pro 1200 owners...question

[Lee Stockwell]

I would, but you'd never hear about it.

 

[Mikey P]

exactly.

 

[hogjowl]

Most thinking people wouldn't, without prior mfg approval.

 

[Russ T.]

I would with a clear conscience, if I couldn't get my rig fixed ASAP otherwise.

Way too expensive to have to wait.

 

[hogjowl]

I think he did the logical thing. He came here for advice, got a BUNCH, and then the mfg. stepped in. At that point, there was no need to go outside the loop.

 

[Desk Jockey]

I've never done it with a cleaning unit but serveral times with vehicles. When running a vehicle to KC for warranty meant two tech's two vehicles and fuel it was easier to pay out of pocket than run around trying to save a few dollars.

I think it depends on cost and if it would invalidate the warranty

 

[Russ T.]

There needs to be a guarantee by the manufacturer that the machine under warranty will be fixed properly in a specific timely manor.

Is that not the case?

If not, Butler is sounding better and better...

 

[Mikey P]

Russ do you think that Interlink would have been any happier to see a Butler come in?


Personally I don't mind fixing other cleaners mistake but most don't want to get involved.

 

[Russ T.]

No, I'm just thinking for me it might be the best way to insure quick turnaround on a repair. I'm 2.5 hours from Interlink so I'd plan on doing most repairs myself. Tons of farming supply places or mechanics around that would probably see the Butler as pretty simple and be able to help me in a pinch.

 

[Mikey P]

All truckmounts need work Russ...


They all rattle, rust, split, peel and crack and pop!


If you want one that's a breeze to fix, get a Portable.

 

[Russ T.]

I know they all need work.

Who is going to work on it and how fast are the questions most important to us cleaners.

My comment about Butler was true for me I think.

The guys in KC at Full Circle got me in quick for routine maintenance on my Cleanco last Spring. That was great but I planned for it. The real test will be what happens when it breaks suddenly?

 

[Ray Burnfield]

If you are our customer or maybe want to be our customer we will help you troubleshoot or repair over the phone or email. Pictures help tremendously if you see something broken. Marty is correct (I know) about cost to get warranty service vs doing it yourself. We will ship the part to them and ask to have the defective part sent back to us so we can submit for warranty. If the warranty is declined then we bill you for the part. I don't think that has ever happened on a warranty claim that we have submitted.
With all this being discussed, the important issue is to find a distributor that will take care of you.
Here in the bay area we have customers that are 6 hours away. They are loyal in supporting our business and they call us anytime they have a problem.
We help them if they can fix the problem themselves or we are ready when they get to the shop.
I think that is why they buy from us.
Buy some stuff from a company that will help you. You really don't get the best deal by buying at the cheapest price.
I can always find a cheaper price if I want but that's all I get is the best price. Nothing else.
I'm ranting and I need to stop!

 

[Mikey P]

I guess I have to wonder how Olsen would have handled this...

Had he been given the chance.

 

[Able 1]

I am wondering if the reason the bearing went out so soon because of the increase in rpms.. How many miles do you have on the van, Dave?

 

[Ray Burnfield]

I guess I have to wonder how Olsen would have handled this...

Had he been given the chance.

He would have told them to call Sapphire I'm sure.

 

[Mikey P]

Who is them?


IMO, Dave should have called John first thing. Whom I'm sure would have done the leg work to have gotten this resolved in more expedient and less dramatic manner

 

[Ray Burnfield]

I guess Dave and you are probably right. I started to think that I was the only distributor to handle this correctly.

 

[dgardner]

I am wondering if the reason the bearing went out so soon because of the increase in rpms..

Unlikely - the bearing only spins when the vehicle is not running the pto, like when the vehicle is being driven. During that time it sees much higher RPM than when cleaning anyway.

 

[KevinL]

So sorry I didn't see this sooner David. Remember a few months ago when I had to have my driveshaft replaced was because I let that clutch run bad for so long. The reason it cost me $5000 was because I took it to a local car repair shop that had replaced it a year before. They ordered a new clutch from Sapphire without telling them it was off a 2006. WE got the wrong clutch and it wouldn't line up properly. Then we bought a used clutch bracket from jondon in New Hampshire. That service manager from jondon told my shop that it had to be lined up perfect or the clutch would go out again. My shop didn't feel comfortable doing the work so I took it to jondon in Roselle. A 3 hour trip each way. They couldn't make the new bracket work so they had to order a new shaft and clutch. Now it's getting expensive and it will take a week so they disconnected it and I drove it home until the new shaft came in. Then I had to drive it back up there and miss more work. When I took it back for the exchange was when I attended the rug symposium. Well after 3 days it wasn't done so I drove my rental car back home. That cost an extra $150 on top of the 3 day rental + the fine for the toll booth I missed. ( Chicago sucks). Then after driving back up there again to get it, I get it home and it won't even engage. I had to drive it back up to jondon and sit there all day while they diagnosed the problem. I believe it turned out to be a lose wire. I wonder who caused that?? Then on the return trip I stop to eat and then the truck wouldn't start. Starter went out. $100 tow across the street on a Friday afternoon and I had to leave it while my wife came up to get me. Lucky she doesn't work on Fridays. Had to leave it at that shop until Monday. $700 for a new starter and battery and then a final trip up to shitcago to get it. Less than a month later the new clutch starts making the same noise and it's another trip to Chitown for a new clutch. Starting to sound like fun yet? It's been running fine since. So now you know "the rest of the story".

 

[dgardner]

Yikes.....

 

[Ray Burnfield]

Do you have a White Magic Pro-1200 or a Sapphire Pro-1200?
White Magic is out of the business.

 

[Able 1]

Give me a slide in any day over that BS..

 

[dealtimeman]

So sorry I didn't see this sooner David. Remember a few months ago when I had to have my driveshaft replaced was because I let that clutch run bad for so long. The reason it cost me $5000 was because I took it to a local car repair shop that had replaced it a year before. They ordered a new clutch from Sapphire without telling them it was off a 2006. WE got the wrong clutch and it wouldn't line up properly. Then we bought a used clutch bracket from jondon in New Hampshire. That service manager from jondon told my shop that it had to be lined up perfect or the clutch would go out again. My shop didn't feel comfortable doing the work so I took it to jondon in Roselle. A 3 hour trip each way. They couldn't make the new bracket work so they had to order a new shaft and clutch. Now it's getting expensive and it will take a week so they disconnected it and I drove it home until the new shaft came in. Then I had to drive it back up there and miss more work. When I took it back for the exchange was when I attended the rug symposium. Well after 3 days it wasn't done so I drove my rental car back home. That cost an extra $150 on top of the 3 day rental + the fine for the toll booth I missed. ( Chicago sucks). Then after driving back up there again to get it, I get it home and it won't even engage. I had to drive it back up to jondon and sit there all day while they diagnosed the problem. I believe it turned out to be a lose wire. I wonder who caused that?? Then on the return trip I stop to eat and then the truck wouldn't start. Starter went out. $100 tow across the street on a Friday afternoon and I had to leave it while my wife came up to get me. Lucky she doesn't work on Fridays. Had to leave it at that shop until Monday. $700 for a new starter and battery and then a final trip up to shitcago to get it. Less than a month later the new clutch starts making the same noise and it's another trip to Chitown for a new clutch. Starting to sound like fun yet? It's been running fine since. So now you know "the rest of the story".

Let it out it will make you feel a bit better, did jondon help with any of the inconveniences due to the failure of their repair?

 

[Zee]

So sorry I didn't see this sooner David. Remember a few months ago when I had to have my driveshaft replaced was because I let that clutch run bad for so long. The reason it cost me $5000 was because I took it to a local car repair shop that had replaced it a year before. They ordered a new clutch from Sapphire without telling them it was off a 2006. WE got the wrong clutch and it wouldn't line up properly. Then we bought a used clutch bracket from jondon in New Hampshire. That service manager from jondon told my shop that it had to be lined up perfect or the clutch would go out again. My shop didn't feel comfortable doing the work so I took it to jondon in Roselle. A 3 hour trip each way. They couldn't make the new bracket work so they had to order a new shaft and clutch. Now it's getting expensive and it will take a week so they disconnected it and I drove it home until the new shaft came in. Then I had to drive it back up there and miss more work. When I took it back for the exchange was when I attended the rug symposium. Well after 3 days it wasn't done so I drove my rental car back home. That cost an extra $150 on top of the 3 day rental + the fine for the toll booth I missed. ( Chicago sucks). Then after driving back up there again to get it, I get it home and it won't even engage. I had to drive it back up to jondon and sit there all day while they diagnosed the problem. I believe it turned out to be a lose wire. I wonder who caused that?? Then on the return trip I stop to eat and then the truck wouldn't start. Starter went out. $100 tow across the street on a Friday afternoon and I had to leave it while my wife came up to get me. Lucky she doesn't work on Fridays. Had to leave it at that shop until Monday. $700 for a new starter and battery and then a final trip up to shitcago to get it. Less than a month later the new clutch starts making the same noise and it's another trip to Chitown for a new clutch. Starting to sound like fun yet? It's been running fine since. So now you know "the rest of the story".

Hoowlyyyy sheeeeet..... I would have poured gasoline all over it and walked away with a lit match flying backwards... to burn that crap...

 

[Zee]

Give me a slide in any day over that BS..

I say the same thing....!!

 

[Mikey P]

Do you have a White Magic Pro-1200 or a Sapphire Pro-1200?
White Magic is out of the business.

Kevin said it was a 2006, so MW.


There's a reason Hagopian dumps their CDS units every four years or 100 miles..
They don't have the time to baby the hell out of them once they've had either an engine or tranny replaced.



Take a guy like Dave Gill. He started with Butlers got tired of dealing with aging CDS units so tried to move over to Slide In's.
Two years later he realized he'd be more headache free running crews on CDS set ups.

He just recently faced up to the fact that he too will be buying a new one very 10000 miles or so and letting very handy and observant Owner Op buy his old units.

 

[Art Kelley]

Give me a slide in any day over that BS..

No thank you , please. Ask Marty about replacing the lawn mower motor every 2300 hours. Now THAT'S BS. A properly installed driveshaft system will go a decade or more ( the 3 I have owned have, at least ) before the bearing starts to whine, giving you ample opportunity to replace. I had my front clutch replaced last summer after 11 years to stop the whining and that cost about 1/10 the price of a new LM motor. It should be good until 2026. or until I die.

 

[Jim Martin]

No thank you , please. Ask Marty about replacing the lawn mower motor every 2300 hours. Now THAT'S BS. A properly installed driveshaft system will go a decade or more ( the 3 I have owned have, at least ) before the bearing starts to whine, giving you ample opportunity to replace. I had my front clutch replaced last summer after 11 years to stop the whining and that cost about 1/10 the price of a new LM motor. It should be good until 2026. or until I die.

No thanks.......I cut my teeth on a direct drive unit...from there I ran a P.T.O......

I run slide in's now and there is no way I would ever go back....

 

[Mark Saiger]

In the extreme temps I deal with (a few months of the year ) direct drives work best for us.

We also do a pretty regimented maintenance on them of oil changes, blower and cat pump oil changes....wash daily....

We have some direct drive Butlers with equivalent of 650,000 miles on the motor (250,000 on the drivetrain and motor) and still not taking oil and still running like champs. The Butler units have over 11,000 hours on them as well....They have become part time cleaners for some people and or backups....

But with proper maintenance, they can be very reliable units for us....again, somewhat owner operators here.....

Any mechanical thing in the world can be a problem....

I am very spoiled with the heat we get out of the units (and in the cold) and the performance and ease of use...especially in cold temps....heck....even in hot temps....

All 6 days of summer we get here in Minnesota

 

[Art Kelley]

No thanks.......I cut my teeth on a direct drive unit...from there I ran a P.T.O......

I run slide in's now and there is no way I would ever go back....

That's very encouraging to hear your experience with the 570, as you run it in some of the harshest temperatures in the country. Heat is probably the worst thing for any TM, especially slide-ins, and it seems like Sapphire has addressed the problem of premature component failure in their line of slide-ins with the fan cooling systems. Time will tell, as they are relatively new machines but I like what you are saying. Who knows, we may all be forced to use machines with big loud stinky lawn mower motors inside our vans once the GM vans are replaced with Euro style in five years.