want more power, I just add citrus and oxy plus and maybe make my prespray a little more concentrated. Seems to work just fine.
But like I said, I'm a little confused about the rinses. How important is choosing just the right rinse? Do some rinses work better with different pre sprays?
Some cleaners just rinse with water....I'm sure that is not the greatest even if you are rinsing with soft water, right?
I'm just trying to stay simple and not have a million different products on my truck. At the same time I'm so new that I'm very open to trying different things. Like I said, the Chemeister stuff is very effective and it smells good too.
Maybe I have lucked into a really good line of chemicals early, I don't know....

 

[FLYERMAN]

Chemiester is a really good all around brand.

As for rinses some are better than others. Some because the do a better job (read, improve the overall cleaning). Some because they leave little if any residue. As for some working better with certain presprays I would bet that is not the case except in rare circumstances.

 

[Chris A]

I've gone back and forth between rinsing and not the last couple years due to intermittant chem injection issues. When I did/and now do rinse I've used CTI last step, PC Heat Wave, and now MB SoapFree. I never noticed a huge difference between the three, but I do notice a measurable difference between rinsing and just fresh water.

 

[Larry Cobb]

Roxy;

There is some new chemistry in the newer rinse agents.

The new acid components will prevent bleeding on oriental rugs.

Lisa W. demoed this feature @ Connections.

They will also help remove tannin stains like coffee from carpets.

If you don't use or have soft water, the rinses will leave a softer hand on the carpet.

Larry

IMO, RO water is the best rinse agent, but not many cleaners use it.

 

[Captain Morgan]

but I do notice a measurable difference between rinsing and just fresh water.

Measurable in what way?
Bill

 

[gimmeagig]

Roxy;

There is some new chemistry in the newer rinse agents.

The new acid components will prevent bleeding on oriental rugs.

Lisa W. demoed this feature @ Connections.

They will also help remove tannin stains like coffee from carpets.

If you don't use soft water, they will leave a softer hand on the carpet.

Larry

IMO, RO water is the best rinse agent, but not many cleaners use it.

Hi Larry,
I'm curious...What is RO water? Is that what the Zero Rez company uses?
The rinse I'm using, Chemeister Action Extraction leaves a very soft hand, I don't know how long that formula has been on the market but it's an acid rinse.I have a water softener on board and I still can tell the improvement it makes over the other rinses I've tried. That's mainly why I'm using it and also because ( correct me if I'm wrong) rinsing on the acid side prevents browning and slows down resoiling.
But as far as additional cleaning power I have not noticed any difference between the products I've used.

 

[Captain Morgan]

What is RO water

Reverse Osmosis.. type of water softening system
Bill

 

[Chris A]

[quote="Chris Adkins":dwrenfqb]but I do notice a measurable difference between rinsing and just fresh water.

Measurable in what way?
Bill[/quote:dwrenfqb]

Less post spotting, easier cleaning on the nastys

 

[gimmeagig]

What is RO water

Reverse Osmosis.. type of water softening system
Bill

I've heard of those for houses. Does a system like that make a noticeable difference compared to the standard water softeners? Is it difficult/expensive to install one of those systems in a van?

 

[Art Kelley]

Roxy, I use Grease Eraser every day and rinse with fresh water. All the different rinses (to me) are just voodo, like the need for prevaccing in order to do a customer pleasing job. If the water you use is soft, like the water here in Detroit is, then all you need is a good prespraying of the soiled areas which includes appropriate concentrations of special concoctions for those "special needs" areas. Flushing with a high flow rinse will take out all the chemicals you put down except for those small areas of "special needs" where a trigger sprayer with an acid side rinse agent is helpful as well.

 

[juniorc82]

ok so whats procyon a detergent or a rinse?

 

[Dolly Llama]

That's mainly why I'm using it and also because ( correct me if I'm wrong) rinsing on the acid side prevents browning and slows down resoiling.

nearly all the synthetic carpet you see will not "brown" , because they haven;t used jute backing (a natural fiber) in a generation

acid does nothing to prevent or retard rapid resoil .
"some" acid rinses will actually PROMOTE rapid resoil

Mix up some citric acid (used to correct cellulose browning) and feel how sticky it is when dry.
Most acid rinses use citric acid as a component ...they're junk and voodoo medicine for a non existent problem


..l.T.A.

 

[Dolly Llama]

ok so whats procyon a detergent or a rinse?

as i understand it, it's a water conditioning agent
( a component in all detergents )
Procyon just left out the surfactants of detergents


..L.T.A.

 

[Doug Cox]

Roxy- Why fix what ain't broke? I personally like a detergent with a softening agent. Right now I use Trashed Green.Its pricey at 50 bucks a gallon.

 

[joeynbgky]

Re: Re: How different are rinses really?

Roxy- Why fix what ain't broke? I personally like a detergent with a softening agent. Right now I use Trashed Green.Its pricey at 50 bucks a gallon.

Trashed green, is mainly a prespray. Why would u spend that much to use it as a rinse? Besides, u shouldnt use it as a rinse, use there crystal rinse

Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using Tapatalk

 

[gimmeagig]

That's mainly why I'm using it and also because ( correct me if I'm wrong) rinsing on the acid side prevents browning and slows down resoiling.

nearly all the synthetic carpet you see will not "brown" , because they haven;t used jute backing (a natural fiber) in a generation

acid does nothing to prevent or retard rapid resoil .
"some" acid rinses will actually PROMOTE rapid resoil

Mix up some citric acid (used to correct cellulose browning) and feel how sticky it is when dry.
Most acid rinses use citric acid as a component ...they're junk and voodoo medicine for a non existent problem


..l.T.A.

This is the stuff I'm rinsing with. I know that all advertising has a certain amount of BS in it and I'm sure this one does too.
I'm not a chemist and as I'm trying to learn more stuff I also get more confused sometimes. Like right now.
The Customer service person at Chemeister recommended the Grease Eraser as a prespray and the Action Extraction as a rinse.Which I have been using with good results.
Now that we are talking about what's in it I went back to the website for Chemeister and Jon Don to reread the info and now I'm not even sure if the Action Extraction is a rinse at all. Did I somehow get the wrong advice? It seems that the action extraction is a cleaner and not a rinse but then it says "with built in acid rinse" on the label. So what is it?
Am I actually rinsing with a cleaner? The carpets end up clean and feeling free of residue so it doesn't seem like I'm using the wrong products but I get the feeling I'm missing something here :?:
I'm going to have to call Chemeister on Monday, but in the meantime, could you guys look at this and tell me if I'm using the wrong stuff?
here's the Chemeister page
http://www.chemeistersusa.com/Actionext ... Info1.html
the data sheet
http://www.jondon.com/catalog/msds/MS-C ... 8b8f477495
and the Jon Don page
http://www.jondon.com/catalog/product_i ... 5b6da3f404

the instructions on the jug say to mix it at 32 oz per 5 gal jug so that totally sounds like the rinsing process.....unless it is really a one step process. Cleaner and rinse in one... but that's not how Chemeister explained it to me.Besides, there are probably a lot of guys out there who rinse with just water, but who doesn't prespray?

here's the page for the Grease Eraser. It works a lot better that the Ultrapac I've used before.
http://www.chemeistersusa.com/GreaseEraserInfo1.html

Anyway,I'm confused.I'd love for you guys to shed a little light on this for me.
Thanks

 

[Dolly Llama]

Roxy, I'm not a chemist either .
But i can tell you most cleaners (that have a clue) know MORE than 72.63% of those on the supply side of the biz .
I'll also tell you that half of them wipe their azz like this;
(hand wiping across MOUTH)

if whatever you're using works for you, and you;re getting referrals and peeps are calling you back every year to clean their stuff, don't over think it..it's just cleaning, man


..l.T.A.

 

[Doug Cox]

Re: Re: How different are rinses really?

Roxy- Why fix what ain't broke? I personally like a detergent with a softening agent. Right now I use Trashed Green.Its pricey at 50 bucks a gallon.

Trashed green, is mainly a prespray. Why would u spend that much to use it as a rinse? Besides, u shouldnt use it as a rinse, use there crystal rinse

Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using Tapatalk

Trashed Green can be used as a prespray OR detergent. Joey- Maybe when you make millions like me I will listen to you about what detergent I use.

 

[ACE]

Roxy;

There is some new chemistry in the newer rinse agents.

The new acid components will prevent bleeding on oriental rugs.

Lisa W. demoed this feature @ Connections.

They will also help remove tannin stains like coffee from carpets.

If you don't use soft water, they will leave a softer hand on the carpet.

Larry

IMO, RO water is the best rinse agent, but not many cleaners use it.

Larry, Larry, Larry

What are you talking about? Acids like acidic acid have been used as Tannin spotters and to clean sensitive dyes for decades. What “new” chemistry are you talking about? I would not mind that every post you make is to sell you products if your advice sounded knowable.

 

[gimmeagig]

Roxy, I'm not a chemist either .
But i can tell you most cleaners (that have a clue) know MORE than 72.63% of those on the supply side of the biz .
I'll also tell you that half of them wipe their azz like this;
(hand wiping across MOUTH)

if whatever you're using works for you, and you;re getting referrals and peeps are calling you back every year to clean their stuff, don't over think it..it's just cleaning, man


..l.T.A.

 

[joeynbgky]

Re: Re: Re: How different are rinses really?

[quote="Doug Cox":2kgesa0p]Roxy- Why fix what ain't broke? I personally like a detergent with a softening agent. Right now I use Trashed Green.Its pricey at 50 bucks a gallon.

Trashed green, is mainly a prespray. Why would u spend that much to use it as a rinse? Besides, u shouldnt use it as a rinse, use there crystal rinse

Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using Tapatalk

Trashed Green can be used as a prespray OR detergent. Joey- Maybe when you make millions like me I will listen to you about what detergent I use.[/quote:2kgesa0p]
Umm. I like it as a ps, but not a rinse. If ur making millions, congrats lmao

Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using Tapatalk

 

[Captain Morgan]

Hi Roxy, as some others have mentioned to you already.. keep using what works. I've found myself getting confused by terminology used interchangabley and can sometimes get twisted around, leading to confusion.

I don't think it's been proven that an acid side rinse will remove supposed left behind carpet detergents from alkaline cleaning products any better or worse than any alkaline rinse will. It's all a smoke screen to keep 'em guessin'.

Confusion sells a lot of product.

Bill

 

[Larry Cobb]

The new acid rinses are more effective at removing the alkaline residues from typical presprays.

They don't have the disagreeable odor of vinegar (not that new).

Some of the brand new chemistry is surfactants,
that do not resoil and work at lower concentrations than the ones used previously.

Larry

 

[sam miller]

A while ago I switched to Chemeister's products. Grease Eraser and Action Extraction. Very happy with it. But I'm a little confused about the rinses that are out there.
Last week I ran out Action Extraction and for several jobs I used Prochem's All Fiber Deep Clean rinse which I still have a few gallons of.
Because every job is different I really could not tell if there is a difference. I think I prefer the Action Extraction, which is (I guess) more of an acid rinse. The carpet's seem to feel softer compared to the All Fiber Deep Clean which seems to leave kind of a slick film on the fibers, which I don't like.
But as far as how clean the carpet turns out, I'm not sure I can tell if one is better than the other.
Same with Liquid Slurry (I still have a couple of gallons left of that too). It's marketed to be for really dirty jobs, but again, in the past I did not really notice much of a difference compared to the All Fiber.
Other carpet cleaners and also custommer service at Chemeister and Jon Don told me that the biggest bang always comes from the pre spray. So is the whole rinse thing more hype that substance?
At this point, if I want more power, I just add citrus and oxy plus and maybe make my prespray a little more concentrated. Seems to work just fine.
But like I said, I'm a little confused about the rinses. How important is choosing just the right rinse? Do some rinses work better with different pre sprays?
Some cleaners just rinse with water....I'm sure that is not the greatest even if you are rinsing with soft water, right?
I'm just trying to stay simple and not have a million different products on my truck. At the same time I'm so new that I'm very open to trying different things. Like I said, the Chemeister stuff is very effective and it smells good too.
Maybe I have lucked into a really good line of chemicals early, I don't know....

Every carpet is different so unless You have two premixxed solutions in your truck you could swap out in the same house You might not be comparing apples to apples!

I would say a detergent rinse is better for heavy soiled carpet acid rinse's for light to moderate. if your applying teflon or scothgaurd then rinsing out the carpet with a low ph rinse is best! and Keep a separate bottle of citrus in a hand sprayer for stuff the rinse may need help with. The pre spray reallly is doing most of the work. try not pre spraying and see!

 

[floorguy]

ok so what works the best on taking out "hard water" on carpet???

Have a job to do, they have a fountain, that likes to "spit" water, and has left an orangish staining

 

[Danny Strickland]

Re: Re: How different are rinses really?

[quote="Doug Cox":y2ebb6pv]Roxy- Why fix what ain't broke? I personally like a detergent with a softening agent. Right now I use Trashed Green.Its pricey at 50 bucks a gallon.

Trashed green, is mainly a prespray. Why would u spend that much to use it as a rinse? Besides, u shouldnt use it as a rinse, use there crystal rinse

Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using Tapatalk

Trashed Green can be used as a prespray OR detergent. Joey- Maybe when you make millions like me I will listen to you about what detergent I use.[/quote:y2ebb6pv]



If there was a BITCH SLAP icon, it would have been used at the end of that post!!!!!

 

[Captain Morgan]

The new acid rinses are more effective at removing the alkaline residues from typical presprays.

They don't have the disagreeable odor of vinegar (not that new).

Some of the brand new chemistry is surfactants,
that do not resoil and work at lower concentrations than the ones used previously.

Larry

What has changed Larry to produce such results? How do the surfactants work over older products used? Have all manufacturers made these changes or just your products?
Thanks for being a little more specific and if you can not go all Shawn Forsythe on me, that would be great. :mrgreen:
Thanks,
Bill

 

[Loren Egland]

Back in the old days, we used one step steam cleaning. Look at the last 4 pictures on the bottom row of this web page: http://www.northlandakitas.com/delta/gallery.htm These were cleaned with Steam Way Formula A through the truck mount without any prespray.

Here is the same one step cleaning but with a Steam Way portable: http://www.northlandakitas.com/delta/rochester.htm

 

[Jimmy L]

Is everything steamway so sacred?

 

[hogjowl]

Just use whatever your local supplier sells, if it's a name brand product. Otherwise, flip a coin to decide what bulletin board shill to buy from. They are all the same.