had a discussion with someone today about "bonded insert" charges. if you are at a customers home and are scheduled to do the cleaning and you discover there are 4 insert repairs in the home take can be done how do you charge? i argue that a discount is in order. after all you dont want to exceed over half the expense to replace the room. how would you charge? I go at this point at how much time its going to take me to do the repair. not $85 each. what say you?
repair question
- Thread starter Bucey
- Start date
Becker
Member
Ummm, I'll take a stab at trying to answer.
With any additional work it is not subject to minimum charge if I'm there.
Additional work beyond list prices for standard work is priced like this..
time x target rate per hour = price.
With any additional work it is not subject to minimum charge if I'm there.
Additional work beyond list prices for standard work is priced like this..
time x target rate per hour = price.
sweendogg
Member
Say you clean the room for an $85.00 minimum charge say its 300 sqft (15x20)... then add four patches at 85.00 each... so total comes to
sweendogg
Member
Ha.. sorry didn't realize I didn't finish the thought.
425.. depending on many factors it may be worth it to them to have it patched.. BUT I agree that if its large enough to charge 85.00 per patch.. and there are four areas.. Its going to look very bad when finished.... Now if they are little 4 inch by 4 inch areas that can be corrected with a cookie cutter.. then it may be ok.. but 85 dollars in this case would be overboard.
425.. depending on many factors it may be worth it to them to have it patched.. BUT I agree that if its large enough to charge 85.00 per patch.. and there are four areas.. Its going to look very bad when finished.... Now if they are little 4 inch by 4 inch areas that can be corrected with a cookie cutter.. then it may be ok.. but 85 dollars in this case would be overboard.
thats what i'm getting at. Bonded inserts have there value when they can be repaired and considered small. but to repair 4 areas in a room that are huge then i could only serve my customer by recommending the room to be replaced. I think becker has it right when considering multiple inserts and you are there to clean as well then it can be justified by price x time. Just my opinion.
Whats the going price for rentals?
I'm working on my repair skills for a big account I got, but have a guy (installer for 26 years) that said he would come out for $45.00 for a patch... I'm thinking of subbing the work to him, just can't do it fast enough to make it worth my time. I sure will be watching and learning with every one he does though...
I'm working on my repair skills for a big account I got, but have a guy (installer for 26 years) that said he would come out for $45.00 for a patch... I'm thinking of subbing the work to him, just can't do it fast enough to make it worth my time. I sure will be watching and learning with every one he does though...
Marc Imbesi
Member
- Joined
- Dec 2, 2010
- Messages
- 204
sweendogg said:
I just dropped you down a few notches....didnt figure you a cookie type of guy...
BTW...KoolGlide is a must!
idreadnought
Supportive Member
I have several templates that I use. 4" 6" 8" and some rectangular ones. I could patch the carpet in those 4 places (if they fit my templates) in about 40 minutes or less. I use a Koolglide iron and would charge less than a hundred bucks for all of them. I paid big bucks for my templates, Ok, Ok, I got them all for about 10 bucks. I went to a metal fabricating and sales center and picked through their scrap pieces to find my templates made out of aluminum. EZ money
sweendogg
Member
Marc Imbesi said:
fair enough.. hand sewn patches on axeminster.. reweaving rugs.. guess thats just not enough!
Everytool has its place.. and on certain commercial grade level loops, the crain cookie cutter.. (the one longer made!) works beautifully. Otherwise I prefer mostly hand cut seems with non linear linesIf I can managage it..
Kool glide, hot iron, glue guns, knifes, row cutters, loop pile cutters.. you name it I have and have used it.
sweendogg
Member
Once you have put the patch together look between the lines to see if you have any gapping, ledging, or fibers stuck in the seem. And remember not matter how perfect you get it.. there is no such thing as an invisible seam. And also remember that cutpiles are going to be some of the hardest to seem up and make look descent.
If all looks good from the three points avoe, take your tucking tool or hawkbill and rubb it back and forth a few times.. trim the seam up with some duckbills to make sure the levels are equal, then tractor it well. it will blend in more as time goes on.
If all looks good from the three points avoe, take your tucking tool or hawkbill and rubb it back and forth a few times.. trim the seam up with some duckbills to make sure the levels are equal, then tractor it well. it will blend in more as time goes on.
talk about building confidence. I did my first insert with the customer watching. It was 45 out side and no heat on inside I was sweatin. Looked good. they were happy and I never looked back. the more i do the confident and better it looks. And you learn a little each time. Its fun.
Jack May
That Kiwi
Congrats on your first one!!
I hate the cookie cutter, or almost any aid tool for that matter.
I prefer to free hand cut, I have way more control on the finished product. and I'd go as far as saying a lot of my joins are invisile.
Having said that, I don't do repairs as an add on... it's my bread and butter and I'm doing them every day.
Repairs, re tufting, crush banding, de pilling(soon), pattern re alignment etc etc
A KG is a must, as is a good seam sealer.
John
I hate the cookie cutter, or almost any aid tool for that matter.
I prefer to free hand cut, I have way more control on the finished product. and I'd go as far as saying a lot of my joins are invisile.
Having said that, I don't do repairs as an add on... it's my bread and butter and I'm doing them every day.
Repairs, re tufting, crush banding, de pilling(soon), pattern re alignment etc etc
A KG is a must, as is a good seam sealer.
John
Jack May
That Kiwi
This is a repair I did recently. It was a rental property and the landlord instructed me to use the brand new off cut to repair this damage.
Ok, so the repair is visible, but only because of the colour variation. The joins are tight and uniform.
*************************************************
Getting back to the original question, in any service based business, once the initial service has covered your costs, then from there on, you should be simply working it out on time x your desired hourly rate. This doesn't mean you have to tell the client what you charge per hour, some people get funny with that (my Dr only charges $xx/hr) you can still per piece price it, just not as high. I aim for $135-160/hr for my first hour and $90-100/hr subsequent hours. Not cheap, but I'm efficient, and I save carpet. I assess each job before I take it on. Can I deliver a service that meets or exceds expectations before I commit.
I measure my jobs by a few factors.
1. will me repair work last as long as the remainder of the carpet?
2. would I be happy with that in my home?
3. can I leave my work invisible?
4. can I provide a service that is cost efficient?
The fist is a must meet criteria, otherwise I walk.
The other three are ideals that I strive for. But they don't always get met. Sometimes, you can't make your work invisible due to wear and or fade differences. Sometimes the client would prefer the original repaired because of the terms of their insurance policies so this is the better of the two options.
Two things that are paramount in personality for a good repair technician are:-
1. patience.
2. attention to detail/perfectionist.
If you can apply these few things I've listed here to your repair work, you will do well at it. Layers/installer generally HATE repair work. As a general rule. that comes about for two reasons, new goods are far more pliable and easier to work with but also they have been 'bred' with a contract mentality. As a result, they don't have the patience to sit there and get it right.
So, if you can portray yourself as a repair specialist, you will get a lot of referrals from the retailers and their layers.
Of course, you may simply want the skills to add on a service to your clientelle while in their home, BUT make sure that added service is not inferior to the level of service your client has come to expect with your cleaning. If the repairs are an ugly reminder of your work, they won't call you back for any of the work.
John
Ok, so the repair is visible, but only because of the colour variation. The joins are tight and uniform.
*************************************************
Getting back to the original question, in any service based business, once the initial service has covered your costs, then from there on, you should be simply working it out on time x your desired hourly rate. This doesn't mean you have to tell the client what you charge per hour, some people get funny with that (my Dr only charges $xx/hr) you can still per piece price it, just not as high. I aim for $135-160/hr for my first hour and $90-100/hr subsequent hours. Not cheap, but I'm efficient, and I save carpet. I assess each job before I take it on. Can I deliver a service that meets or exceds expectations before I commit.
I measure my jobs by a few factors.
1. will me repair work last as long as the remainder of the carpet?
2. would I be happy with that in my home?
3. can I leave my work invisible?
4. can I provide a service that is cost efficient?
The fist is a must meet criteria, otherwise I walk.
The other three are ideals that I strive for. But they don't always get met. Sometimes, you can't make your work invisible due to wear and or fade differences. Sometimes the client would prefer the original repaired because of the terms of their insurance policies so this is the better of the two options.
Two things that are paramount in personality for a good repair technician are:-
1. patience.
2. attention to detail/perfectionist.
If you can apply these few things I've listed here to your repair work, you will do well at it. Layers/installer generally HATE repair work. As a general rule. that comes about for two reasons, new goods are far more pliable and easier to work with but also they have been 'bred' with a contract mentality. As a result, they don't have the patience to sit there and get it right.
So, if you can portray yourself as a repair specialist, you will get a lot of referrals from the retailers and their layers.
Of course, you may simply want the skills to add on a service to your clientelle while in their home, BUT make sure that added service is not inferior to the level of service your client has come to expect with your cleaning. If the repairs are an ugly reminder of your work, they won't call you back for any of the work.
John
sweendogg
Member
This One..... BAD!!
This One... OK...
But really only works only on this:
Or this:
MOST of the time I say cookie cutter I refer to smaller patches... like I said and like John Middelton said.. hand cut patches tend to work a little better than seam cutting aides.. the above carpets tend to be the exception, though I will say I free hand all my seems and patches in C/A using a double cut.. But that is how you are supposed to cut that carpet.
This One... OK...
But really only works only on this:
Or this:
MOST of the time I say cookie cutter I refer to smaller patches... like I said and like John Middelton said.. hand cut patches tend to work a little better than seam cutting aides.. the above carpets tend to be the exception, though I will say I free hand all my seems and patches in C/A using a double cut.. But that is how you are supposed to cut that carpet.
Jack May
That Kiwi
For anyone doing repair work, spend a little money and get one of these babies.
http://www.dyson.co.nz/store/product.asp?product=DC31-ANIMAL
It's so quick and easy to tidy up after yourself once the repair is done. It's more convenient that grabbing teh full size vacuum from teh truck. It's also got a motorised head, that means I can run it aggressively over my joins and repairs to ensure they are not going to come loose after I leave. It also frees up any wispy tufts that may need trimming instead of them working out over time and leaving a hairy join on a patch.
Battery lasts me almost a week using it 2-3 times a day most days. I need to either get a spare battery or the 12 v charger because when it gets low, it dies suddenly. Their philosophy is a vacuum that works all the time, hence it stopping before it becomes ineffective.
John
http://www.dyson.co.nz/store/product.asp?product=DC31-ANIMAL
It's so quick and easy to tidy up after yourself once the repair is done. It's more convenient that grabbing teh full size vacuum from teh truck. It's also got a motorised head, that means I can run it aggressively over my joins and repairs to ensure they are not going to come loose after I leave. It also frees up any wispy tufts that may need trimming instead of them working out over time and leaving a hairy join on a patch.
Battery lasts me almost a week using it 2-3 times a day most days. I need to either get a spare battery or the 12 v charger because when it gets low, it dies suddenly. Their philosophy is a vacuum that works all the time, hence it stopping before it becomes ineffective.
John
sweendogg
Member
aheemmmm....
I kinda of like this one... I will admit ours was free.. but add this:
I can carry quite a few repair tools in the box as well.
I kinda of like this one... I will admit ours was free.. but add this:
I can carry quite a few repair tools in the box as well.
sweendogg
Member
And by Free I mean we were given it to test by Eureka Coorporation.
Jack May
That Kiwi
Nice concept... and with the addition of teh power head achieves a similar result.
You'd be surprised the number of comments I get about simply vacuuming once I'm done, obviously it's not the norm.
John
You'd be surprised the number of comments I get about simply vacuuming once I'm done, obviously it's not the norm.
John
sweendogg
Member
You are unfortunatly severely correct... When we finish and install and bring in a vacuum to do a final cleanup.. we have had customers about pass out on us. I have made way to many tips.. just from vacuuming after finishing up repair work or installations. :shock:
John Buxton
Member
- Joined
- Oct 18, 2006
- Messages
- 710
I just wanted to add that if you dont have a koolglide (like me) you can still use hot melt tape by using a damp towel and a steam iron on top of the patch.
sweendogg
Member
... I've never been able to get melt traditiona hot melt tape with steam.. you are a better man than I.
Jack May
That Kiwi
Niether, in fact, I'd be scared to try in on any olefin carpets :|
Do yourself a favour and borrow/hire a KG to experience for yourself what they are like. If you do repairs, it's a must have tool. it's be near the top of my must have list for a repair technician.
John
Do yourself a favour and borrow/hire a KG to experience for yourself what they are like. If you do repairs, it's a must have tool. it's be near the top of my must have list for a repair technician.
John
sweendogg
Member
Just be sure to pay the little extra for the Pro model over the "economy" version.
Shane T
Member
I remember hearing this, but what's the difference? I think Steve Andrews said the economy version can be retrofitted.sweendogg said:
sweendogg
Member
Shane T said:
Basically the Pro model allows you to use the hi med and low function which elongates the time the heating element is active. On thicker materials this can be useful to insure a strong bond.
Out of Character - 0
Member
sweendogg said:
Or burn a hole in the carpet as I've done 2 or 3 times.
